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Old Jan 31, 2013, 04:13 AM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
1,395 Posts
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Originally Posted by logan5 View Post
Apparently wearing a seatbelt is also living in fear .... Or wearing a helmet for that matter. Heck if risk mitigation is living in fear .... Then why are all the progressives so hellbent for getting free condoms and birth control pills? YOLO!
Of course it is! Your are preparing to mitigate something that you are fearful of happening! (Although it's confused by the need to obey the laws, whatever your perception is).

Otherwise what are you doing it for? Preparing for something that won't happen or that will cause you to die from ultimate ecstasy?

It's all about levels of (often perceived, rather than real) risk. And if you guys believe the level of risk of your wives being raped, you being killed etc is that high, then I'm sad for you.

P.S. My wife also refuses to wear a cycle helmet. Her response is that she's old enough (and ugly enough... OK, my words.. ) to decide for herself.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 04:21 AM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
1,395 Posts
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Originally Posted by micro_builder View Post
His reasoning seems to be the same as a person buying a fire extinguisher because they realize there is some chance that a fire could happen. Better safe than sorry is not the same as living in fear. IMO.
It's just attempting to mitigate the fear of something actually happening.

(Especially as there is no such thing as 'safe' - it's a myth!) And there is "some chance" that a lorry could drive into my house (the road is a few feet in front of my house), or of an electrical fire, a gas explosion, a plane crashing into it (I'm under the flight path of the local International airport), the ceiling collapsing on us or ....

I give 99% of them no thought.

P.S. I also don't have a fire extinguisher and not had one for around 40 years - as mentioned in a discussion before. And never carried one in the car, either.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 05:37 AM
Let slip the dogs of war!
Park_Flyer's Avatar
United States, VA, Virginia Beach
Joined Jun 2005
1,738 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverJayhawk View Post
http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/30/health...html?hpt=hp_c2

A documented and known crazy purchases guns legally. Shoots mom in chest, cuts her up, barricades house and requires SWAT to end the situation.
Maybe large print will help . . .

The failure to ENFORCE the law does not mean the law is a failure.

How in the mind of some a failure of a system translates to "Welp, we need more laws" is beyond ludicrous.

The OP story is a symptom of the failure to use the existing system.

The 35% reduction in federal gun prosecutions is a failure to enforce the laws.

We need to fix the system by enforcing the existing laws.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 05:44 AM
Let slip the dogs of war!
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United States, VA, Virginia Beach
Joined Jun 2005
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The so called "gun show loophole" is another failure to enforce existing laws. This could be simply enforced by sending state troopers to a gun show to ask each vendor selling firearms for an FFL. The "occasional" seller should not be allowed to sell multiple firearms at a gun show without one. If the word "occasional" is too vague under the law, then that needs to be fixed, not by a new law, but by clarifying the existing one.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 05:54 AM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
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I absolutely agree with you, Park_Flyer that we rarely need new laws. More often it's enforcing the laws that already exist.

Unfortunately, it's new laws which are used to justify politicians being employed, it seems (and they use them as 'sound bites'. )
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 06:20 AM
Registered User
Houston Ellington, Texas, United States
Joined Feb 2001
312 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Park_Flyer View Post
The so called "gun show loophole" is another failure to enforce existing laws. This could be simply enforced by sending state troopers to a gun show to ask each vendor selling firearms for an FFL. The "occasional" seller should not be allowed to sell multiple firearms at a gun show without one. If the word "occasional" is too vague under the law, then that needs to be fixed, not by a new law, but by clarifying the existing one.
Exactly ... Enforcing current law makes more sense than writing new laws which will be subject to the same lack of enforcement.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 07:15 AM
Trons and Fumes
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Fallon, NV
Joined Mar 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Park_Flyer View Post
The so called "gun show loophole" is another failure to enforce existing laws. This could be simply enforced by sending state troopers to a gun show to ask each vendor selling firearms for an FFL. The "occasional" seller should not be allowed to sell multiple firearms at a gun show without one. If the word "occasional" is too vague under the law, then that needs to be fixed, not by a new law, but by clarifying the existing one.
An occasional seller can sell multiple firearms at a gun show.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Norman Adlam View Post
I absolutely agree with you, Park_Flyer that we rarely need new laws. More often it's enforcing the laws that already exist.

Unfortunately, it's new laws which are used to justify politicians being employed, it seems (and they use them as 'sound bites'. )
Welcome to the tea party Norman!
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 12:29 PM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
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Originally Posted by DT56 View Post
Welcome to the tea party Norman!
I like a nice cuppa tea!
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 03:59 PM
Let slip the dogs of war!
Park_Flyer's Avatar
United States, VA, Virginia Beach
Joined Jun 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrightme View Post
An occasional seller can sell multiple firearms at a gun show.
I can run up and down and the street in my birthday suit
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 07:17 PM
Trons and Fumes
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Fallon, NV
Joined Mar 2007
5,034 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Park_Flyer View Post
I can run up and down and the street in my birthday suit
Yet YOU could be arrested for that.

An individual at a gun show selling more than one gun, cannot be arrested for merely selling more than one gun.


Maybe if I restate it just a bit:

"An occasional seller can legally sell multiple firearms at a gun show. "
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 07:19 PM
Unrepentant Paragon addict
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United States, OK, Moore
Joined Jan 2006
2,603 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norman Adlam View Post
It's just attempting to mitigate the fear of something actually happening.

(Especially as there is no such thing as 'safe' - it's a myth!) And there is "some chance" that a lorry could drive into my house (the road is a few feet in front of my house), or of an electrical fire, a gas explosion, a plane crashing into it (I'm under the flight path of the local International airport), the ceiling collapsing on us or ....

I give 99% of them no thought.

P.S. I also don't have a fire extinguisher and not had one for around 40 years - as mentioned in a discussion before. And never carried one in the car, either.
Funny you should say that Norman. In one of my advanced classes in Aviation/Aerospace Safety systems, the simple question was posed.... what is the definition of safe?

Not really so easy to answer once you begin to mull it over.
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Old Jan 31, 2013, 07:52 PM
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Houston Ellington, Texas, United States
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Originally Posted by LVsoaring View Post
Funny you should say that Norman. In one of my advanced classes in Aviation/Aerospace Safety systems, the simple question was posed.... what is the definition of safe?

Not really so easy to answer once you begin to mull it over.
I certainly wouldn't want someone else to define for me what is safe. That's for me to decide in the end. In the UK, someone has decided for everyone that they are "safe enough" ... well, safe enough has bought them the highest violent crime rate in Europe and a rate of rape higher than the US ...
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Old Feb 01, 2013, 04:26 AM
Official Old Git!
Hampshire, UK
Joined Sep 2000
1,395 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by logan5 View Post
I certainly wouldn't want someone else to define for me what is safe. That's for me to decide in the end. In the UK, someone has decided for everyone that they are "safe enough" ... well, safe enough has bought them the highest violent crime rate in Europe and a rate of rape higher than the US ...
You do love to trot out complete BS, logan5..

As for the figures, I dunno... but Wiki says that the USA was consistently higher (per 100,000 pop) than the UK until 2010, although the figures have always been close-ish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_statistics

How's your 'freedoms' with all your much vaunted 'gun-love' working out for you - and your women folk?
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Old Feb 01, 2013, 10:50 AM
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madsci_guy's Avatar
North Texas
Joined Nov 2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norman Adlam View Post
How's your 'freedoms' with all your much vaunted 'gun-love' working out for you - and your women folk?
Lessee....... Fair use of copyrighted material.

Quote:
A 63-year-old woman suffering from congestive heart failure and arthritis was asleep at home in Bessemer, Ala. when an armed intruder came into her bedroom. The home invader demanded that the woman hand over money and jewelry, and when she didn’t comply, he drew a keyhole saw and cut her on her stomach and arm. Eventually, one of the woman’s seven dogs alerted a guest staying at the home to the commotion. The guest distracted the criminal long enough for the woman to retrieve a .44-caliber revolver and shoot the criminal, who fled the scene. (The Birmingham News, Birmingham, Ala. October 30, 2012)
Quote:
A mother of two was home with her children in Loganville, Ga. when she heard a repeated knocking at the door. Concerned, the mother called her husband, who told her to “get the kids and hide.” The mother complied, retrieving a gun and taking her children to a crawlspace. ...The home invader opened the crawlspace door, at which point the mother fired six shots from a .38-caliber revolver, striking the criminal five times. (The Atlanta Journal Constitution, Atlanta, Ga. 01/04/13)
Quote:
Two masked and armed criminals entered Joyeria Vanessa jewelry store in San Jose, Calif. and demanded money from the owner. In response, the owner retrieved a pistol and fired at the robbers. The shots missed, but sent the criminals fleeing to a nearby getaway car. (KGO-TV, San Francisco, Calif. 11/26/2012)
Quote:
A woman was at home with her three-year-old son in Wyandotte, Okla. when she was awakened by a knock on her door. The homeowner peered outside, noticed a strange man at her door and retrieved a .22-caliber pistol. The man then began breaking into the home, making it through one of two locked doors; at which point the woman opened the inside door and fired a shot at the criminal. (The Joplin Globe, Joplin, Mo. 11/21/12)
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A pair of armed intruders entered a home in St. Helena Island, S.C. and attempted to rob the 31-year-old woman who lives there. The homeowner responded by retrieving a gun and firing at the criminals, striking one and causing both to flee. The wounded criminal was discovered when he turned up at the Savannah Memorial University Medical Center seeking treatment; the other was captured a day later. The home invaders face charges of armed robbery and attempted murder. (The Beaufort Gazette, Beaufort, S.C. 10/30/12)
Quote:
12-year-old Kendra St. Clair was at home alone in Durant, Okla. when a man began banging on the front door. Frightened, Kendra called her mother at work, who told her to retrieve a .40-caliber pistol and to hide in the bathroom closet. Kendra complied, and after calling 911, heard the criminal break through a back door. After about six minutes inside the home, the intruder made it to the bathroom closet where Kendra was hiding. As the home invader attempted to open the closet, Kendra fired at the criminal, striking him and causing him to flee. Police captured the intruder a short time later and transported him to a hospital. (The Oklahoman, Oklahoma City, Okla. 10/19/12)
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A 22-year-old woman was at home alone in Dallas, Texas when a pair of home invaders, at least one of whom was armed, kicked in the front door. After retrieving a gun, the woman spotted the criminals as they were headed to the second floor of the house. The woman opened fire on the home invaders, striking one and causing both to flee. (NBC DFW, Dallas, Texas 10/18/12)
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A 70-year-old woman was asleep in her Fayette County, W.V. home, when she was awakened by her burglar alarm. After arming herself with a .38-caliber revolver, the woman went to investigate. When she found the burglar, the criminal punched her in the face. The woman responded by firing at the home invader, causing him to flee. (The Register-Herald, Beckley, W.V. 10/12/12)
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