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Old Apr 23, 2013, 02:29 PM
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Replacing outrunner magnets

Hello, I have a z-power z50a 565kv heli motor that has one broken magnet. Can anyone advise me on what specs I need for replacements?

They are flat, rectangular magnets, measure 30 x 8 x 1.5mm and there are 10 of them.

I did hear back from these guys:

www.supermagnetman.net

and I'm waiting on a quote for some custom cut magnets, but I'm not sure if I asked for the right strength and temperature rating.

The other question I have is are these magnets typically magnetized through the thickness or length?

Thanks in advance.
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Old Apr 24, 2013, 03:11 PM
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Magnetized thru the thickness is correct. I have no info on that motor if it's cheap there are most likely N35's. Going with stronger magnets will change the motor but not necessarily for the better unless you rewind it. Stronger mags will lower your Kv thus requiring a bigger prop to load the motor. Better quality motors Iv;e seen use N45 or N42. If you watched the video N50's aren't really needed if the mags are utilized properly. I'm working on a rig now to test magnets strength it's a simple device, like a balance scale so there has to be standard to calibrate the tool.
But at least you received a response from Supermagman, after 5 email and calls I finally got a canned response ,although I had layed out all the details to give a specific answer.
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Old Apr 24, 2013, 08:01 PM
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Thanks for the info.

Havent heard back from Supermagnetman just yet. What video are you referring to?

I've been emailing a few magnet makers about a small batch of N42 to N48 but havent heard back from anyone. Most sites mention a minimum order of 100 magnets or better.

I did find one company based in china offering lots of 12 or more. Best lead I've found yet.

But the thing I cant figure out is what coating to ask for.

"3.coating of magnet:Zn,Ni,Ni-Cu-Ni,parylene etc."

Found here:

http://www.brushlessmotormagnet.com/html/Brushless_Motor_Magnet/Long%20block%20brushless%20motor%20magnet.Html
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Old Apr 24, 2013, 09:01 PM
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Believe it or not gold is one of the less expensive coatings. From what I see it's a minimum of about $250.00 bucks to get some custom mags made. How many you get depends on size. I just replaced the mags in my Eflite Park 480. The smallest little impact broke one of the horrid looking things. I put in N42's because that's all I could find . I just ran a Kv test and it came in at 1011Kv. I imagine the the stock mags might be N40's but wouldn't be surprised if they were 35's. Don't forget the temp rating as well, it is a cost consideration. Mags with no suffix are generally 80*C rated which is quite sufficient for recreational purposes. M rated mags 100*C would put some margin in there if your planning on running it hard. If your getting the the bell of an outrunner to the point of boiling water there is probably something wrong with the set up. As far as coating considering the environment these motors operate in the least expensive will do. One coating called Parylene C looks like a good one for the cost. I think that's what is seen on mags that have a copper color look to them. The least expensive is zinc. Porosity vs thickness of the coating is the issue and what is the mags surface being exposed to (chemicals). I think we have a pretty sweet environment in the outrunner for magnets.
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Old Apr 24, 2013, 10:01 PM
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Yikes!! Who charges $250 minimum?

For around $150 I could simply buy another Z50a. Or if I happen to see one used they go for $50 to $80.

Thanks for the info either way.
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Old Apr 24, 2013, 11:47 PM
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At least that's the cost of the first batch. They have to make a mold. That's the info I gleaned from the SMM website. I have no idea how much subsequent batches cost. What brand of motor is a Z50a?
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Old Apr 24, 2013, 11:48 PM
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"For around $150 I could simply buy another Z50a".
I think that's the idea!
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 09:26 AM
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Yikes!! Who charges $250 minimum?

For around $150 I could simply buy another Z50a. Or if I happen to see one used they go for $50 to $80.

Thanks for the info either way.
If you go the route of new do you want to sell the broken one?
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 11:57 AM
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If you go the route of new do you want to sell the broken one?
If I do give up on it, you will be the first to know about it. Just out of curiosity, what would you do with an outrunner with one broken magnet?
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 01:28 PM
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Old Apr 29, 2013, 05:58 PM
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Got my first reply on this magnet issue. Supermagnet man wants $7.25 each for a batch of 12 and for some reason the cheapest shipping option is $50.

$87 for magnets. A bit steeper than I thought but cheaper than $125 for a new one.

But $50 for shipping? Come on, they are magnets, not plutonium.

Is there some extra large packaging involved to keep other metallic packages from sticking to mine?

I think I'll wait for a few more replies.

What I did find is some off the shelf magnets that are very close in size to what I'm looking for. And only $2.00 each. They are 1/16 of an inch thick (1.58mm) so an extra 0.08 might not be a big deal.

http://www.magnet4less.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_122&products_id=1053

The problem is cutting these things. They are brittle and temperature sensitive. Not to mention tougher than most of the standard impliments of destruction one would usually use to cut metals. As an added bonus the dust from cutting magnets is highly flammable.

Does anyone have a high power laser and some spare time?
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Old Apr 29, 2013, 08:15 PM
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Something is wrong with that, did you double check? I thought there was an initial fee for making the mold. I paid $7.50 or so for shipping from, I think China, came in a regular envelope in the mail. I paid about 20 bucks total for 20 2X4X10 mm mags. I'm looking for the receipt. Opening the air gap even a smidgeon is evil voodoo for the motor. It won't be the same motor. What kind of motor is it? maybe if you contact the manufacturer they will tell you what strength the stock mags are. If the smaller magnets are stronger than stock maybe it will come out the same.
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Old Apr 30, 2013, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by zeroback View Post
Something is wrong with that, did you double check? I thought there was an initial fee for making the mold. I paid $7.50 or so for shipping from, I think China, came in a regular envelope in the mail. I paid about 20 bucks total for 20 2X4X10 mm mags. I'm looking for the receipt. Opening the air gap even a smidgeon is evil voodoo for the motor. It won't be the same motor. What kind of motor is it? maybe if you contact the manufacturer they will tell you what strength the stock mags are. If the smaller magnets are stronger than stock maybe it will come out the same.
There is no mold for sintered neo magnets--they are cut from a solid block of material using EDM. Then they are magnetized in a big magnet zapper.

Steve
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Old Apr 30, 2013, 12:38 AM
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Whats EDM? And more importantly Zeroback do you have a link to the company you ordered magnets from? Were they custom sized or something off the shelf?

Not sure what you mean by smaller magnets. The ones I linked are just a bit bigger on all 3 measurements. And the type of motor is listed in the first post. Its a Z-power motor but they also sold under the name Tonic-X.
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