Espritmodel.com Telemetry Radio
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Feb 21, 2013, 12:34 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
Question
0.6mm aircraft ply

Also called Baltic/Russian/Finnish Birch ply.
0.6mm is called out in many European wood sailplane designs and is readily available in Europe and Australia.
0.4 (1/64") and 0.8mm (1/32") is readily available in the US, but not the 0.6mm.
Does anyone have a source in the US for small quantities (1-3 sheets) of this thickness?

And if anyone has built a sailplane that called for this thickness, and could not get it, what thickness did you use instead?

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Last edited by shinck; Feb 21, 2013 at 02:49 PM.
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Feb 21, 2013, 02:54 PM
Designing something...
United States, CA, Cameron Park
Joined Jan 2004
1,680 Posts
Hey Scott,

Most of the European designed Horten's I've build called for .6mm birch plywood skins. I've never been able to find any in the US. I went as far as trying to get it by calling the main importer at their NJ HQ. They said didn't import it! Buying it in Europe and having it shipped didn't seem like a good option so I ended up using .4mm instead. However, the real answer to your question is that it depends. I would think that .8mm (1/32") is an option if the part needs to be "strong" and the quantity is small enough to not cause a big weight penality.

Cheers,

Brian




Quote:
Originally Posted by shinck View Post
Also called Baltic/Russian/Finnish Birch ply.
0.6mm is called out in many European wood sailplane designs and is readily available in Europe and Australia.
0.4 (1/64") and 0.8mm (1/32") is readily available in the US, but not the 0.6mm.
Does anyone have a source in the US for small quantities (1-3 sheets) of this thickness?

And if anyone has built a sailplane that called for this thickness, and could not get it, what thickness did you use instead?

Scott
cpdude is offline Find More Posts by cpdude
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 22, 2013, 11:46 AM
Designing something...
United States, CA, Cameron Park
Joined Jan 2004
1,680 Posts
The more I thought about it I guess my last post may not have been as useful as it could have been.

I many have got some bad information and things also change so here is the information on the company:

http://www.koskisen.com/


USA Agent, Plywood & Door Mfrs. Corp.

1435 Morris Avenue
NJ 07083, Union
United States

Juhani Haikala
juhani@pdusa.com

Phone: 1-908-687-7890
Fax: 1-908-687-5750

Cheers,
Brian
cpdude is offline Find More Posts by cpdude
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 22, 2013, 11:48 AM
Low L/D
Cryoflyer's Avatar
New Mexico
Joined Dec 2004
53 Posts
Scott,

I bought one sheet 50 cm x 100 cm from Quartel in Holland last summer. I had to cut it into four roughly equal pieces (~25 cm x 50 cm) to fit into my suitcase, so it may be of no use to you. I have no immediate use for it. PM me if you think you could use it and I'll look up what it would cost to replace it.

Jim
Cryoflyer is offline Find More Posts by Cryoflyer
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 22, 2013, 12:05 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
I have also found some more information. An archived 2009 forum post on the EAA website gave me a company name and contact that was said to handle .6mm aircraft grade plywood. I emailed them and got the information below:
Thank you for the inquiry. We do sell the aircraft plywood. 0.6mm is $70/sheet (5x5). If you buy 5 sheets or more the price drops to $60.00/sheet. UPS shipping will vary depending on how many sheets you order. These sheets can be rolled up and put in a long box. UPS shipping will run approximately $35 depending on how many sheets you order.

In comparing this price to available .4 and .8mm ply, the cost per square foot is in the same range, even including shipping.

And in a later exchange I received the following reply:
It is GL2 Finland/Aircraft. I would estimate that 5 10 sheets could be shipped for approximately $35.00.

Contact info:
Cheryl Lewis
The Hardwood Store of NC, Inc.
106-V East Railroad Ave.
Gibsonville, NC 27249
336-449-9627
cheryl@hardwoodstore.com
www.hardwoodstore.com

I will be ordering 3 sheets (estimated lifetime supply!) and will report back when they are received.

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 22, 2013, 04:08 PM
Registered User
Joined Jul 2006
143 Posts
Plywood

In the last 17 or 18 years I have built 19 scale gliders covered with Finnish birch plywood. For the flying surfaces I use so called 1/64" ,for the fuselage I use so called 1/32" birch ply and for the formers mostly 1/8" and some 1/4" birch ply wood. I buy the plywood in 12" X 48" sheets from the hobby shop.
I have had absolutely no problem with these dimensions. I think you are worrying too much.
I very seldom use lite ply.

Fred China
Fred China is offline Find More Posts by Fred China
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 22, 2013, 11:07 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
Fred,

But that is because .6mm has not been available in the US, or at least not easily attainable. And because of that, I agree with your methods. However, IF this thickness had been available, would you have been using it to fine tune the strength vs. weight of your construction methods? The Europeans and Australians have had it for years and routinely spec it on their plans and in their kits.

If it really is available from a US supplier, as it appears to be, at a reasonable price, then why not use it? I have checked the price of (Midwest) 1/64 and 1/32 in hobby shops in the last year, and am glad that I can buy the same stuff online for 1/3 of that price from recognized suppliers. That is the type of information I am trying to find and distribute with this thread.

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 23, 2013, 06:19 PM
Registered User
Joined Jul 2006
143 Posts
Scott

I'm sorry if I sounded pompous. It certainly wasn't my intention.

The gliders that I have built are all 1/4 to 1/3 scale. If .6 mm ply had been available I don't think I would have used it. 1/32" ply at times seems quite light for some fuselages and I think that 1/64 for flying surfaces works very well but then again .6mm might do very well for some wings.

I agree with you regarding the price of the ply from Hobby shops. Unfortunately in Canada I don't think we have a heck of a lot of choice. If anyone can correct me, please do. I bought from my local shop until the price almost doubled and I found a mail order shop in another province until their price almost doubled. I am now back with the original shop.

A 5' X 5' sheet of ply that you mention sounds like a good buy as you will get 5 times the amount of a 12"X48" sheet for as you say, 1/3 the price, I have bought some model supplies from the U.S. but it is a hassle because of exchange rates and duty etc.

Fred
Fred China is offline Find More Posts by Fred China
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 23, 2013, 07:25 PM
Registered User
Ren DiLeo's Avatar
United States, CA, San Diego
Joined Oct 2003
148 Posts
plywood

National Balsa has small sheet sizes available.

www.nationalbalsa.com

Ren
Ren DiLeo is offline Find More Posts by Ren DiLeo
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 23, 2013, 07:49 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
Fred,
My apologies also to you. I thought you lived in the state of Washington, probably because of your attendance at the aerotows in that area.

I have kept up with the really nice scale sailplanes you build. Definitely museum-quality.

Your plywood sheeting work is particularly impressive. I am slowly getting myself ready to do some of that. Probably picked the wrong plane to start with because I can't hide mistakes with paint, but Vince Cockett's 5.5m Fafnir is it. Half a wing is actually ready to sheet, and has been for 5 years. It calls for .6mm ply, hence the reason for starting this thread. Yes, I would have used .4mm if that was my only choice.

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 23, 2013, 07:54 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
Ren,
I presume you were replying to Fred about where to get reasonable pricing on .4 and .8mm ply?
While researching this, I put together a spreadsheet to help me compare prices. I didn't include shipping on most, because I would have had to actually go through the entire purchasing process to get the shipping cost; didn't want to make a mistake and place an order!
A screen shot of price comparisons is attached.

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 23, 2013, 09:18 PM
Designing something...
United States, CA, Cameron Park
Joined Jan 2004
1,680 Posts
Interesting! The last time (about a year ago) I got .4mm and .8mm birch ply I paid ~$37 and ~$21 respectively for 48" X 48" sheets. The down side is that I had to pick it up down in LA since the company only ships via freight ($$$) and if you buy less than 50 sheets of either you have to pay an additional $50 per order to " break the bundle". Since I was down there and I bought a lot it worked out okay.

Brian
cpdude is offline Find More Posts by cpdude
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 23, 2013, 11:05 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
Good pricing! Of course quantity buying and no shipping helps; just don't count the gas. I paid over $20 for a 3/32x12x24 sheet of birch ply in the hobby shop several months ago because I had to have it to continue working on a project. Ouch!

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Reply With Quote
Old Feb 24, 2013, 12:21 AM
Registered User
Joined Jul 2006
143 Posts
Scott

At 5.5 metre span the .6mm ply might be just the ticket for the wings. I have found that 1/64" ply must be supported ever 1-1/2" or so by framework of some kind or it sags and creates quite a dimpled or uneven surface.
I visited the transport museum in Lucerne Switzerland a number of years ago. They had a Minimoa hanging from the ceiling very close to a balcony where you could get a very close look. The glider had so many bumps and wavers in it's finish that since then I have never worried about a perfectly smooth finish in my models. I think vintage models are finished far more smoothly than their prototype.

Fred
Fred China is offline Find More Posts by Fred China
Reply With Quote
Old Mar 07, 2013, 06:25 PM
Registered User
Utah, USA
Joined Jun 2007
601 Posts
Re: Post #5

I just received 3 sheets, 60x60 inch, 0.6mm Finnish aircraft plywood. They took $10 off per sheet because of some edge damage (which is not very bad). Shipping was $35 via UPS and should be the same up to about 5 sheets. So the final cost with shipping was $2.87 per square foot.
If you only ordered one sheet, same shipping, the cost would be $3.80 to $4.20 per sq.ft., depending on final sheet price ($60-70/sheet).

Scott
shinck is online now Find More Posts by shinck
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale 6mm 5-ply Birch plywood Chad Veich Aircraft - General - Miscellaneous (FS/W) 20 Jan 27, 2013 09:26 PM
Wanted Omega Aircraft 6mm Replacement Bolt-On Prop Adapter jimmy34256 Aircraft - Electric - Power Systems (FS/W) 2 Jan 27, 2013 07:01 PM
Sold Scorpions Pinion Gear 10T,11T,12T 6MM Module 1.0 zzr Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 5 Sep 24, 2012 01:51 PM
For Sale 30x30mm 550TVL 0.01Lux 3.6mm Board Lens Ex-View Mini Camera kevinlib FPV Equipment (FS/W) 2 Oct 24, 2011 12:09 PM
For Sale NIB RevCo Pinion for Trex 700 - 1.0 Mod 12T 6mm Jim Ryan Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 0 Apr 17, 2011 04:17 PM