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Old Feb 08, 2013, 06:34 AM
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who else dislikes GPS and or dislikes DJI

Hi guys , just a topic of discussion that I find interesting . Multirotors , quads especially are so unbelievably popular now so many rtf models available problem is I think for companies selling these kits is a lack of "appropriate" buyers . What do I mean by appropriate ? I mean somebody with RC background preferably airplanes or even better helicopters who also has electronics
background too.
Companies like DJI are solving this buy attemoting to make their products easy to fly using a lot of electronic wizardry involving GPS . This requires your copter to have a strong satelite lock before flying . I guess people believe that since navigation systems are ubiquitous nowadays that GPS on a RC model is an easy thing something to make flying easy. Other functions like auto leveling and altitude hold further complicate the issue of flying and also push the pilot further out of the pilot seat so to speak. My opinion is that most of these options are a disservice to the budding RC pilot and serve only to overcomplicate the setups. Other functions like home hold modes are even worse.

I feel like this is the wrong direction to be steering noobies , we should instead encourage newcomers to get simpler setups . I really dont like kits like the phantom as its selling an idea more than anything , and it aint cheap.

And am I the only person here who can't stand the name "spreading wings" ?
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 06:49 AM
Shipped to work. Wife safe.
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Canada, eh?
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Originally Posted by Steve34 View Post
...I really dont like kits likd the phantom as its selling an idea more than anything , and it aint cheap.
But it's SELLING. Don't kid yourself, it's not me, you, the principal, the hobby, this or that, it's about one thing... MONEY.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 06:56 AM
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I'll be completely honest tho I do love watching the numerous videos of S800's and F450's flying away never to be seen again .lol
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 06:59 AM
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But it's SELLING. Don't kid yourself, it's not me, you, the principal, the hobby, this or that, it's about one thing... MONEY.
Oh for sure your totally right , I just don't like how DJI is tearing down the barrier to entry just to make money.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 07:10 AM
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I've been looking at DJI products, particularly the F450 or Phantom. As a beginner (learning basics on a 1sq), what would you suggest as an alternative?
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 07:23 AM
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At that price there is nothing that comes close as far as I know. (When looking at the Phantom) The whole anti-DJI thing on this board is just silly.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by slovenian6474 View Post
I've been looking at DJI products, particularly the F450 or Phantom. As a beginner (learning basics on a 1sq), what would you suggest as an alternative?
In my opinion , and really that's all this is only my opinion , with that said I believe the absolute hands down best option in a RTF quad is the witespy quad from readytoflyquads.com and get one with a multiwii flight controller something like the Quadrino or the new version made for the Flip. Anything they put together is a lot better than what you will get from DJI. Have you seen how much plastic is on a phantom or Flamewheel? ok witespy is a busy guy and has something of a waiting list but its not long and you cant get such a nice machine anywhere else. Also teach yourself how to fly using a simulator any cp heli will train you to fly a quad theres no difference except the visual cues you get from a heli that aren't there on a quad because if its symmetrical design.

edit : also since a witespy quad is really a kit quad that has been assembled for you its very possible to do what I did which was learn how to build my own quad by "reverse engineering" the witespy build. Essentially learning about quads by taking apart a working quad. This not posible with a DJI Phantom to the same degree as a witespy quad and not possible at all with a flamewheel or S800 because they only come as kits.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 07:37 AM
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As a noob myself I agree with WiseDuck. We are just using what technology is readily available today. If that tech allows us to get in the hobby without having to sacrifice a few quads learning how to fly, why is that a bad thing?

As the hobby get more popular, I would argue that more and more people are going to be flying anyways, why not give them the benefit of learning with stability control and GPS lock rather then setting them lose with quads that are completely manual... that would seem significantly more dangerous to me.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve34 View Post
Hi guys , just a topic of discussion that I find interesting . Multirotors , quads especially are so unbelievably popular now so many rtf models available problem is I think for companies selling these kits is a lack of "appropriate" buyers . What do I mean by appropriate ? I mean somebody with RC background preferably airplanes or even better helicopters who also has electronics
background too.
Companies like DJI are solving this buy attemoting to make their products easy to fly using a lot of electronic wizardry involving GPS . This requires your copter to have a strong satelite lock before flying . I guess peoplr believe that since navigation systems are ubiquitous nowadays that GPS on a RC model is an easy thing something to make flying easy . Othe functions like suto levrling and altitude hold further complicate the issue of flyinv and also push ghe pilot further out of the pilot seat so to speak. My opinion is that most of these options are a disservice to the budding RC pilot and serve onky to overcomplicate the setups. Other functions like home hold modes are even worse.

I feel like this is the wrong direction to be steering

g noobies , we should instead encourage newcomers to get simpler setups . I really dont like kits likd the phantom as its selling an idea more than anything , and it aint cheap.

And am I the only person here who can't stand the name "spreading wings" ?
Aye,

albeit i have an rc background.

I am as happy as can be with my old simple trusty kk board (atmega 328p) No smoke and mirrors, it's gyro's only, and human ability, no accelerometers, gps,barometer,sonar and whatnot.

With all those gizmo's i will never fly quads because it will bore me beyond stiff, only reason to have them is if you do uav, or for a backup safety when doing fpv (like in rc signal loss or something similiar)

although i'm thinking about getting the new kk with self levelling someday, simply in case of a loss of orientation, i hate flying with it on and would rather play golf before flying with those gizmos added. (and you know how boring i find golf right lol...)
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 07:58 AM
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The RTF Flip from Witespy is a nice setup for beginners.....or guys that want to throw something around sky. The DJI Phantom in my mind, is overpriced. Frame is limited and limiting. You are not going to be able to use the Tx for anything else. DJI has to be making a killing of the plastic frame and toy TX.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 08:01 AM
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I'll be completely honest tho I do love watching the numerous videos of S800's and F450's flying away never to be seen again .lol
That's funny! I have NEVER had a problem with my F450! , I had a stroke and boring is something I need as my concentration is not what it used to be. The NAZA was wonderful and fit my needs
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 08:03 AM
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For a noob, if you build it yourself, you will also be able to fix it yourself when you crash it.

Everything you need to know is in the Mega Link sticky thread at the top of this forum. What you can't find, just ask.


DJI is in business. If they did not explore all avenues to increase profits, then they would be a bad business. The Phantom is cute but will not be easy to fix. It is a toy for those that do not want to build anything or learn all of the parts inside.

Flying multi's shouldn't only be for those that have the electronic skills to build them. You probably can't build a car from scratch but I am sure that you drive one. Same thing.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve34 View Post
Oh for sure your totally right , I just don't like how DJI is tearing down the barrier to entry just to make money.
No, DJI is tearing down the barrier so more people can easily enter the world of multirotors. Even just a few years ago, multirotors were things that were built from scratch and assembled mostly as home-built kits. Either that or they were extremely high-end prefabricated machines that cost an arm and a leg. DJI has make that affordable and simple with the F350/450 and the Phantom.

There were many members of the multirotor forums that looked down their noses at those that didn't assemble their multi out of spare parts, open-source software, and Nintendo Wii controllers. Thankfully those members are no longer here, for the most part. Between them and the intimidation factor of trying to piece together a home-built multi, many wouldn't have entered the wonderful world of multirotors if it wasn't for DJI, and other companies that offer a turn-key solution.

So I say, hooray to you DJI for making a product that allows me to fly a quad with a minimal amount of fuss. And quite affordable too, in my opinion. My F450 with a Naza-M controller and GPS was $560. That's a fair price, in my opinion, for what you get. There's an amazing amount of technology packed into my F450 and franky I think all of that for less than $600 is pretty good.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 08:17 AM
I hate waiting for parts
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Originally Posted by franke View Post
For a noob, if you build it yourself, you will also be able to fix it yourself when you crash it.

Everything you need to know is in the Mega Link sticky thread at the top of this forum. What you can't find, just ask.


DJI is in business. If they did not explore all avenues to increase profits, then they would be a bad business. The Phantom is cute but will not be easy to fix. It is a toy for those that do not want to build anything or learn all of the parts inside.

Flying multi's shouldn't only be for those that have the electronic skills to build them. You probably can't build a car from scratch but I am sure that you drive one. Same thing.
And 1000 Internets to you too, sir. Multirotors used to be a segment of the hobby that was reserved for tinkerers and electrical engineers. DJI (and other companies like them) have helped smash that barrier and make it easy/affordable for almost everyone.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 08:24 AM
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Interesting discussion. I'm a noob to multirotor but not to RC... been building and flying since the mid 80s including some early electric helis (Baron Whisper, etc)

Seeing all the negativity toward this is amazing. I bought the F550 to do some photography of other models in flight from different vantage points with my GoPro. It works great. My 8 year old can fly it. Yes, there are incidents. Yes, some people with more money than brains buy complex r/c models with alot of electronics on board and turn them to dust or watch them on FPV as they disappear across the horizon. It's that way in every aspect of sports and leisure. Ever see the guy with a $600 driver hit six balls in a row OB? I have. It's funny. Nobody dies. Enjoy the laugh and move on.

What I see from DJI is a well built product that's affordable and easy to build. I got mine off the UPS truck about 5:30 one day and flew it before dark that night. Phantoms get in the air quicker than that from what I've seen. These things are selling like crazy, and most of them I see go to people who already know how to fly helis or airplanes. I'm still learning the ins and outs of mine but I have several hours of flying on it and plan to put alot more in. I have NAZA with GPS and landing gear with a camera gimbal, telemetry, FPV, and I can't stop adding to it.

I'm one of these "noobs" as you call us... with no multirotor experience prior to my F550 and honestly if it weren't for the way DJI packages this stuff up, I probably would still be flying ONLY gliders.
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