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Old Feb 01, 2013, 10:51 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Walton Beach
Joined Jan 2013
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Build Log
1/90 No Sea Trawler Windlass & Trawal Windlass pictures

Lindburg North Sea Trawler, rc kit bash

Building the hull consists of 6 parts. 1)color Sanding the hull, 2)removing the lower rub rail,3)rebuiiding the prop and rudder areas, 4)install engineering plant - batt trough - 3 stage motor mount - stuffing box - robbe style rudder - ultra mini servo - ESC w/receiver wires - Futaba mini receiver - thru deck i/o switch 5)paint hull 2 colors and waterline/boot, 6)attach (detached) fore deck - with evergreen stanchion bases w/brass 2 ball stanchions - fore jack staff - rebuilt windlass winch - gear locker - kit fore deck furniture - eyelets (eyebolts) - and a few odds & sods.

I need pictures of real winchs, I am not happy with the kit issue
Windlass Fore deck Anchor winch, Work deck Trawl winch

I need further advice per servo motors and appropriate Futaba friendly ESC
Assume using Futaba (hi quality) servo
1.75 +/- ish lbs. load
5-10v 4 6 or 8 nicad batts AA 1.25v
docking speed, varible range cruising speeds, emergancy get out way like
didi quick speed

Given the effort and cost of this model I shouldn't be chary of what the motor & ESC cost if it gets it right the first time. I have designed a 3 stage engine mount
1st permenent deck 2nd removable deck 3rd replacable mount per upgrade max engine can size .75" preferred .50" or less

I have never used a digital camera, loaded pix to a computer, and somehow get'em to this site... gimmie a week or so and I'll try to get pix here.
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Old Feb 01, 2013, 11:33 PM
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Umi_Ryuzuki's Avatar
PDX, OR
Joined Dec 2002
10,423 Posts
It is a good idea to keep your questions regarding any single build in one thread.
That way we can follow the progress of your build.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1819976

You can book mark your thread as a Favorite using your Browser, that is another way to
always be able to find it. Also Since you are the topic starter, you can edit your first post
and change the title of your thread.

____________________________________


Here is a "tutorial" on how to upload pictures.
Size matters, so typically 800 pixels(11 inches) or less in the largest dimension will work.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=610209
_______________________________________
.

Winch images are readily available, just sort of era dependant.
http://www.google.com/search?q=windl...w=1052&bih=666

.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c...mg.i8eCT_S_egA

Harbor Models offers a nice variety of ESC.
A lot of use the Mtroniks brand as they are compact and have a nice response.
http://www.harbormodels.com/site08/m...d_controls.htm


.
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Old Feb 02, 2013, 08:58 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Walton Beach
Joined Jan 2013
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Winch Pix sites unfound

The two winch site were unfound. I carefully reviewed the address's, but both the address's come back not found. http://www.google.com/search?hl=wndl...w=1052&bih=666 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c...mg18eCT_S_egA
Thank you very much for your effort.

I went to harbormodels. Most of the ESC's large and/or 12v. I didn"t find the one you mentioned. They did have a Robbe Rudder. As above, thank you very much.

Any more hints per servo motors? Is there a formula - rpm load power-voltage
that would help for selecting a unit? I know there are some monsters (sail winches). I'd like a motor can of 1/2" or 5/8" 3/4" if I had to. If I did end with some what more motor than I need, would a really good small ESC be able to tone motor down to docking (very slow) and still have medium and emergancy?

The camera went away for a while. Maybe pix in a week or so. I can't paint the lower hull until the stuffing box, and rudder are in. There are lots of pre-assemblies I can play with, while I wait for the elements of the drive plant.











thank you very much
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 03:06 AM
Sea Dragon-Lover
Umi_Ryuzuki's Avatar
PDX, OR
Joined Dec 2002
10,423 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Umi_Ryuzuki View Post

...

____________________________________


Here is a "tutorial" on how to upload pictures.
Size matters, so typically 800 pixels(11 inches) or less in the largest dimension will work.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=610209
_______________________________________
.

Winch images are readily available, just sort of era dependant.
http://www.google.com/search?q=windl...w=1052&bih=666

.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c...mg.i8eCT_S_egA

Harbor Models offers a nice variety of ESC.
A lot of use the Mtroniks brand as they are compact and have a nice response.
http://www.harbormodels.com/site08/m...d_controls.htm


.


Interesting, as clicking on any of the links I provided above works for me.
Are you trying to copy and paste the URL addresses? The forum shortens the link text, but clicking on the
blue text should open a new tab, or right click and open in a new window.

The link under Harbor models show all the Mtroniks Viper, and Mirror ESC on the page.




If you can't click on the links, then go to the GOOGLE web page, and search
WINDLASS WINCH then click on the search IMAGES

The second search was STEAM WINDLASS WINCH

GOOGLE will then show you hundreds of images of ship winches.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 06:50 AM
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Blackpool, Lancs
Joined Feb 2006
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Quote:
I need further advice per servo motors and appropriate Futaba friendly ESC
Assume using Futaba (hi quality) servo
1.75 +/- ish lbs. load
5-10v 4 6 or 8 nicad batts AA 1.25v
docking speed, varible range cruising speeds, emergancy get out way like
didi quick speed
I feel that you are imagining too many problems that do not exist, and possibly missing out on some that do. The answer to the really important 1st question is "It must weigh 18oz all up when finished".
Most decent modern ESCs have good control at all speeds. One or two dont have good low speed response. The Mtronics microviper marine10
http://www.mtroniks.net/details1.asp...r-marine10.htm
is a good candidate, will handle a wide range of voltage and any suitable motor for this size of model. Toning down the power? That is exactly what the ESC does, but only in conjunction with the stick on the transmitter and the person operating it. Some people are unaware that the stick has many positions between off and full on.
A "proper" motor would be something like the Graupner Microperm. The motor I first used in mine was recovered from a dead CD player, and worked well until some ham fisted lump sank it with a passing lifeboat, after which I used a motor recovered from a servo. Considering that I was using a servo electronics board as a speed control. this was no surprise.
BTW, before you get too technical with motor and servo mounting in a boat this size and power, Blu-tak is wonderful stuff.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 03:05 PM
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United States, FL, Fort Walton Beach
Joined Jan 2013
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Dear Umi
Boy Howdy, Lord




Dear Umi Boy Howdy, Dang, I have never used images before. Lots and lots annnd more of both kinds kinds of winches. I have a preliminary hi-bred drawing of the Trawl winch which is pretty darn good. Muchus thankus.
Any body pix per deck water tank, I a have rectangular one (rounded bottom on kinda skids)? What is & where is Blu-tak? 1st day here I saw something about a gloryoski super duper masking tape. I need a liquid mask, I've tried several... but they don't peel off worth a darn.
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 06:39 AM
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Blu-tak. Sticky, rubbery non setting putty found in office supply shops. Confusingly, available in other colours. Often used for sticking paper to walls, us modellers tend to see other uses for things like that. From the same source, paper clips are a handy source of plated steel wire, ideal for things like rudder linkages. Remember that when making models, model shops are not the only source of material. It's also worth keeping in mind that the main purpose of the structure of the model is that it is a means of keeping the paint the right shape, the paint being what you see, mostly.
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 11:30 PM
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I was wondering how one measures what a servo motor is capable of? Apparently
thrust is measured in g's and amp's. "G" equals grams, I think. Does thrust equal torque? I was told a Robbe Roxxy Outrunner x 2 amp, had 200g and would run a 1.75 lb. boat. So "if" thrust = torque is valid, then could Futaba tech support tell me which engine of theirs is 200g torque i.e. thrust, and is less than a 1" engine can? I also ran into a programable ESC. Does that mean I get longer servo horn (forward) throw?
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 01:26 AM
Sometimes I am the weapon
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South Korea, Gyeonggi-do, Ansan-si
Joined Jan 2006
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Lots of photos of side trawlers exist on the Fleetwood Motor Trawlers site.

I have not looked specifically for images of the trawl winch, and I'm sure there's more resources there, but the pics of the Boston Seafire show pretty good images of one. Even though it is covered in rust, the detail is there. Boston Seafire's winch is identical to the Lindberg trawler. You will find Lindberg got it right in the overall basic shape, even down to the "A" frame support brackets on either end.
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 01:38 AM
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Things I look for in Servos are
operating speed, how quick and
Output torque in torque/in, or kg/cm

Servos aren't typically labeled as out or in running.
but most are brushed "inrunner" motors at 4.8v -6.0v.
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 04:15 AM
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I feel that the OP is thinking too deeply and trying to solve problems that don't exist. If he finds a servo that physically fits the space available, it will do the job of moving the rudder as long as he remembers to have the tiller arm the same length as the servo arm. Similarly with the drive motor. This is not a boat built for ultimate racing performance, but a displacement hull where high performance is not required. TLAR will work just fine, obsessing about numbers won't, mostly because those numbers are simply not there.
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 05:08 AM
Sometimes I am the weapon
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South Korea, Gyeonggi-do, Ansan-si
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I fail to see why you deem so much work be put into this RC conversion. This is one of the easiest models to convert: there's so much room inside! As for the exterior, why do you need to remove the lower rub rail and why rebuild the prop rudder area? I kept the prop "skeg" largely intact, just removed the vertical beam directly aft of the prop as the brass 1/8" rudder shaft sits there now. The kit prop is ideal; I only sharpened the blade's leading edges on mine for esthetic reasons. Painted it a bronze color and voilą. Same goes for painting the rest of the ship. That's where the real work lies I think. This model has tons more detail than its contemporary, the Revell Northsea Fishing Trawler, and it screams for some artistry in the paint scheme.

As far as rudder servos go for this trawler, it matters not how fast the servo operates as Umi indicates; for scale operation and purposes, how many times have you seen a full size vessel able to slam its rudder port to starboard and back again almost instantaneously? I'd like to try that ACTion Electronics servo morph for things such as this, but I can control my thumb pretty well all the same.
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 05:08 AM
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Joined Mar 2007
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Quote:
I did discover a fascinating question Robbe rates its motors by (I think it was amps) and thrust. For example; 2 amps x 200g. I assume "g" is grams. Does torque equate thrust? I know must of a servos torque comes from the gear ratio, but ... when they designed the gear pattern, would'nt one need the engine torque specs to coorectly extrapolate the gear the gear pattern. I can be found at No Sea Trawler.
The Robbe motor is referring to the thrust (in grams) it produces utilising an aircraft prop i.e. the amount of thrust/pull it has to lift a plane into the air and the amp draw to achieve it. Its your propulsion motor to turn the propeller

Torque in reference to servos is a different measurement, its the amount of weight the servo can move basically, the higher the number the more it can push against a counteracting force. for model boats your basic standard servo will operate 95% of scale boats rudders with no problem

Back to the propulsion motor, the power required depends on the size of the prop and how fast you want to go, check out this article I wrote for our club to explain motors like the Roxxy motor You are looking at.

Cheers
Nick
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Old Feb 23, 2013, 03:53 AM
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Checked your article and saw that it was well-written and in pdf format, definitely a bonus.

Bump for the OP (who may not know the whereabouts of this thread).
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Old Feb 24, 2014, 07:42 AM
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South Korea, Gyeonggi-do, Ansan-si
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Hope we didn't scare off the OP.

I would welcome a technological tour de force in the form of a converted Lindberg Trawler and with all the bells and whistles. Just that only minor efforts are needed to get the boat on the water if that were the only goal. Ran across an ACTion Electronics lights and smoke effects setup for the Lindberg tug but I fear the component weight would swamp the model. Does this package look feasible?

Suggested Installation in Lindberg Diesel Tug
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