Rave longer aerobird challenger flying time

[Wingtips24]

When you say move the CG forward are you meaning the battery? that is the only thing in the plane that seems movable so I have been shifting it back and forward. It just dawned on me that it might be something else I should be moving. I flew yesterday and I can confirm that I think for the most part I have the pourposing thing under control. I was in a beautiful baseball field, I really like that as a place to fly, very even feild with low grass and decent take off area. I also tried creating a shim and that worked too. I forgot about the tail loostening and tightening. I remember that from the video I got with the plane. I had epoxied my tail in place to make it more sturdy. Looks like I will have to pry it up so i can use the screws again.

I plan to get the E Starter but I was also checking out the T-52. You heard much about that, I really like that it seems so hard to kill the thing. I think I may aim to have 2 or 3 planes with their own set of stuff and this one seems pretty cool. What do you think of it. Ever flown one or seen one flown befor.

Don't think I have heard of the airr hogg b4. Is it a pusher plane. I also realized that 10 -15 minutes of CONSTANT flight is a while. I pretty much stayed up in the air yesterday so I was ready for a quick stop after that plus the bugs were annoying me. I also remember hearing something about preparing the motor when you get one. Does " setting the motor" ring a bell, what is that about and do you need to do that with the SS or just better quality motors? Cant wait to get the ABC

[Ken-Ohki]

CG changes are most often done with the battery back, But it is not the only way, shaving or adding weight is another. or moving the reciver if all else fails,, Sometimes you can slide the wing forward or backward also.

I have not flown a T-52. From what I just read, Its too much plane for a beginer. Learn the SS and the E_starter before you start to look at other planes,, by then you will know more of what you want, and select something completly different im sure.

I have 2 friends ( Honestly, I even have more then 2 ) But These 2 friends have failed to head my advice and learn on a docile cheap plane. One has crashed over 3000 in Quarterscale planes in the last 40 days or so. He insista on trying to fly these monster planes that are way beyond his ability. I think he thinks it being bigger will help him fly better.. to some extent he is right,, but It isnt that simple. ( all glow ) One even at my hands ( a p-51 ) but it was his faulty gear instalation that was to blame for its loss.. The other friend has totaled a ABX beyond even my ability to repair, as well as done seriouse dammage to his ABC 4 times now, Im not sure how many more times I can rebuild it. But for the acidents its been in, its increadable that it still flys like new. he has also destroyed and or lost 4 other arfs from flying downwind against advice, flying in more wind then he could handle, and flat out doing stpid things like pushing forward on the stick to go up and sending it nose first into the pavement. DONT be like them. DOnt be impatient. Learn what the simple plane has to teach...DOnt make the mistake and think . Well, this plane will make me a better pilot becuse it has more stock capabilities.. Truth is,, if you dont understand those capabilities..You are in trouble. Once you get that SS in the air, You will love it and you will Understand why the SS has such a huge loyal following. ;p


Airhogs are toys, Most of them suck, I will only endorse 1, and that is the little red twin motor one, very small, but cool as hell.. I cant remember if it is the intruder or defender or intercepter,, But it is the only red twin they make i know of, and it is available at walmart for 29 bucks. I have installed 4 cell batterys into mine instead of the stock 3 cell ones, Gives it allot more authority in the wind, and will fly reasonably controlable in 10 - 15 mph winds. It is not a pusher.

SO far, I have not broken in any of my motors, I am not convinced you need to, I have yet to burn one out. I dont see any real harm in it, provided you break it in right,, dry it right and then reoil it properly.. I am no the person to talk to about breaking in motors.also as I understand it, you can time or tune the motors for better preformance, however this is also not my area of expertize.

Ken-Ohki

" I make things do what I want them to. The hell with what they are designed to do."

[Wingtips24]

Ken

I will heed your advice and I will not rush it. The main reason for the T-52 questions was because I heard it was so indestructable and so far on my learner planes I have done so much repair, I thought this may be a good trainer but more durable then some of the ones I have tried thus far. I wanted a cheap east to learn of indestructable plane I could crash as I learned and it seemed like a "Volvo " of the skies so I wanted to inquire about it. If it is too much of a plane then I am not nterested I just thought it might fly like the SS but not be easy to break.

It is hard to be patient but I will trust your advice and not be one of the stories you need to tell folks about trying to coax yet another ambitious flyer to cool his jets before they get cool by the ground. Well come on SS then. I will focus my attention on building one of those and you can trust that if I refer to oter planes it is for facination reason and for the desire and hope of ONE DAY flying something like that, Hee hee! I am not looking to loose money so I can wait.

Cant wait to fly the SS or the ABC , got a few things to pay for, just went to the dentist today to have start a root canaled so there goes some of my funds for a while since it's like 3 visits ouch!

BTW can you do barrel rolls with your ABC? the video doesn't show much by the way of it's capabilities

[Ken-Ohki]

It is good that you understand the "dont rush it" advice. I have at least 3 planes here that dont fly,, not becuse they cant, becuse I bought to dam many at once,, went on a new plane a week thing for awile hehehe. FOrtunatly I can afford to do so Now I am trying to break even with the other stuff mentioned to get them all in the air.
Dreaming and or drooling over new/other planes is fine. Some things to look for in beginer planes are planes that have low wing loading, ( large wing surface area and low weight ). Planes that have diheadral. ( that shallow V shape the wing has when viewed from front or back.) Planes with diheadral are for the most part self correcting. That is if you let go the stick it will return itself to pretty much level flight. However diheadral will work against you wile trying to roll or fly inverted. After you get more experienced, you will look for planes that do not have diheadral. When you look for planes that will handle wind you start to look for speed and high wing loading.

The ABC will roll . It does like a corkscrew roll with much practice. And only if the control surfaces are set to max throw, and you are in pro mode. Planes with ailerons generaly use them for roll controll, Planes that do not can still roll, its just harder and not as tight/pretty. to roll without ailerons, From level flight, at full power, ( with some altitude under you ) give full left or right stick. the plane will nose up a little as it starts its turn then the nose will fall as it begins to roll & turn. after the plane has rolled about 90 degrees apply full down elevator until the plane comes out the other side after another 180 degrees of roll release the down elevator and feed in some up elevator. It takes some practice for sure, But is possible. This will roll most planes that lack ailerons. The SS will also roll the same way. Its kinda important to remember that both the ABC and SS are NOT stunt planes. However they can prform basic manuvers, Loops, inverted, Outside loops are possible but very tricky. stalls, and a few other things are also possible.

Ken-Ohki

" I make things do what I want them to. The hell with what they are designed to do."

[npm]

Please describe the control input sequence to make the ABC do an outside loop. I have tried but have not been able to achieve anything but a very steep dive.

[Ken-Ohki]

Originally Posted by npm

Please describe the control input sequence to make the ABC do an outside loop. I have tried but have not been able to achieve anything but a very steep dive.

Sounds like you are trying to enter the manuver at the top of the loop from straight and level flight by just pushing down, Ihave not been able to enter a outside loop from that position, and feel the bird dosent have enough down authority to simply force it into a outside loop, you have to set up for it, get the plane into the right position. It helps allot if your bird is capable of inverted flight. If you cant fly inverted, I dont think you will be able to ouside loop. My ABC has been modifyed a little in the tail to allow for extra throw.

The only way I can outside loop my ABC is to bring it up high, and dive it to gain speed, Usualy over 100 of steep dive. I judge speed by the sound of air ripping over my wings, It is kinda loud and definitly stressing structual limitations when ya pull back into a loop. At the top of the loop, I push he nose over with down elivater to halt the loop and sustain the inverted position. I allow it to fly like this for several yards to re-establish speed, usualy diving a little ( inverted ) to help gain speed, then push full down elivator and watch it go around. Very often I will fail at this menuver, but I have done it enough to prove it isnt just fluke. Speed is Key. Being able to loop without falling off left or right into a abortion cork screw thing is also super important to being able to pull this off. I did not try to outside loop before i modifyed the tail. I am not sure if it will. It definitly helps to be facing into the wind to do it, SO that measn you have to start your loop runing with the wind so at the top you are facing into the wind when you are inverted.

Making the ABC do the corkscrew barrel roll is challenging too. its taken some time to get that manuver down.

Ken-Ohki

"I make things do what I want them to, The hell with what they were designed to do."

[guy5927]

Ken,

How exactly did you modify your ABC to get more throw ?

thanks

Guy

[Ken-Ohki]

Originally Posted by guy5927

Ken,

How exactly did you modify your ABC to get more throw ?

thanks

Guy

there are 4 basic methods of gaining more control surface autority.

1: Move the control horns foward tward the hindge on the tail. This will let the horn move the tail surface more for the same amount of servo throw. Take a razor knife and slice the tail from the horn tward the hindge, Move the horn. Make sure the horns are in the same place on both sides. Epoxy the horns back in place and use a combination of epoxy and packing tape to reinforce the old hole and your slice. I find this the best way to go, but of course, not the only way.

2 Add a new hole lower on the control horn. Take a small drill bit, or something you can make a small hole with and add a hole below the lowest one. This will also give more movement on the tail. However a few have said they have broken ther control horn becuse drilling that hole weakins it too much,, I think they just made to big a hole,, if A hole just big enough to pass the string is made, dead center on the horn, you will be allright.

3 Replace the control horns. Use horns from another plane in place of the stock ones, they will allow you to mount the strings even closer to the tail then if you made a hole as in method 2. If you employ this methoud you will have to rig a custom mount for the rubber bands underneat,, almost anthing will work as long as the mounts are placed in the same place on each wing to make sure they pull even.

4 Enlarge the control surfaces. This , In my opinion is the worst way to achieve your goal. there are 2 ways to achieve this. First, Take a pair of scisors. from the left or right outside edge, cut tward the hindgeline so the nonemovable section is cut off into a section as wide as the flap. Use packing tape to make a new hindge, and a section of toothpick and epoxy to reinforce the conection between the old flap and the new section of flap, and make sure they move together. Do the same to the other side.
the other way to enlarge the control surfaces are to either add a section onto the exsisting flaps with glue and tape OR, cut the exsiting flaps out and install 1 section flaps that are larger. and attach with packing tape hindges. Almost anthing that is Thin, light, not to flexable and that the tape will stick good to is useable. Sections of credit card, Balsa, laminated styrofoam plates ( chinetts ) or whatever.

Have suggested the 4 methods I feel worth mentioning, I will state this. Yes, There are other ways, Yes, there are drawbacks not listed. Yes, I know not everyone has had possitve results modifying ther ABC tail.

I used the 4th suggestion, both ways. both ways worked, cutting tail and making the surface full tail lengh was the best of the 2, and looked the most factory.
Then I used the second suggestion, That also worked well, But ultimatly, the first suggestion is the one curently installed on my plane and in my opinion, working the best.
Suggestion 1 and 3 can be combined for even more movement, but I dont think it is neccisairy.
I maintence 3 ABC's 1 mine, and 2 for friends. every time I redo one, I usualy try a different way to see if I can find a better way.

Hope the short version of the suggestions is enough to paint the picture in your head. This responce is already reached novel size hehehe. I do not have my digital camera right now, its out on loan, but you should be able to visualize enough to understand.

Ken-Ohki

"I make things do what I want them to,The hell with what they are designed to do."

[LuckyArmpit]

Let me jump in with some facts about the T-52. 1st...it is easy to fly because of the 10 degree dihedral. 2nd, you learn about building with foam and coroplast etc. 3rd, pound for pound, it is the most indestructable model out there. And once you learn the flying techniques of elevator/rudder, you can cut off the center portion of the wing and make it straight. Add ailerons and then you have a high wing aileron trainer.
I learned on a T-52 and so did hundreds of others. Try and fly your slowstick full bore into a tree and show me what happens! I have done this with my T-52. Picked it back up, re-adjusted motor (I had it in with zip ties) re-launched and it flew as always. This was 3 years ago and I stil am flying the wing from it. It is now mounted on a pvc fuse with dual vert stabs.
I'd also suggest a computer TX such as the hitec flash series. You can turn down the throws (length of travel for your control surfaces) while learning and then turn them to normal or beyond once you get used to flying.
Don't get me wrong, a slow stick, wingo, soarstar etc. are all great beginning models but I don't think they can take the full punishment a new flyer can dish out.

Dave...

[guy5927]

Thanks again, Ken...

You should go and aply for a job as senior-chief-engineer-repairman-tester-researcher-developer-designer with Hobbyzone and get a big fatty paycheck every month....

Guy

[Ken-Ohki]

interesting, the t-52 I looked over was made of balsa, looked like a hard landing would take it apart. We must be looking at 2 differnet designs ;p I will admit to having no first hand knowlege of the T-52, so what do I know hehehe.

But in defence of the SS, Ive hit a house full bore, bounced off and regained flight to come back and land,

There are certainly other choices out there, and the thread author seems to need any and all imput he can get. Im curiouse now as to how much it costs and what it comes with,, I have been unable to find a foam T-52 for sale anywhere. Just a few reviews.

Ken-Ohki
"I make things do what I want them to, The hell with what they are designed to do."

[Ken-Ohki]

Originally Posted by guy5927

Thanks again, Ken...

You should go and aply for a job as senior-chief-engineer-repairman-tester-researcher-developer-designer with Hobbyzone and get a big fatty paycheck every month....

Guy

Yeah, that would be pretty sweeeet. However I think id rather work for GWS. But it would be a killer Job,, What do you do for work? Ow I fly planes, then tell the designers what I think of them, and how I made them fly better, and that they best make this like that hehehe.

I went flying today with my ABC in some massive winds,, Even got brave and took my SS out for a spin.

a few weeks ago, I ran a add in the local paper asking for land owners to grant me use of ther airspace. I had a real nice lady respond with over 300 acers of grass fields. We went there today, Myself and one of my friends with his ABC. This friend is one of the ones having a difficult time grasping the concept of flight. The winds were 8 ta 10 with a gust up to about 20 every 6 or so minutes, then droped back to light 8 ta 10. His bird had a brand new tail feather installed ( by me ) so I maidened it to make sure it was balanced right. And it was, thing was flying great stock in the wind. I landed, gave it him and off he went. He did ok for about 5 minutes. then it got dicey

he was downwind ( as usual ) and trying to turn upwind for another pass over the field, the wind came up and it took him off tward the powerlines, he manuvers around them and winds up doing a loop over the road just as a truck was going by, he then paniced and wound up crashing in the yard but doing no dammage. That was enough for him, he was done for the day. I on the other hand tossed my bird up for 4 packs and loved every minute of it. every time a giant wind came, i would just point the bird into it and reduce power til it stood in place., then after the big wind cycled out, I went back to normal flying..

Then my friend started to give me crap about how he hasnt seen my SS fly yet. SO, Against my better judgement ( wait a second, I dont have better judgement ) I took out the SS, checked the surfaces and did a ROG from he road with a sidewind. Caught air, flew under the power wires into the field, stayed up about 3 min and the wind hit me. What a fight that was but I managed to keep it under control and in the air. Then I decided I should land, I pointed it into the wind, reduced power and it came down like a choper til it was about 2 foot in the air then it fell to the side. the dam wind droped and it stalled on me. Ended up nose planting it, but doing no dammage.

Tomorrow should be interesting. My friend ( the guy mentioned uo the tread aways that flys big glow ) is taking out his 1/3 piper cub tomorrow. his brother will be there with his ABC. ( the guy that flew with me today ) and another friend of mine will be there with a 2 chan twin. ( I let this friend fly my ABC ) And I will have my SS, ABC and E-starter. we are leaving at 8 so hopefuly we will beat the wind they are calling for tomorrow.

Ken-Ohki
"I make things do what I want them to,The hell with what they are designed to do."

[aquaflight]

Hi ; I've got a 900mah pack with 2 bad cells and 2 1100mah cells that I can repair it with. Is this difference of 200mah going to be an issue? If so why and what might happen?

[Ken-Ohki]

Aquaflight

I do not think you should fix your 900 mah pack with 1100 mah cells.

I would think that if you went and did it anyway, you would not be able to put any more then 900 mah into the pack. It will most likely charge weird, and I supose there is some limited chance of other hazzard such as fire or bursting. I do not have any hard factual information on this. but it would seem to me that the pack would become unbalaced, and cause other cells to fail, most likely way beofre there time.

It would work, that is to say that you can do it, and it will work to some degree. but here is the line between what you can do ( being anything ) and what you should or should not do.

I am all for making whatever you have on hand do whatever it is you need done, However. In this case, I think its something better left undone.

Ken-Ohki
"I make things do what I want them to,The hell with what they are designed to do."

[Wingtips24]

I flew my 2 chanl and crashed it pretty good 2 days ago and after the crash it would no longer work. So i was left with 1 super cheezy yellow bee that had a broken wing and now my slightly less cheezy outlaw that would not work at all so I swapped the parts from the yellow bee and performed some surgery It worked so I am waiting to fly it as soon as it stops raining and the wind dies down. Ken I will try to locate the T-52 I was looking at so you can get a look at it. Who knows as long as I don't have the funds yet might as well take a look. Thing looked pretty sturdy

Here is the site I saw it on

http://www.jkaerotech.com/

Here is another site:
http://www.rccaraction.com/MA/reviews/pocket_plane.asp