I was flying a routine flight this evening at an estimated 500' snapping photos and enjoying completely calm conditions (0mph wind speed). I was just cruising along and in a split second it was all coming down like a ton of bricks. $300 Pentax onboard and all. I was doing nothing but simply cruising around when the main wing folded and the EZ400G fell from the sky straight down. It impacted the ground with a tremendous force. The motor and gear box are ruined, prop broken, CF fuse broke off about 2'' where the motor used to be, landing gear mangled. The wing might be repairable although I don't know if I would ever trust it again. I am totally bummed out because I had an AP job lined up for tomorrow and was making all the preparations for the job tonight. I think NeSail should pay for this one. I can't believe the Pentax still works because when the plane impacted the camera went flying off about 20' away from the crash! I'm just glad I found the the thing. And believe it or not the AP pics that I took are not on the memory card??? Addionally, my $45 flight battery is nowhere to be found. I am so mad right now. I think it's time for a couple cold beers... If I do repair this wing it is going to have so much CF installed inside of it that it ought to be indestructable. EZ400G AP flyers be warned. FYI, This was probably abou the 100-150th flight and the main wing among other things were checked as ususal in my preflight inspection that I do before EVERY flight. The wing was in perfect condition before the flight...

Carnage pics attached...

Should I contact NeSail are do ya'll think it's a lost cause. My thinking is anytime a plane wing folds in flight (or some other catastrophic failure in flight) and the plane is being flown in calm flying weather and not being abused there must be some sort of design flaw. Thoughts...

Originally Posted by flytowner

I was flying a routine flight this evening at an estimated 500' snapping photos and enjoying completely calm conditions (0mph wind speed). I was just cruising along and in a split second it was all coming down like a ton of bricks. $300 Pentax onboard and all. I was doing nothing but simply cruising around when the main wing folded and the EZ400G fell from the sky straight down.

Carnage pics attached...

If i were closer, i'd loan you My EZ400 for tomorrow, alas, i'm not anywhere near. I really feel bad about the loss, but i do thank you for letting us all know so quickly, so we can check, recheck, and 'hopefully' not fold a wing, though as you said, you'd checked, and still something let go.

Man, that just plain sucks. It's one thing when we loose a plane due to our own failings (flying in high winds, heavy weights, aerobatics etc) but to just have it fold.....well....we're sorry.

Steve

man that is a true bummer im sorry it had to happen the day before an AP job session. looks like your buisness might be on hold for awhile... my condolences to you and the plane. you should be happy because the camera still works. this event brings up the concern for all us APer's that this could happen to us any time. we just dont think it will, but lack of fear is whats the problem. this isnt so in your case though because you check yours before the flight. was the crash a straight into the ground, no drag at all from the wing kind of crash? where it broke looks like it might have provided some drag to cushion the fall. hopefully you can get back most of your parts and get back on the horse so to speak. good luck and sorry again about your terrible misfortune.

Kyle

Originally Posted by flytowner

Should I contact NeSail are do ya'll think it's a lost cause. My thinking is anytime a plane wing folds in flight (or some other catastrophic failure in flight) and the plane is being flown in calm flying weather and not being abused there must be some sort of design flaw. Thoughts...

is NeSail the company who makes this plane? im not familiar with it so i dont know but if it is then i dont think complaining will work. adding the additional weight of a camera voids the warrenty so to speak so i dont think contacting them will help. but you said over 100 flights on this wing, i think that so many flights will wear our the balsa in the wings and eventually fail. if it were me i wouldnt trust the balsa at all as my only means of holding the wing together. balsa isnt very strong (it could be if designed properly) but i would add some major reinforment next time like you said, carbon fiber.

Flytowner,

Sorry to hear about your loss, your equipment setup has inspired several of us. (Hopefully you're enjoying those cold beers).

I've got one of these on the way, now I'm thinking about stripping of the covering and doing shear webs.

Agree with Kyle that Nesail could argue you were flying over the design weight. Are those top and bottom spars balsa not spruce? If so, I'm definitely stripping the covering.

-Andre

Originally Posted by Kyle G.

is NeSail the company who makes this plane? im not familiar with it so i dont know but if it is then i dont think complaining will work. adding the additional weight of a camera voids the warrenty so to speak so i dont think contacting them will help. but you said over 100 flights on this wing, i think that so many flights will wear our the balsa in the wings and eventually fail. if it were me i wouldnt trust the balsa at all as my only means of holding the wing together. balsa isnt very strong (it could be if designed properly) but i would add some major reinforment next time like you said, carbon fiber.

Actually, I think there is alot of spruce inside the wing structure as well for additional strength. Unfortunately, everything broke, spruce and balsa. Does anybody know where to purchase special CF pieces (like square pieces in length)? My personal experience is that 100 flights shouldn't be bad at all on the balsa and spruce. I have other planes with 400 plus flights on the original balsa airframe. I don't think the 4oz Optio would have much affect on the airframe but who knows about these freak things that happen sometimes?

,Lewis

Originally Posted by StevenRC

If i were closer, i'd loan you My EZ400 for tomorrow, alas, i'm not anywhere near. I really feel bad about the loss, but i do thank you for letting us all know so quickly, so we can check, recheck, and 'hopefully' not fold a wing, though as you said, you'd checked, and still something let go.

Man, that just plain sucks. It's one thing when we loose a plane due to our own failings (flying in high winds, heavy weights, aerobatics etc) but to just have it fold.....well....we're sorry.

Steve

Thanks Steve, You can still pack up the loaner EZ400 and overnight it though right?

I was in the process of purchasing a complete backup EZ400G just for this situation but never got around to it so, I am on the market for another EZ400G if anyone wants to get rid of theirs or knows someone that does. I still think it's almost the perfect AP platform plane but needs some mods to accomodate the extra load. Lots of CF in the main wing and pylon reinforcements.

Originally Posted by andre

I've got one of these on the way, now I'm thinking about stripping of the covering and doing shear webs.

I think andre hit the nail on the head!... From looking at your unfortunate carnage pics there is NO sheer web linking the top and bottom main spars!... What kind of design is that?!?!... At the least, 1/16" balsa (grain running vertical - from top to bottom) should be the length between every wing rib on the front and back of the main spars connecting the two together for the minimum length of the wing to the polyhedral... I'd do the whole wing... This makes the perfectly light but ultra-strong box spar that will not fail unless you step on it, and maybe, not even then... IMO that design was doomed to fail whether you had extra weight on it or not...

Another sheer web is the "I-beam"... One sheer web in the middle between the two spars in every wing bay...

I'm not understanding the reasons that electric manufacturers are making supposed "trainer" aircraft without proper design built-in for it... Even the venerable SS is a disaster waiting to happen without the modest modifications that are prescribed on the eZone... I never saw a shoddy designed slimer trainer when I was learning... The only ones that failed in flight were ones not properly repaired after a crash, and even that was rare because the designs allowed for some deviations... I do understand the need or want of making things lightweight, but not if it means at the expense of my radio gear, motor, batteries, and in our case - cameras... Their designers should be made to stand under their airplanes which are flying full-throttle straight down at them when full up elevator is applied at a 100' feet overhead... If they'll document that, I'll buy their airplane - if it's suitable for AP, of course...

Feel free to use all or part of this in your correspondence with the NES people...

Watt Noise?
Kevin

Wow, this is unbelievable.

I was thinking about just using the EZ400G wing on my SS, since the SS fuse is so easy to attach things to and no pylon to worry about. The EZ wing seemed to be the one thing that didn't need to be modded.

Unreal. Very scary to think it happened without any apparent reason. I've flown so many times in unretrievable places like canyons where something like this would have meant complete loss of everything.

Looks like your tail feathers are fine. Why not just get a SS fuse (they cost $3), mount the tail feathers on it, strip the covering off the wing and rebuild it. Make it the "bionic wing" with CF and you're set.


UNBELIEVABLE the Optio survived that crash! I think it just won "most durable AP cam".

I feel for you bud. Just rebuild and get on with it. It'll be stronger the next time around.

Wow, that really sucks. Sorry to hear that. At least you got your camera back in working order. Based on your business post, I purchased one of these and a Nikon 3700. I have about 3 flights on it so far. I really reinforced this plane. Starting with the fuselage. I have vertical poplar wood supports in the weak areas. I have added 3 thin wooden dolls down the length of the CF shaft from the fuselage to the tail because the tail twisted so much, I used steel wire and wraped it tightly around the CF shaft from the fuselage to the motor mount and covered it with epoxy, I reinforced the vertical tail at the base with wood strips, I wire tied the landing gear and epoxied over it, but with all of this I did nothing with the main wing. It really looks strong, so I am not concerned. I do have 1" CF tape that I could put on it, but I am no good at covering wings. If I can get 5+ photo shoots for cutomers, I have enough money to pay for any loss I may experience. But all of the complaints about this plane does make me wonder if the good old reliable Slow Stick should of stayed in my photo hanger. Good Luck on the recovery back into the business.

Wow, sorry about your plane. How can a wing just snap like that? Could someone have shot it?

-GP

See:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=15

or

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=77

regarding shear webs. I was asked on the first thread if all these mods are "necessary". Well, unfortunately so. Until now, I considered them precautionary and I hate to see evidence that they are required.

When I stripped these wings to do the 1/32 ply shear webs, I re-glued all the joints with CA. Quite a few of them needed it - and the wing had never been flown. The spars are spruce but everything else is balsa (except maybe the leading edge). I have one of mine set up for struts, but seldom use them because of the transport pain. See here for the prototype - I have since inserted the mount tabs in the wing:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=60

Here is an excellent article on beefing up a wing with the spar orientation of the EZ400 with carbon tape and kevlar thread.

http://members.aol.com/laserarts2/carbonwing.html

I really hate this has happened to you, FlyTowner. I have learned to much from you - and I had my first "paid" mission this week (although not yet actually paid) partly because of your lead. Good thing you were not over something like an industrial building or a busy road when it happened. I will be paranoid, now, for a long time.

Based on my own experience - I suspect the spar was cracked in handling/transport. That wing is a big thing to carry - I am constantly bumping it into things on the way to the truck. Seems impossible to "ground check" these things.

I hope Sal will at least give you a break on a new wing - but I suspect you will modify it some before trusting it again - I would. The fuse/pylon is easily built from an arrow shaft.

Meanwhile, I really hope we can find a better designed alternative. I am still waiting for a reply from QuietRiot about the PhotoStick wing. I am also hoping someone will do a kit of something like Bar-Stool's under-cambered camera wing. There must be some glider technology we can put to work here. I don't think heavy modification of an ARF is the best path.

Tom

I feel your pain. That really bites. I agree with you about adding CF in the wing. I think anything with a large CF spar can survive most anything.

Randy