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Old May 19, 2004, 06:58 PM
R U killing the kittens?
artmonster's Avatar
Chaos, UC
Joined Jun 2003
1,585 Posts
Building from 3-views?

Any good places to go to learn techniques on building from 3-views.

to tell you the truth.....Im a bit stumped on how to start.

I'd like to build foam slopers from 3-views.....but I just stare at them and wonder what to do next.

any tips and/or techniques pages for people wanting to learn how???

...now I feel a bit dumb.....
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Old May 19, 2004, 07:18 PM
Blue Stick's Dad
Brian Koester's Avatar
Westchester, Ca
Joined May 2003
1,007 Posts
I use 3 views from the Internet. I bring them into an illustration program or a page layout program and draw a new line overtop of the 3 view that I've imported. Now is an excellent time to start thinking about things that help later. Like if you can import in the root wing profile, you can build it right into your drawing and when you cut it out of foam it'll fit like a glove. Also you can make sure that the decalage is at 0-0. Be sure to use thin lines because when you blow up the drawing the lines get thicker too. Then print out your drawing and take it to Kinkos or some place that has a large format xerox machine. Kinkos has on that goes 36" or so wide by whatever long. Set it to whatever enlargement you want and presto—full size plans. Mount those on a piece of 1/4 hardboard and cut it out and you now have a template for a bandsaw.
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Old May 19, 2004, 07:23 PM
No fuse too fat
slopeiron's Avatar
USA, CA, Redondo Beach
Joined Apr 2002
3,895 Posts
The best way I've found is to blow up the side and top views at Kinko's and trace them onto a chunk of urethane foam. There is a little more info in this thread:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=222175

Hack off the big pieces with a handsaw and shape what's left down to your marks. After that, it's just a matter of beveling down the corners evenly, then finally rounding off the corners. Glass, fill, sand smooth then paint with scratch filler primer, wetsand and you've got your plug. How's that for a super condensed course on plug building.

Russ.
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Old May 19, 2004, 07:29 PM
No fuse too fat
slopeiron's Avatar
USA, CA, Redondo Beach
Joined Apr 2002
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BTW, you can also take a look at my website, here:

http://www.ferminslopeships.com/slop...plug/plug.html

I fully documented the building of my 109 plug. It was built from Dave Platt's plans, but maybe there will be something helpful there. Be sure to check the links under the 'Plug Details' section. It got to be too much material, so I divided it up into subsections.

Russ.
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Old May 19, 2004, 07:37 PM
It could happen...
InTheLift's Avatar
Torrance, California
Joined Jan 2004
7,537 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by seafury_fb11
BTW, you can also take a look at my website, here:

http://www.ferminslopeships.com/slop...plug/plug.html

I fully documented the building of my 109 plug. It was built from Dave Platt's plans, but maybe there will be something helpful there. Be sure to check the links under the 'Plug Details' section. It got to be too much material, so I divided it up into subsections.

Russ.
Lotta work there. Looks like a rewarding project though. One possible soruce for plans might be peanut scale plans? Not sure, but it seems like you might be able to enlarge them to the size you want to build a plug like you have done on your site Russ? I only mention peanut scale (free flight rubber powered models) because there are some plans online you can download free...and free is good.
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Old May 19, 2004, 09:51 PM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,091 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by artmonster
I'd like to build foam slopers from 3-views.....but I just stare at them and wonder what to do next.
By "foam" I am going to take it that you mean EPP, right?

My very first scratchbuild project, the Waco CG-4A, was exactly as you describe. Going from 3-views is a great plan and a LOT of fun. You have a couple of options, with Brian Koester's being a great suggestion (re-tracing the 3-view lines in a vector drawing program so that they can be zoomed up to scale). Russ's option works well too, but it ends up making your lines really thick because they'll be zoomed up from tiny size. That can make your work less accurate if you're not careful. I'd like to expand on that, if I a may...

1) First off, decide what size wingspan you want to build your model at. This can be dictated by a number of factors including what size radio gear you have on hand (or are willing to purchase), how big your car is, etc.

2) After deciding the wingspan, take into account that most PSS subjects benefit from the slight elongation of their wingspans, and sometimes parts of their fuselages, in order to make them better gliders. This means that you'll actually want to model your subject at a smaller scale than a direct downscaling of the fullsize plane would dictate, and then scale the wings (and perhaps fuse length) UP to accomodate your desired wingspan.

Example:

The fullsize P-51D Mustang has a ~37ft. wing and a ~32ft. fuselage.

In 1/10 scale, that would produce a model with a 44.4" (37ft./10 = 3.7ft. x 12in. to a foot = 44.4") wing and a 38.4" (32ft./10 = 3.2ft. x 12in. to a foot = 38.4") fuse.

However, to make this a better glider, maybe you want to scale up the wingspan of your 1/10 scale glider to 48" and the fuse length to 40" (for example). If you look at the dimensions of most commercially available warbird-style PSSers, you'll see they almost all do this to some degree or another.

3) Once you've got the above figured out, go to your 3-view and, using a drawing program as Brian K. described, scale up your drawing so that it can be printed out at full size. Mainly you are only concerned about the side and top views of the fuselage here, the wing will be whatever you end up deciding in terms of wingspan and taper (most PSS warbirds have pretty simple single tapered wings)

4) Print out your drawings in sections using your home printer. Cut out these drawings, tape them together, and then pin them on top of a hunk of EPP.

5) Cut out the side and top profiles using a hand saw, bandsaw (preferred) or whatever, then shape to your heart's content.

6) Get some wing cores cut, buy some balsa, basswood and hardware, and you've got yourself a kit. Have at it!!!

See, that wasn't so bad, was it? It's easy, fun, and super pleasureable. Enjoy!

Steve
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Old May 19, 2004, 10:47 PM
No fuse too fat
slopeiron's Avatar
USA, CA, Redondo Beach
Joined Apr 2002
3,895 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by surfimp
By "foam" I am going to take it that you mean EPP, right?
Yikes. My bad. I just quickly skimmed over the original post and missed the part about artmonster wanting to build "foam" slopers from 3-views.

Russ.
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Old May 19, 2004, 10:53 PM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,091 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by seafury_fb11
Yikes. My bad. I just quickly skimmed over the original post and missed the part about artmonster wanting to build "foam" slopers from 3-views.
But your advice, with the exception of the glassing part, is the same thing as I wrote, I just spelled out the details a bit more

Steve
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Old May 19, 2004, 10:57 PM
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hellcatman's Avatar
So. California
Joined Jan 2004
110 Posts
Steve has the right idea. A very good program to do the drawing in is ModelCAD. It's a 2D cad program that sells for about $55.00 and you can download it. That is exactly how I built the Challenge ME 109. The amount of detail that you can get is only limited by how much time you put into it. Attacted is a jpg of the ME 109 drawings I did from tracing around a 3 view I downloaded for free.

Rich
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Old May 20, 2004, 12:06 AM
R U killing the kittens?
artmonster's Avatar
Chaos, UC
Joined Jun 2003
1,585 Posts
Sweet....You guys rock.

I do have a lot of design software...Im a design junky......as I have my own graphic/print/web business here in Colorado.

Check out ArtMonster Design Arts if youre intersted at all.

I have design Cad 3D MaX ...but I am a lot better at throwing things together in Illustrator....just much more familiar....but working in Cad more as its more geared toward accuracy.

I just didnt know where to start in the process of taking a three view and turning it into a fuse/wing combo.....

And yes...EPP is my material of choice here in the Mtns...Our LZ's are pretty chunky/rocky....EPP is pretty much my insurance for a multiple flights I want to get into glass ships, but I dont think they would survive as long where I fly...or actually land....We fly crunchy thermal ships....but stop breathing during our approaches...hehe

Anyway....thanks for pointing me in the right direction.....I cant thank everyone enough here in the forums for info...its priceless.....I love how you can just throw a question out in the air, and you get responses that help you on your way....

I have a lot of three views.....I just need to S*** or get off the pot...and start my first scratch built warbird......just need to choose which one.

My dad flew A-4's in VietNam......that would be cool...but Im a little weary about flying delta wing slope ships........I always loved the WWII HellDiver.....what a mean machine.......*whirr......*bzzzzz........"must make decision".......
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Old May 20, 2004, 12:31 AM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,091 Posts
Illustrator will be perfect. Just open up your 3-view, trace the outline of the side and top profiles with your pen, ditch the 3-view, rescale your canvas and paths to whatever size you need, stroke 'em (the paths!!), print and you're in "bidness"

Steve
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Old May 20, 2004, 12:38 AM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
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Oh, and as for first-time projects...remember to choose something with a decent glider-like planform. The AT-6 is not a good choice, in other words; how will you ever get enough lead in the short little nose to balance it? (Ask TAWG all about this LOL)

Straight-winged jets can often be good, especially the early ones or the more modern trainers from various international locales. The F-14/F-15/F-18s seem like they're tough to get flying nice, from what I've read (at least if you want them to remain even reasonably scale). More sailplane-like planforms (i.e. WARBIRDS) generally seem to have the most satisfying performance, from what I've read.

Of course, you could always do a real combat glider...CG-4A, Horsa, Hotspur, Hamilcar, DFS-230, Me-321 Gigant...they need little/no modification to fly well! I should know, I've built two off that list...so far

Steve
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Old May 20, 2004, 03:25 AM
Blue Stick's Dad
Brian Koester's Avatar
Westchester, Ca
Joined May 2003
1,007 Posts
Avoid delta wings. VERY difficult to cut them without the tip area over burning the foam and deforming the airfoil. Plus I've never seen one fly better than just floating along
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Old May 20, 2004, 03:56 AM
Crikey never leave beer behind
steve wenban's Avatar
Mt Annan Sydney Australia
Joined Dec 2003
23,424 Posts
here's a link to nearly all the 3views you will ever need
http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Gallery/Graphics/index.html
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Old May 20, 2004, 08:43 AM
Dunetop Flyer
jcarstan's Avatar
Cape Cod, Mass., USA
Joined Dec 2002
797 Posts
Excellent topic. When I shaped my Do-335 fuselage I was fortunate to have the cross section templates for various fuselage points. If the 3 views don't show the cross sections, how do you make templates to shape the fuselage to make the airplane look like the original?

Jan
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