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Old May 04, 2004, 07:43 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
speed wing 400 epilogue

Hi,
for those who followed my thread bout the speed wing 400 problem I musta say that Fate having tried to recover it properly and check the cg and the general flights settings I crashed once again, for the last time actually since I broke the motor mount. fortunately my girlfriend is out of town and allow myself to buy another kit of the same wing because I love this wing ( I haven't had the pleasure to fly it yet but I love the design).
ANyway this another request for help because I want to tryto avoid the previous frastruations.
So I would like the flying wing pilots to help me figure out what happened so that I can make sure it will not happen again.
To sysnthsize here is what happened:
speed wing 400, with 25 amp castle creation, zagi pusher motor, 8 cells 1050 kan and gws receiver. The wing was flying straight out of my hand and then, as soon as I touched the controls would just dive a nd loose any control,
I am asking you here to help me figure ANY possible hypothesis.
Thank you very much.
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Old May 04, 2004, 07:52 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
I have forgotten to tell you all the excluded possibilities.
First of all, the center of gravity has been checked over and over and it was right even though I noticed that the wing would behave little bit better when the cg was moved forward, lwhen the wing was nose heavy but that did not really solve the main problem.
Second the controls were right as well, in my transmitter and in terms of control throws of the ailerons. Connected to that another particular I noticed before crashing for the last time was that the when I touche dthe controls the wing before diving was actaully doing rolls.
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Old May 04, 2004, 08:01 AM
Registered User
Clinton, Maryland
Joined Oct 2002
426 Posts
Why don't you just get another keel?
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Old May 04, 2004, 08:37 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomegun
Why don't you just get another keel?
because the wing was impossible to fly.
So far the only idea I have is that one of the half wing was warped and that could affect the flight.
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Old May 04, 2004, 09:02 AM
Time To Fly?
gobigdale's Avatar
Gig Harbor, WA
Joined May 2002
712 Posts
do you think your elevator could have been reversed? Usually the first thing I do after I toss a wing is apply elevator. If yours is diving to the ground maybe the elevator is reversed.
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Old May 04, 2004, 09:28 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
No the ailerons were up , a tiny bit more than neutral. The evidence for that was that the wing would climb everytime very solid. ANd apparently, when I was touching the control the ailerons were behaving normally. Everytime I crashed I cheked and the ailerons were working just fine.
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Old May 04, 2004, 10:03 AM
Time To Fly?
gobigdale's Avatar
Gig Harbor, WA
Joined May 2002
712 Posts
Well build another one. Got a buddy that could possibly help next time? I still have my flying buddies look over a new plane before I toss it in the air for the first time. It is amazing what we miss sometimes in the rush and excitement to get a new plane in the air.

If not do take some pictures this time.

Take care,
Dale
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Old May 04, 2004, 10:47 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
Unfortunately I am a graduate student in a stupid college town. there are not so many undergrads that cultivate this great hobby! Maybe I'm wrong to define this city (Iowa city) stupid but for sure it is solely concentrated on "alchool hobbies", I am actually considered quite a freak for doing this stuff.
Sorry for this unrelated ventilation, no the answer is that I don't know anybody involved in the same activity. I will try to take some photos.
Can you suggest which stages of the work should I focus on in terms of posting pictures?
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Old May 04, 2004, 11:04 AM
Time To Fly?
gobigdale's Avatar
Gig Harbor, WA
Joined May 2002
712 Posts
Man that sucks, Well I am usually on the computer 10 hours a day. Just take a few at each step at different angles. The main things to show will be cores glued together straight, the the CF Tape applied using wing beds to insure no warping, covering remember to use low heat and the tip of the iron, movement of elevons in different dirrections, etc.. Another thing to pay attention to is control surface movement and the radio settings. Do the control surfaces move the same distance? What are your ATV and EXPO settings. Are you using DUAL RATES? What Radio are you using?

whew lots of questions.
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Old May 04, 2004, 11:32 AM
PWP!
ajroahkni's Avatar
USA, HI, Makawao
Joined Oct 2002
3,911 Posts
When you first set things up, did you do a range check? You know - antenna down, 75 ft away, checking control surface response w/ or w/out varying levels of throttle.

Maybe you're glitching out because you need some capacitators on the can. Also, how did you route your RX antenna? "Noise" from the motor may be disrupting your transmission, making the plane do wierd things on throttle (like nose in as soon as you give some control).

John
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Old May 04, 2004, 11:45 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobigdale
Man that sucks, Well I am usually on the computer 10 hours a day. Just take a few at each step at different angles. The main things to show will be cores glued together straight, the the CF Tape applied using wing beds to insure no warping, covering remember to use low heat and the tip of the iron, movement of elevons in different dirrections, etc.. Another thing to pay attention to is control surface movement and the radio settings. Do the control surfaces move the same distance? What are your ATV and EXPO settings. Are you using DUAL RATES? What Radio are you using?

whew lots of questions.
I will do that. to answer your questions. First of all I made sure the control surface had the same excursion. To talk about the radio I have the cheap focus 3 channels. I know that is not the best at all but it allowed me to have fun with flying wings a great deal. I flew with that an xe2 succesfully and even a twitchy msw250 was under my control. SO I doubt it was a tx problem.
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Old May 04, 2004, 11:51 AM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajroahkni
When you first set things up, did you do a range check? You know - antenna down, 75 ft away, checking control surface response w/ or w/out varying levels of throttle.

Maybe you're glitching out because you need some capacitators on the can. Also, how did you route your RX antenna? "Noise" from the motor may be disrupting your transmission, making the plane do wierd things on throttle (like nose in as soon as you give some control).

John
John,
I first of all did route the antenna, it was quite far from the motor. the motor ZAGI PUSHER HAS ALREADY 2 capacitors. I always check range. To talk about glitching it seems to me quite weird as well thaan the wing everytime , after having tossed it, would react in the same way, first turn and roll rapidly then dive and hit the ground. I mean in my experience the glitching your talking about would be more random in its effects.
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Old May 04, 2004, 02:39 PM
Time To Fly?
gobigdale's Avatar
Gig Harbor, WA
Joined May 2002
712 Posts
http://12.45.56.6/~birdworks/focus.html

This might help the twitchyness (i dont think that is a word, but oh well).
I bought the parts to do mine but have not got around to it yet.

Dale
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Old May 04, 2004, 02:51 PM
ViruTs
Denver
Joined Mar 2004
773 Posts
thank you for the information that is a good idea.
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Old May 04, 2004, 03:54 PM
"I passed on the kool-aid"
Waco, TX
Joined Jan 2004
3,884 Posts
I had a similar problem the other day.

I was using a 6 channel GWS rx on a 24" J250 powered wing. Upon advancing the throttle past 3/4 the elevons would both pitch down. I added a capacitor and moved the ESC, Rx, and motor as far apart as possible and this solved my problem. Can you even do a glide test? Are the controls behaving erratically even with the motor off?
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