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Old Feb 13, 2013, 07:55 PM
KE your cub.
Curare's Avatar
in the gutter, again....
Joined Jun 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcaldwel View Post
What do you mean by "work"? It appears to still have wings...

Fortunately, on a fuselage "wing" with that low an aspect ratio the lift curve is so shallow it never really makes much lift (and therefore induced drag) before the wings stall.

Kevin
Mark Sorrell Designed the hipebipe around a wing shaped fuselage, and in doing so was able to reduce the wing area of the aircraft overall. Whether the lift is gained by ski effect or bernoulli (I"m not getting into an argument on downwash) is kind of immaterial, as the effect is certainly there.

It does work, I was making a joke.
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Old Feb 13, 2013, 10:14 PM
B for Bruce
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The 'Wack, BC, Canada
Joined Oct 2002
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I tried to find some images of the Hyperbipe running in airshows with smoke from the engine. No luck. But I think if there were any where the plane was pulling any amount of G that the smoke would be greatly curling around the coners of that fuselage to the point where the lift it makes is rather draggy lift.

Does it lift? Most certainly. ANY body with any width will provide SOME lift. I'll bet that the lift from the fuselage of an airliner is significant. But the key is how much drag is associated with that lift. And frankly I'm willing to bet that the Hyperbipe would fly better with less "speed bleed" under high G if it had a regular streamlined fuselage.
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Old Feb 13, 2013, 11:49 PM
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Malaysia, Selangor, Kajang
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As for the questions posed by the OP. I think the only good way to find out is to build a model and place one in a wind tunnel.

The second best option is to model it using CFD. But you'll still need to verify it with a wind tunnel because not many CFD programs are designed to test lifting bodies and the errors caused by assumptions made by the programmers tend to quickly build up for unconventional planforms.
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Old Feb 14, 2013, 08:59 AM
Sink stinks
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United States, GA, Atlanta
Joined Apr 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slebetman View Post
The second best option is to model it using CFD. But you'll still need to verify it with a wind tunnel because not many CFD programs are designed to test lifting bodies and the errors caused by assumptions made by the programmers tend to quickly build up for unconventional planforms.
That's only sort-of true. CFD isn't really limited by the shape of the object being studied, but instead by flow phenomena occurring. This is especially true for turbulence modeling, which is the main unsolved problem in CFD at the moment. Turbulence models are necessary because directly resolving all the turbulence in most practical aerospace applications would require a grid with way too many points to be solved in any reasonable amount of time. These turbulence models are validated for fairly specific flow regimes - generally like attached flow over an airfoil. The more the flow that you are simulating deviates from the validated case, the less confidence you will have in your turbulence model, and generally the less accurate it will be.

That said, a lifting fuselage shouldn't result in any flow behavior that is too unusual unless it is blunt or at high angle of attack. If it is streamlined and in the attached flow regime, the standard turbulence models should work fairly well, I would think.

Of course, I do agree that CFD does need to be validated, even in fairly "normal" flow regimes. Also, not all CFD codes are created equal. Just because you are running CFD doesn't necessarily mean your answer will be any better than something from some other method.
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Old Feb 28, 2013, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by mouna roy View Post
hi,
i want to know how a fuselage can work as a wing?where will be the induce drag create:tipside or bottom side??? how the induce drag can be minimize?? and by which shape i can get the max lift??? plz i need help i m working on a thesis......
You're a student right? You're asking other people to do you work for you? That's integrity for you.
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Old Mar 01, 2013, 02:34 AM
I don't like your altitude
Stupot46's Avatar
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Originally Posted by ssgtakeo View Post
You're a student right? You're asking other people to do you work for you? That's integrity for you.
It's called research.
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Old Mar 02, 2013, 08:16 AM
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Joined Oct 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouna roy View Post
hi,
i want to know how a fuselage can work as a wing?where will be the induce drag create:tipside or bottom side??? how the induce drag can be minimize?? and by which shape i can get the max lift??? plz i need help i m working on a thesis......
You miss the entire concept of a lifting body/device/wing.
ANY shape which creates a difference in pressure as it moves thru the air -will create lift
ANY SHAPE
Will it do it efficiently?
That is a totally different question.
The induced drag will shift as the angle at which the "shape' travels along the way --
there will always be a combination of lift and drag . as long as it is moving -relative to the surrounding air
ALWAYS
It is your job to sort out the correct shape for the particular task-
there is no one perfect shape .
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