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Old Feb 14, 2005, 08:07 PM
Purple power
gregg f's Avatar
shadow hills,ca
Joined Apr 2000
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[QUOTE=Tom in Cincy]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb
So how did it go ...

We had great weather Saturday. We used Bob's twin strand bungee to launch. I was able to measure the tension @ 35 lbs of pull.
The Panther launched and headed skyward.

Hmmm... Herb was right about the elevator needs some down trim ( I had the recommended 1mm) .
On the downwind I gave it a bit of down elevator. The Panther pitched down sharply. Gave it up and it pitched up just as violently.

Hmmm... Herb was right about the elevator sensitivity. On the next pass the Panther all of a sudden pitched straight up and begins to stall, Bob asks "you got any control?"

Answer "NO!" The Panther then begins to level out again pretty much all by itself. I chopped power and was able to make a reasonably controlled landing without touching the elevator and no damage to the plane.

The 30 second flight which seemed to last an hour was over.

Apparently on launch the battery tray ripped loose and was sliding back and forth in the fuselage causing the Panther to behave in a most inappropriate manner.
Other than that, flys like a dream.
BuD
Tom:
In addition to the small amount of elev travel I use -40% expo...........gregg
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Old Feb 14, 2005, 08:35 PM
EDF Jet Jam 2015, May 28-31st
Robert Belluomini's Avatar
United States, KY, Crestview Hills
Joined Dec 2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregg f
Bob:
Are you bringing the dolly? I might like to try it out with the F9F.
I'm bringing the dolly I use for the Pyranha and F-16 which has a max pull of 20lbs. I can bring the double strand if you like.

Bob
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Old Feb 14, 2005, 08:38 PM
EDF Jet Jam 2015, May 28-31st
Robert Belluomini's Avatar
United States, KY, Crestview Hills
Joined Dec 2000
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[QUOTE=Tom in Cincy]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb

The 30 second flight which seemed to last an hour was over.

Apparently on launch the battery tray ripped loose and was sliding back and forth in the fuselage causing the Panther to behave in a most inappropriate manner.
Other than that, flys like a dream.
BuD
Tom, You handled the situation like a well seasoned Jet Jock.
Best of all you avoided the ejection handles!
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Old Feb 14, 2005, 08:40 PM
Purple power
gregg f's Avatar
shadow hills,ca
Joined Apr 2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agustapower
I'm bringing the dolly I use for the Pyranha and F-16 which has a max pull of 20lbs. I can bring the double strand if you like.

Bob
That would be great Bob! Then I can leave the launcher at home. Might have room for the spousel unit then.
BTW, don't forget to wax the Pyranha! It helps shedding the rain drops.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 12:28 AM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom in Cincy
... Bob asks "you got any control?" ...


Ok all is well that ends well ...

The wingtip floats for the Panther are almost ready ...
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 12:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb
The wingtip floats for the Panther are almost ready ...
Herb, that's something i'd love to see...

Gene.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 06:59 AM
EDF Jet Jam 2015, May 28-31st
Robert Belluomini's Avatar
United States, KY, Crestview Hills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb


Ok all is well that ends well ...

The wingtip floats for the Panther are almost ready ...

Great, But do they have rudders it's looking really wet on Friday.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 12:07 PM
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Ed Waldrep's Avatar
Las Vegas, NV
Joined Dec 1996
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Gregg and Herb and Bob, are you guys flying on Fridayat MWE? I can't be there till saturday, unless I change my vacation plans. I don't have anything neato to bring, just my foam Ultrafly Hawk EDF conversion. All other projects got delayed or sidetracked by me taking on too many projects.

Ted isn't coming I guess with his F-16, would have been nice to see if fly there.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 12:26 PM
EDF Jet Jam 2015, May 28-31st
Robert Belluomini's Avatar
United States, KY, Crestview Hills
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I'll be there Friday and Saturday till 2. I just hop the weather gives us a break. I stii need to get some clear film to put on the bottom of the Pyranha to give it some protection.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 12:38 PM
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I'll be there Friday for sure, but it looks like it will rain heavily all day (2-3 inches expected on Friday ) - still I need to pick up something there .

The weather should improve a bit on Saturday, most likely with high winds (that's the usual pattern around here when the rain subsides this time of the year).

As usual it will be quite busy (and thus in the end rather unsafe for jets, at least for mine) on Saturday, with flying coathanger demos, electroglide (does anybody know who cares and what item this particular event is supposed to sell ?), endless aeromodeldotcom fontina demos and so-called heli drag races ...

And the last time I saw an f5b/f5d of any type fly was guess when? at last year's mwe, such is the overwhelming interest nowadays in this kind of stuff ... You can see from the program that there's no jet slot of any type on any of the four mwe days.

The JePe dolly setup should be interesting if they insist on having edf jets bungee right into the bushes, as last year.

On Friday I'll bring the JePe F-16, Panther and Rafale. And several very large plastic bags for rain cover...


.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 04:43 PM
Purple power
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shadow hills,ca
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Accuweather
Friday 2/18 Get Details
Mostly cloudy, rain possible
High 64° F
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 05:32 PM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Friday Rain, Saturday Showers:

http://www.wunderground.com/US/CA/San_Diego.html

Friday and Saturday Rain 60% :

http://weather.cnn.com/weather/forecast.jsp?locCode=SAN

Friday Rain 30% :

http://www.meteomedia.com/Meteo/Vill...s/USCA0982.htm

... hwh
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 07:08 PM
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Well that forecast doesn't look too promising. I've got nothing special to fly anyway, just my old reliable A-10 and my Hawk. That's a long trip for me, about 5 1/2 hours. Might just stay home and build.
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Old Mar 16, 2005, 01:16 PM
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demetrius's Avatar
Van Nuys
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Herb i was wondering if you had to build the panther all over again would you still use the 81mg servos for the Aileron & elevator?
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Old Mar 16, 2005, 01:47 PM
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I have 3 x 85 MG in the Panther. It seems the newer 81's MG's have had an occasional centering problem, and in any case the HS 85's are a better servo. For the nosegear steering servo and airvalve servo HS-55's are fine.

I use JR servos in the JePe F-16 and the Rafale.
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Old Mar 21, 2005, 12:54 AM
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I'm almost done with the Springair retract installation on my Panther. Gregg has done the same thing in his,

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=346421

There's also an older thread by UncleJoe about his Panther retract conversion:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...hlight=panther

Mine's done in a very similar way, with some differences in the mounts as I was a bit worried about spreading the load from the retracts. The whole mod took about five evenings, a lot less than on the Rafale.

I first used a scale drawing to get the strut length, wheel size etc and make some templates:

.
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Old Mar 21, 2005, 12:59 AM
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Retract mounts, mains & nose. Since the Springairs were still in transit, I used a main from the Rafale for size (that explains the odd wheel rotation).


.
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Old Mar 21, 2005, 01:05 AM
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Double layer of carbon to reinforce retracts mount area, then retract finally installed & securely mounted.

.
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 04:55 PM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Springair retract retrofit installation almost finished, test hop probably this weekend ...

I weighed the Panther before and after the retract installation. Added weight is 8.1 oz (230g) which is less than 10% of the plane weight.

Top speed @ 1200+ Watts should be unaffected ...

.
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 06:23 PM
Build'em and Crash'em
Ken Lapointe's Avatar
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Joined Oct 2000
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Looks great

Looks great Herb.

I gotta get me one of these Panthers and do the same thing.

I can even steal the power plant out of the Bob-E-Cat to reduce the cost

What size tires did you use ?

Looks great,

- Ken
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Old Mar 23, 2005, 12:54 PM
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Ken the tires are 2 inch for the mains and 1.5 inch for the nose.

They are slightly smaller than scale, which would be 60mm in the back and 50mm in the front according to the scale drawings I have.

The reason being that there's a spar & former in the way so a larger wheel would need a dremel job in one of the formers ...

The LG height is scale though, including the positive angle. The original Panther LG is fairly short. The smoothness of the aluminum surface is evident in the second picture as well.
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Old Mar 23, 2005, 08:37 PM
Build'em and Crash'em
Ken Lapointe's Avatar
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Thanks Herb.

I may try the Roll of Grass with no wheels first since I fly off a turf farm. The grass is usually very nice. If that does not work then I can go to retracts latter if needed.

Of course there is always the bungee, but I get tired of lugging that launcher around. Takes cargo space in the car better suited to another plane.

Now all I have to do is find an Aeronaut Panther for sale.

Anyone know of a US dealer that have any? Heck they only need 1 for me.


I guess its also time to start going to Li-Poly too.

- Ken
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Old Mar 23, 2005, 10:39 PM
shut up & fly
hoser's Avatar
United States, FL, Miami
Joined May 2001
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Herb great job, but 8.1 oz that does not make sense just the gear without struts wheels hose, retract servo, and valve weigh 6+oz last time i checked


did you save weight elsewhere?
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Old Mar 24, 2005, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Lapointe
Thanks Herb.Anyone know of a US dealer that have any? Heck they only need 1 for me.
Ken, there are two places in the U.S. that I know of where you can get the Panther; www.warbirds-rc.com and www.ductedfans.com. Or, mine might be up for sale pretty soon if my Yellow A-4 conversion project is successful .

Kirk
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Old Mar 25, 2005, 01:10 AM
RIP MC
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United States, CA, Midway City
Joined Dec 2003
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Herb, your stuff needs to go on our site . Please email me! I've been trying to email you, but I think the club has your email wrong. I am with Harbor Soaring and I am the one who is always asking you questions and in your landing zone with the glider of mine

fnnwizard@earthlink.net
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Old Mar 25, 2005, 01:34 PM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Lapointe
... Now all I have to do is find an Aeronaut Panther for sale. ... - Ken
I bought mine from Dymond at the 2004 IMS show in Ontario for $330 out the door (no sales tax) . It was missing some decals.

I have ordered many times from Europe, it worked fine for me. The Aeronaut Rafale I got from WeMoTec in 20 days, double boxed and including two Midi fans.

The Panther is now 430 Euros there including Midifan, www.wemotec.com. You could try Hoellein as well (389 Euros w/o fan) http://www.hoellein.com/websites_neu/home/home.html . With the Euro so high now, prices ar not as appealing as they used to be two years ago.

Keep in mind that the Panther shown to rog off the grass is not from the kit that Aeronaut sells, it's a special custom-laid all-carbon ultralight composite demo version .

When I did install the retracts in the Panther, I did save some weight: I took the tow hook off.

fnnwizard, yes I remember you ...
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Old Mar 25, 2005, 02:05 PM
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Thanks Herb,

I'll check into ordering it. Right now I am stuck between the L-39 and the Panther.

I keep drifting into the idea of a larger EDF, but then my wallet brings me back to earth.


- Ken
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Old Mar 25, 2005, 02:14 PM
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I think you can't go wrong with either one .

In either case I would try to get a quote on a package deal. For ex for the Savex L-39 it would be airframe, suitable retracts (?) and possibly (Moki?) fan.

The L-32 is designed for retracts from the start, all you have to do is screw them in .

Wait time on the Savex L-39 is six months. Some wait time on Springairs, fans etc as well.
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Old Mar 25, 2005, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Lapointe
Thanks Herb.
I may try the Roll of Grass with no wheels first since I fly off a turf farm. The grass is usually very nice. ...
- Ken
Some things really get caught up in grass and you end up flying un-armed


.
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Old Mar 26, 2005, 07:34 AM
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Appie's Avatar
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@Herb,

VERY, VERY nice Panther!

BTW in one of the pictures in post #218 i noticed that you are using the "New" Kokam 20C packs. How do these cells take the abuse of a discharge rate of 20C ??

Cheers,

Appie
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Old Mar 26, 2005, 12:30 PM
Let er Rip
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Long Island, NY
Joined Oct 2003
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Herb,

The Panther and Cougar are my all time favorites, your jet is just awesome, OK, so how much?

Just checked out the Warbirds.com no go on this model. Anyone know where this kit can be had.?

I can see landing on firma other than paved might raise helk with the ordinance.

Jim G
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Old Mar 26, 2005, 01:10 PM
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Nice mod
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Old Mar 26, 2005, 09:32 PM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Panther fever eh ...

We had two full 4min flights today, Dougie flew it once, and I did once as well.

Dougie's flight was a bit more turn and burn than mine, luckily no flameouts .

JePe F-16 rog'd no problem in 50 feet or so (tiny in size compared to turbine Gripen).

Location was El Toro fomer MCAS.

Panther with retracts flight video (2005)

Panther on 16 GP cells old bungee launch video (2004)


.
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Old Mar 27, 2005, 10:41 AM
Build'em and Crash'em
Ken Lapointe's Avatar
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Herb,

I love the ordanace on the wings, great job, way to go.

I have Panther fever in a big way, once I finish my F-86 I think I may be moving on to bigger things (Think JHH)

- Ken
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Old Mar 28, 2005, 01:28 PM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot44
Herb ... Anyone know where this kit can be had? Jim G
Have your tried ordering directly from Germany eg Wemotec (see addresses above)? This might be your best bet as they're made over there .
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Old Apr 01, 2005, 03:05 PM
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I got a lot of pointed questions on the Panther Springair retract setup in another thread http://www.rc-network.de/cgi-bin/ubb...c;f=5;t=000555 so I though I post a few more install pictures here as well,

.
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot44
Herb, ... Just checked out the Warbirds.com no go on this model. ...
They seem to be back in stock now ... Hopefully we will take if time allows it an ROG off grass video this weekend.

Jon's picture taken at BitW 2005, thank you Jon


.
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 01:35 PM
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Herb,

Hey, thanks bud, appreciate the info.

Question. are the Spring Airs in your Panther, 602's low profile, of which I have a set not employed presently and looking for a job.

Been flying the IC stuff for a long, long, time. This Panther, for me and the fields where I would be able to fly this bird, would dictate retractable gear.

Wow, I just watched the video. Now I'm in trouble, my wallet ran and hid under the bed....

Jim
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 01:50 PM
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Irvine, Calif USA
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Panther fewer stil running high eh ...

They are the Springairs 602 (complete trycicle set):

http://www.retracts.com/600.htm

They are extremely well made and hold up very well. I have not had a single problem with them (yet). Worth every penny imo.

I think the ones you have a bit bigger (and heavier). Hey where in LI, my daughter was born in Port Jeff.
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 02:03 PM
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Roger that Herb,

I use the 703's in 40 and 60 sized IC planes, and you are right. they are the best. I believe Rhobart or Rhom has followed suit and have introduced a spring air gear set, similiar setup to Spring Airs.

Port Jeff is about 20 miles East and North of my location as I am dead on the South side of Long Island, Great South Bay being 40 yards further South from my door. A beautiful Port Town (PJ). I go there often for the Restaurants and locale.

Thanks again for the info.
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 08:25 PM
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Wadmalaw Island ,SC
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Great video Herb !

Beautiful plane to boot

Regards ~

Hey Jim,
You getting the Panther ?
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Old Apr 30, 2005, 12:38 AM
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Long Island, NY
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Henry,

Looks like this Panther is in my not to distant future.. Looks to be a great flying machine....

Jim
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Old May 04, 2005, 02:07 PM
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Thanks for the comments!

I had a lot of strange noises coming out of the fuse last weekend - the fg is flapping a bit around the wheel wells on high speed passes.

On a positive note, the Panther takes off in about 30-40 feet off of short grass.

Needed to fix that by inserting some rigid balsa joiner between the two :


.
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Old May 04, 2005, 02:14 PM
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I've had the pleasure to see Herb's Panther in flight, and it looks just as good if not better up in the great blue as it does on the asphalt.
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Old May 04, 2005, 06:30 PM
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Long Island, NY
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Hey Herb,

Who's F86 Sabre is in the picture may I ask?

And FG meaning Fibreglass ehh? duh...

Jim
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Old May 04, 2005, 07:30 PM
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Van Nuys
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot44
Hey Herb,

Who's F86 Sabre is in the picture may I ask?

And FG meaning Fibreglass ehh? duh...

Jim
yea herb hehehe
whose F86 is that?
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Old May 05, 2005, 08:14 PM
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Kyosho F-86 Sabre in the process of being converted to 85mm HW-620 WeMoTec fan, Hacker B50L & Springair retracts. NO planned cheater holes, blow in doors, auxiliary suction ports, hot air deflectors etc. of any type ...

A marvelous kit, extremely lightweight: Empty airframe weight as seen in the picture below (no servos, linkages, fan, batts, retracts etc.) w/o internal ducting is 23.0 oz = 653g. Beautiful one-piece, lightweight fiberglass fuse.

Final rtf weight with pneumatic retracts installed and 6S Lipos should be in the 82-84 oz range, at ca. 1100-1200 Watts.

.
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Old May 18, 2005, 01:37 AM
I know I'm stupid but...
FGuinand's Avatar
Paris
Joined Jan 2005
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Hello my friends over there,
I'm in Europa, Paris and I would like to know if any body did think or try to adapt a real turbine on the aeronaut Panther. Like the Lambert one by exemple...750 grs all together (less than 27 ounces) INCLUDING half a liter of jet'sgazoline and the battery for 10 minutes of flight ?

We should end with a very light Panther, specially at the end of the flight after burning the half liter of jetgas...

The Lambert turbine is about 185grs (about 6 to 7 ounces including every thing and with a thrust of about 3 pounds and 6 ounces ! nearly the weight of the plane after some minutes of flying...

Maybe you could have a look at the german T32 nanoturbine, 2 inches diameters, less that 5 inches long...243.000 rpm, 6.5 ounces, 26 ounces including battery and half a liter of jet gasoline, enought for 10 minutes of flight ...

http://www.lambert-modellturbinen.de/html/triebwerke.html

Sound like a dream , is not it ?

I'm very much tempted, and as I definitely know that my next jet will be a Panther from aeronaut, I'm just hesitating between the two solution: EDF and lipos or the Turbine with the fantastic sound going with it that make you believe you are looking at the real thing...

Any advice would be very much appreciate,
Thank you in advance,
Very Friendly to you all,
Francois

P.S. Sadely, of course the Turbine is VERY expensive , about 2400 Euros the complete package, but you dont need any more the (very) expensive one or two set of lipo which fade or die eventually and for one dollar or less, you have about 3 times 10 minutes flight...and no charging times to bother with....
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Old May 18, 2005, 02:11 AM
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The Aeronaut Panther was designed from the start for electric edf setup. It will fly apart if you put too much power into it. It's not even designed for retracts, although they can be retrofitted. Are you going to bungee launch your turbine setup?

Turbine jet kits are designed for turbines. The fuse is strong enough to take a turbine mount. Formers are stronger, heat buildup in the tail can be an issue - turbines run hot. There's more space in the fuse for the ecu, twin air circuits, full retracts and brake system etc. . The whole airframe is stronger and very rigid. Linkages and control surfaces are designed for ca. 200 mph speeds.

While there are certainly exceptions, if you want a good flying electric, get a composite lightweight edf kit designed for electric setup (Aeronaut, JePe, WeMoTec, Schreiner etc.).

If you are looking for a high performance turbine jet, then look at the leading composite jet kit manufacturers (BVM, YA, Avonds, Savex etc).

Smaller jets are well suited for electric setups. For larger jets only turbines makes sense.

There is certainly a gray area in between where both a 90mm edf fan and a small mw44/P60 (reliable!) turbine setup can make sense, depending on taste & flying environment ... Yes cute tiny little turbines make sense - on paper. But are they reliable enough yet?

Btw, my EDF Panther takes off and lands on short grass, which can be a convenience:


.
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Old May 18, 2005, 04:02 PM
I know I'm stupid but...
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Paris
Joined Jan 2005
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Thank you very much for your advice, Herb, but I was not wanting a Turbine for performance, it was more for the "sound" of the real thing ! and also I thought that this very small turbine was not even as powerful as some of the EDF combination that some guys use in this forum !

Of course, I imagine that the main probem will be the heat of the turbine and the exhaust tube !
As i dont have any experience about it, I would then certainly need the help of some one who did put one of those very small turbine (2 inches diameter, 6 inches long, 53 ounces of trust) in a Panther....

But now i think that in fact I will need your experience about the Panther because at the end of the day, I probably will follow the EDF road...

So then, by the way with a schubi fan what would be the best Lehner motor and lipo combination for about 8 to 10 minutes of flying ?

About the landing gear, I think that it's too much of a problem and dont look so good anyway, and as I mostly will land on grass, that's already a problem that is solved !!

Thank you again for your times,
Friendly, Francois.
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Old May 22, 2005, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FGuinand
... About the landing gear...don't look so good anyway....
Uh ??? .

The Panther will fly fine without landing gear at 600-800 Watts, and with retracts at 800-1100+ Watts ...

Just keep it LIGHT (no multiple layers of heavy primer, heavy coats of automotive paints, aluminum wrappings and nickel plating etc.), you are not painting a nuclear submarine .

Build it with a scale (graded in tons of course) to keep a tight control on the weights of every single component you add.

(In fact one of the great advantages of the Panther is that it comes pre-painted blue in the mold)
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Old May 22, 2005, 06:07 PM
I know I'm stupid but...
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Paris
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Dear Herb,
What I ment about the landing gear is that it is difficult to make it look really scale, particulary with the closing doors...and to me it does not worth the weight penalty and the fragility (and complication) involved ! I think it should be left to greater scale jet...but I must admit that looking at the gear folding up after a take off or folding down during the last turn is very exciting....so you see I'm not even clear in my mind ;°)... life is difficult somes times !

But what I did not understand is why you say that the turbine i was speaking about is too powerfull ? it's just 3 pounds of trust !!!! and weight 6.5 ounces !!!!
Did you take the times and had a look at theyre site ?

http://www.lambert-modellturbinen.de/html/triebwerke.html

I will ask them if there is already a fool who did use it on a precious jet plane !

You did not tell me about the Schübeler turbine, and which engine to use with, ( if you know about Lehner motors it would be even more interesting as they are probably the best quallity you can get ). which lipos (number and capacity), the power of the controller needed and the expected times of flight a full throttel, and or mixed throttle...? and also all the stupid mistake I would probably do without your advice !

And all the tricks about the elevator up and dowm course, ailerons, etc....which lipo capacity and numbers...and every thing so that I have a winner after my first take off ...
Friendly,
Francois
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Old May 22, 2005, 10:48 PM
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Aeronaut Panther, 6S LiPo and any motor with KV=1500 (~200g motorweight) and you'll have a great performer. Amp draw will be around 40.
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Old May 23, 2005, 03:04 PM
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Haldor , Herb ,

Thanks for posting those tips... Think I may be headed in the right direction

I have a 1510 kv motor laying around (mega 22/20/3e)+ midifan ,but only a 5s3p 6000.We'll see . No problem to upgrade the motor if need be .

Since I'll be at the lower end of the performance envelope, I'll be doing NO painting ,save a little touch up around the H-stab/, intake glue joints and cockpit/canopy of course.

1) Haldor ,if you don't mind , can you give a little detail on your hook setup on the bungee cord end?
I know your location , but all my bungie launched edfs to date use an external hook ON the plane. Do I affix a bent piece of heavy wire to mate with the brass tube in the bottom of the fuse ? Seems what the diagram in the instruction indicates.
Thanks and best wishes
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Old May 23, 2005, 06:29 PM
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I don't use any brass tube, just an L-shaped screw (from your local hardware store), screwed into a solid ply plate glued on the fuse inside.

I also have a piece of wood in front to prevent the hook from getting bent when it hits something that's not too soft.

I don't have a Panther picture, but here's the towhook on the JePe F-16, never had a problem with these kind of hooks:


.
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Old May 23, 2005, 08:16 PM
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thnxs Herb,,,

Thats what I'm used to seeing .... (F-18 , Sniper et al) I'll probably go that route .

the Panther instuction has ya drilling a hole and angling a piece o' brass tube through a couple pieces o' ply making the deal flush . Then there's a small illustration of a bent wire like I mentioned on the bungee end ..... unless I'm totally missing something which IS possible .

thanks again
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Old May 24, 2005, 08:46 AM
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I used a plain L-hook on mine.
The Mega and 5S will probably be lowish on power but the Panther is exceptionally "light". I once made a 7min flight with mine with 200W average draw. 500W will be ample for normal flight but I consider the sweetspot to be ~800W.
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Old May 24, 2005, 09:46 AM
EDF all the way!
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Gilbert, Az
Joined Jun 1999
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Mine is almost ready to fly. I used Greg's method of installing landing (fixed). I have a Midi fan, Hacker B50-15L, 77 AMP Master ESC, and 6S3P LiPo (two 3S3P 6000 ma packs in series). Should be ready to fly in a couple of weeks. Trying to decide to make the wings removalable of glue them inplace? Just in time for our warm weather. It was 109 degrees over the weekend.
Bob
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Old May 24, 2005, 11:42 AM
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Thanks Haldor,

1) I'm going with a different motor .

2) @ Bob, I'm using the "screw into spar " to hold the wings on (think haldor put
couple pics up somewhere.).

Good luck with your Panther ,I just need one rainy day to finish up
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Old May 24, 2005, 11:55 AM
Let er Rip
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Long Island, NY
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Henry,

So How we coming along with the F9F? Hope to see some finished product pictures.

Jim
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Old May 24, 2005, 01:27 PM
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demetrius's Avatar
Van Nuys
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bruff
Mine is almost ready to fly. I used Greg's method of installing landing (fixed). I have a Midi fan, Hacker B50-15L, 77 AMP Master ESC, and 6S3P LiPo (two 3S3P 6000 ma packs in series). Should be ready to fly in a couple of weeks. Trying to decide to make the wings removalable of glue them inplace? Just in time for our warm weather. It was 109 degrees over the weekend.
Bob
is this your panther bob? Also do you have pictures?
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Old May 24, 2005, 05:34 PM
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Hey Jim,

Not much to do at all really.... just waiting on a new motor now...

I'll snap a few pics ...but I'm not painting it or anything .
will take some vid as well for fun.

been too pretty outside for "building"

been sick awhile ,,,nasty little virus going around..

drop me a line
~ Henry
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Old May 25, 2005, 07:05 PM
I know I'm stupid but...
FGuinand's Avatar
Paris
Joined Jan 2005
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Hello My friends,

That's it ...it's too late now, I cannot look backwards now, i did order and have laready paid for the Panther from Areonaute...!!!

Could any body tell me what is the size and the lenght of the elastic and the lenght of the cord added to it to bungee launch safely , the first times, an Aeronaute panther with EDF? where do you have to place exactely the hook under the fuselage ? what is the plan of the "stand" for the launching ? (lengh and angle, wideness ?) and all stupid questions I certainly forgot to ask about it ?

Until now I have only hand launched small jets....and you had to be pretty fast to jump on to the control after she left your hand at full power and not always as you expected she to fly away...!!!

Thank you very much for your kind help,

Francois

fguinand@hotmail.com
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Old May 25, 2005, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the Swamp Fox
... but I'm not painting it or anything ....
Good choice, keep it LIGHT and it will fly better. That's maybe why Aeronaut painted it blue in the mold ...?

I never used ANY primer on any of my molded jets (JePe, Aeronaut and even the K&A ones), what's the point ?

If you rub the surface down thoroughly with propyl alcohol and/or steel wool or ultrafine grit sp, it will take acrylic paint just fine (one coat is usually plenty), and you won't even be able to measure the weight increase.

And you'll feel the weight difference:
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Old May 25, 2005, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FGuinand
... Could any body tell me what is the size and the lenght of the elastic and the lenght of the cord added to it to bungee launch safely , the first times, an Aeronaute panther with EDF? where do you have to place exactely the hook under the fuselage ? what is the plan of the "stand" for the launching ? (lengh and angle, wideness ?) and all stupid questions I certainly forgot to ask about it ?
You built it already ?

Do a search under bungee here...

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...82&postcount=7

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=13

I use about 8 meters of 9mm rubber pulled to a tension of about 5-10 x model weight. The ramp is made out of PVC and is inclined at 10 degrees. Look at the pictures above.

The hook is located about 1/2 chord ahed of CG, in the Panther that comes out at about a few cm's ahead of the wing leading edge at the root.
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Old May 25, 2005, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bruff
... Trying to decide to make the wings removalable of glue them inplace? ...
I use a strip of special JePe tape, lenghtwise across the joint, underside of wing only. Wing has not come off yet in over 50+ flights . Screw in the spar, I hope it's a joke ...
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Old May 26, 2005, 11:50 AM
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Hiya ,
I don't think he was joking

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1&page=2&pp=15

but tape sounds easier , and I'm a big fan of easy tape it is ..

... lets see ...now I have the batts ( 5s3p 6750)
and another motor on the way (mega 22/30/2)
hopefully that'll work out .

~ take care all
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Old May 26, 2005, 12:06 PM
Purple power
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shadow hills,ca
Joined Apr 2000
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The tape method works very well.

Another plus for tape is it protects the paint if you bungee off a launcher. Just space the rails to ride on the tape.
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Old Aug 06, 2005, 11:12 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
Joined Oct 2003
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Another Panther coming along..

Finally getting around to building the Panther. This thread has so much valuable information which really makes building fast and easy - thanks to everyone who contributed! I'm not by any means an Ace builder but here are a couple of alterations/semi contributions as I go along:

1) Figuring out where the the control rod slots in the fin should go. Instead of eyeballing it I used the laser to line up the servo control horn (marked w/ tape) and the horiz. stab horn. Then marked the line for cutout along the laser line:
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Old Aug 07, 2005, 05:37 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
Joined Oct 2003
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Elevator linkage using 2mm rods and Graupner Dual rod connection lock 1.5-2mm. I'm happy with it, stiff and absolutely no slack.
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Old Aug 08, 2005, 04:01 AM
Zoom-Zoom
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Switzerland, ZH, Dietikon
Joined Jun 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Downwind3Zero
Elevator linkage using 2mm rods and Graupner Dual rod connection lock 1.5-2mm. I'm happy with it, stiff and absolutely no slack.
Hey Chris - you finally started building the Panther... Great!

Don't forget the Loctite (green) on the connector!

Best regards - Paco
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Old Aug 08, 2005, 04:54 AM
It's like an addiction!
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, thanks anyways!
Chris
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Old Aug 08, 2005, 06:09 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
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Oh, and here is the Fan which is going in! Jepe Spiderfan with 3W motor. Should deliver anywhere from 600-800W depending on the final setup (# of cells).
Chris
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Old Aug 09, 2005, 05:29 PM
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Elizabethtown/Ft. Knox, Kentucky, United States
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I have two flights on one that I just finished and it flys great. I'm very pleased with it.

Midi fan
Plett 220/30 A4-S-P4
Kokam 6S1P 3200
900W
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Old Aug 09, 2005, 06:03 PM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
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Sounds great Jim. I like the paint job - beautiful plane! I just test ran the Spiderfan and it's very smooth indeed. I'll try to get some measurements on 6s tomorrow or the day after.
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Old Aug 10, 2005, 03:36 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
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Test fit after all linkages and tail attachment completed.
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 08:33 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
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Mounting the Spiderfan

3mm glass-reinforced ply ring epoxied to fan housing. Important to make sure there's no squeezing of the housing since the rotors are VERY close and prebalanced which, even when holding the naked fan and running mildly, causes rubbing.
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 09:10 AM
EDF Jet Jam 2015, May 28-31st
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United States, KY, Crestview Hills
Joined Dec 2000
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WOW your Panther Looks great Jim! I look forward to seeing it fly next weekend at lexington.
Bob
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 09:50 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
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Fan mounted. The belly screw was a pain in the you know what to get to
Hope to test-run and post data today
Chris
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 11:11 AM
EDF all the way!
bruff's Avatar
Gilbert, Az
Joined Jun 1999
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Panther Pictures.

Here are some pictures of mine. Should be flying within two weeks.
Bob
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 11:40 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
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Very impressive Bob! What did you use to get the Aluminum leading edges?
Regards Chris
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 12:28 PM
EDF all the way!
bruff's Avatar
Gilbert, Az
Joined Jun 1999
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Chrome trim Monokote.
Bob
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 01:12 PM
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Elizabethtown/Ft. Knox, Kentucky, United States
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Downwind,
Looks like your getting there. Are you going to install retracts? I thought about using them but decided to belly land it since I fly off of grass.

Bob,
Did you scare the heck out of that pilot or what
You must not be working on anything, all of your tools are hanging up so neat! No matter how hard I try I can never keep them in one place.
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 01:23 PM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
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Thanks Bob.
Jim, no retracts - we usually fly off grass fields and the Panther with its big belly shouldn't pose any problems.
Question to you both: did you attach the tailsection with additional hooks or screws as some have done previously?
Regards, Chris
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 05:54 PM
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Yes on the hooks for the tail. I used a piece of fiberglass sheet to make a "hook" that fits a slot in the fuse when you slide the tail on.

Jim
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 06:20 PM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
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Jim, appreciate it! I gues it's a "must" then...
Regards, Chris
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 06:31 PM
EDF all the way!
bruff's Avatar
Gilbert, Az
Joined Jun 1999
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I used Zap-A-Gap-A- Goo on the flats plus the stock pin & screw to attach the tail. I think that is what Herb did with his. I used tape to keep the wing from sliding.also.
Bob
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 07:15 PM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
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Hey that's pretty neat Bob, I'll consider that. Thanks!
Regards, Chris
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 10:06 PM
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Century City, CA
Joined Jan 2004
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Downwind:
You're gonna shrink wrap the connectors @ the motor/speed controller I'm sure... Just noticed in the photo.

---

I am amping myself up for this model and just contemplating motor/fan configurations.
Currently I am favoring the Schubler Fan with a Hacker B50-13L & Jeti77. I will run 2x the new 3S3P 6000Mah Thunder Power Batteries (20C). I was also considering the Jepe Fan/Motor, but I really want more than 1000 watts and think I'll get that with the Hacker/Schubler setup (though I haven't done the math yet).
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 10:18 PM
EDF all the way!
bruff's Avatar
Gilbert, Az
Joined Jun 1999
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My setup is WeMoTec Midi fan, Hacker B50-15L, Master 77 AMP ESC, 6s3P 6000 ma Prolite Thunder Power LiPo pack ( 2 each 3S3P )
Bob
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 10:40 PM
Purple power
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shadow hills,ca
Joined Apr 2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lebdog
Downwind:
You're gonna shrink wrap the connectors @ the motor/speed controller I'm sure... Just noticed in the photo.

---

I am amping myself up for this model and just contemplating motor/fan configurations.
Currently I am favoring the Schubler Fan with a Hacker B50-13L & Jeti77. I will run 2x the new 3S3P 6000Mah Thunder Power Batteries (20C). I was also considering the Jepe Fan/Motor, but I really want more than 1000 watts and think I'll get that with the Hacker/Schubler setup (though I haven't done the math yet).
Hi Caleb:
A cheaper alternative is the mega 22/30/3 and midi fan.
8s2p will give you over 1200w and when the cells warm up around 1300w iirc.

For the other F9F builders here:
keep in mind this airframe does not need alot of power (anything over 700w) to fly very well.
I rarely go above 50% throttle in level flight.
Around 150 flights on this set up with an 18 month old early Gen 2 pack. With current cells it would be off the chart...........
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 10:47 PM
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Century City, CA
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Gregg:

The reason I was most specifically considering the B50 is that I have a large credit with Hacker for something they returned today. Is the B50 not a good motor? I would love your experience. I was thinking of actually even going B50-10L?

What do you think? TIA!
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 11:22 PM
Speed Demon
GregG's Avatar
Antioch,CA,USA
Joined Dec 1999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregg f
.....For the other F9F builders here:
keep in mind this airframe does not need alot of power (anything over 700w) to fly very well.
Around 150 flights on this set up with an 18
I rarely go above 50% throttle in level flight. month old early Gen 2 pack.......
I'd tend to agree. Greggs F9F flies very fast, very smooth, and for an impressively long time!

I haven't seen it since he's installed retracts but the memory of watching it fly at MWE this year makes me want one.

Beautiful airplane Gregg!
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Old Aug 12, 2005, 11:58 PM
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I know Gregg's Panther fly's great!

What's the Hacker B50 Equivalent of the Mega?

Gregg F:
What's your AUW with the retracts now?
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Old Aug 13, 2005, 12:29 AM
EDF all the way!
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Gilbert, Az
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The B50-15l on 6S with give 900+ Watts.
Bob
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Old Aug 13, 2005, 01:48 AM
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Century City, CA
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The B50-15L sounds like the ticket if I go Hacker! Thanks Bruff!

Does anyone know how many AMPs the 11L pulls (6S) at WOT?
Has anyone used 11L with less LiPo's like 5S??

I can comfortably go up to 70+ peak amps.
I plan on using a Jeti77 speed controller and as long as WOT isn't pulling more than 70+/- I'm good with my current hardware.
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Old Aug 13, 2005, 03:02 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
Joined Oct 2003
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@lebdog, thank you for a good point there, the connectors will be shrinkwrapped of course I am still not sure if I should put the Esc in the carbon controller extension or not, and the fan testing isn't complete, hence the temp connectors.
I had planned on using the Midi/B50 16L on 6s until the Spiderfan came along
From all the posts I have read beforehand, the Panther doesn't need more than 600-800W to fly well since it's pretty light.
Regards, Chris
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Old Aug 13, 2005, 05:07 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
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1,507 Posts
Got around to running the Spiderfan!
Measurements: Spiderfan 3W, TP 6s3p 6000mAh gives 1050W @ 49A WOT.
A little too much for this plane but I figure I'll be fine with throttle management and cruising around on 50%!
Regards, Chris (knees still shakin')
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Old Aug 13, 2005, 08:16 AM
It's like an addiction!
Downwind3Zero's Avatar
NY, Rochester
Joined Oct 2003
1,507 Posts
Not all is good - beware!

On the second test of the fan, again @ over 1kW the left intake split down the lateral seam, from front to back (collapse) - no harm done, fixable! Reinforcement time no doubt
Regards, Chris
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Old Aug 13, 2005, 09:00 AM
Purple power
gregg f's Avatar
shadow hills,ca
Joined Apr 2000
6,594 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by lebdog
I know Gregg's Panther fly's great!

What's the Hacker B50 Equivalent of the Mega?

Gregg F:
What's your AUW with the retracts now?
5.25lb now
4.7 before the spring air conversion.
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