HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Jan 30, 2013, 07:43 AM
Kit Manufacturer
coreman's Avatar
United States, MA, Southbridge
Joined Feb 2010
3,520 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealGambler View Post
Hard to tell from the picture if this one mesure DC amps or AC amps. You need something that mesure DC amps. But if I were you, I would buy a Wattmeter (check HobbyKing). Those cheap multimeter don't last long (particularly the probes), and give slow reading (one every second or so). With a wattmeter, designed for our hobby, you get instant result, and peak result (much more valuable). Trust me, much more valuable than a cheap multimeter!
Just make sure the one you buy will run on a single cell. Some of them can't power the LCD on 1S
coreman is online now Find More Posts by coreman
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Heading to the NEAT Fair
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Jan 30, 2013, 07:53 AM
Registered User
Gulf Breeze, FL
Joined Jul 2006
2,946 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by coreman View Post
...and RCBabbel recently said he had found a source also
Can you provide a link to his post or to his source?

Gene K
speedy01 is offline Find More Posts by speedy01
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 07:55 AM
Kit Manufacturer
coreman's Avatar
United States, MA, Southbridge
Joined Feb 2010
3,520 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy01 View Post
Can you provide a link to his post or to his source?

Gene K
he didn't reveal his source either. it's been in the last week in the SX motor thread. I think it was in response to someone asking about sending the burned out motors in
coreman is online now Find More Posts by coreman
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Heading to the NEAT Fair
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 08:04 AM
Master of Micro Modding
valiantGLX's Avatar
Australia, SA, Burra
Joined Sep 2011
2,544 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by chulian1819 View Post
Great idea!

what other engines can fit a UM but conected directly to the prop?
HobbyKing AP05 3000kv Brushless Micro Motor (5.4g)

C05M Micro brushless outrunner 11000kv


HobbyKing AP03 4000kv Brushless Micro Motor (3.1g)

hexTronik 5gram Brushless Outrunner 2000kv

AD-C5 Micro Motor 4.6g Weight 3700Kv

etc, etc....

The problem with direct drive is that you really need 2s to make any power, on 1s they aren''t much better than the stock brushed motors.

Thats why I have opted for a gearboxed inrunner for the ultimate 1s setup
valiantGLX is online now Find More Posts by valiantGLX
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 08:10 AM
Registered User
chulian1819's Avatar
Medellín, Colombia
Joined Apr 2010
327 Posts
Thank you valiantGLX! wich one you recomend for a UM? its better a 1s inruner with shaft or a 2s direct outrunner? weight/power ratio its better?
chulian1819 is offline Find More Posts by chulian1819
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 08:12 AM
Master of Micro Modding
valiantGLX's Avatar
Australia, SA, Burra
Joined Sep 2011
2,544 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealGambler View Post
Hard to tell from the picture if this one mesure DC amps or AC amps. You need something that mesure DC amps. But if I were you, I would buy a Wattmeter (check HobbyKing). Those cheap multimeter don't last long (particularly the probes), and give slow reading (one every second or so). With a wattmeter, designed for our hobby, you get instant result, and peak result (much more valuable). Trust me, much more valuable than a cheap multimeter!
Those watt meters are pretty expensive, and I would only use it for this purpose.

However I have hundreds of applications for a multimeter.

Here's the actual one I want to buy: http://www.ebay.de/itm/350505278444?...84.m1423.l2649

Most of the page is in german, but the specs read in any language, looks like it would do alternating currents too
valiantGLX is online now Find More Posts by valiantGLX
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 08:14 AM
Master of Micro Modding
valiantGLX's Avatar
Australia, SA, Burra
Joined Sep 2011
2,544 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by chulian1819 View Post
Thank you valiantGLX! wich one you recomend for a UM? its better a 1s inruner with shaft or a 2s direct outrunner? weight/power ratio its better?
No worries mate.

I cant recommend any particular one, because I havent tried any. However I hear good thing about the AP05

With a 5030 prop on 2s you apparently get 110g of thrust

The inrunner gearboxed setup weighs 4.7g, the ESC (which I hope works) weighs 0.7g, and a large 260mah 1s lipo weighs 6.5g. Not sure how much thrust it will make yet lets just say 70g

The AP05 is 5.4g, a good 2s ESC weighs 6g, 2s 260mah weighs 14g. But makes lets just say 100g of thrust (I think 110g is a bit optimistic).

1s setup ca. 10g
2s setup ca. 26g (dont forget to add a few grams for a strong motor mount) 28-30g in the end

Which ones better depends on your plane, how you want to fly it and wing loading.

For the average PZ UM lets say an average weight of 40g (in the air).........
1s 260mah BL setup will make it 43 - 45g with around 70g of thrust
2s 260mah BL setup will make it 65 - 68g with 100g of thrust

The 1s BL setup will have less wing loading so power off landings should be possible, it will be easier to fly, yet very aerobatic. However the top speed will be less than 2s.
The 2s BL setup will have a lot more wing loading so you will have to fly it fast to keep it in the air, and landings will need to be attempted at speed. Also it will be less aerobatic and you'll have to keep a close eye on the wings when bank and yanking, with the added weight and speed you could tear the flimsy wings right off your plane. If you only want to do high speed runs, and fly your plane more like a rocket this setup is for you
valiantGLX is online now Find More Posts by valiantGLX
Last edited by valiantGLX; Jan 30, 2013 at 10:04 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 08:21 AM
Kit Manufacturer
coreman's Avatar
United States, MA, Southbridge
Joined Feb 2010
3,520 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by valiantGLX View Post
No worries mate.

I cant recommend any particular one, because I havent tried any. However I hear good thing about the AP05

With a 5030 prop on 2s you apparently get 110g of thrust
Yeah, I have tried most of the ones you listed on 1S and none of them are an improvement. I am really hoping this setup works out
coreman is online now Find More Posts by coreman
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Heading to the NEAT Fair
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 08:30 AM
Registered User
davereap's Avatar
Ashford. Kent. England
Joined Feb 2005
6,874 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by valiantGLX View Post
I am looking at buying a cheap multimeter, does any one know how I can test the amp draw with one (assuming that my ESC was here already)???

Check what it says on the meter... the one ive got that is also bright yellow has 3 probe sockets one does 10A max the other two do the normal readings...and the selector dial has a location that says 10A
on your pic it only shows 2 probe sockets so have a care...

A watt meter definately the better bit of kit to purchase.. later a tacho helps

both types of meter go into the line between the battery and the motor..the watt meter is easy because you just plug in the battery to one end..then take the other ends connector to the esc... no holding probes..
davereap is offline Find More Posts by davereap
Last edited by davereap; Jan 30, 2013 at 08:36 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 09:43 AM
Registered User
brushless55's Avatar
United States, CO, Longmont
Joined Nov 2011
3,345 Posts
looking forward to seeing the flying video
brushless55 is offline Find More Posts by brushless55
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 10:18 AM
when down=up, up=expensive
whichwaysup's Avatar
United States, VA, Roanoke
Joined Apr 2012
2,669 Posts
I sure hope HH is spying on this thread!
whichwaysup is offline Find More Posts by whichwaysup
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Clever sayings
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 11:09 AM
miataman
miatamama's Avatar
Erie Pa.
Joined Oct 2007
667 Posts
Hi! I am running the APO5 5000kv motors. Is said they push 90grams thrust with a 300 mah single cell. I dont use a scale for measuring thrust. I use a gram guage so may be the difference. I get 72 grams of thrust with one of Microaces units with their Esc and 71 grams from a HK APO5 3000kv wired for 5000 kv and using the HK 3amp esc. so far working as well as the more expensive 7 amp esc.

JCS
miatamama is offline Find More Posts by miatamama
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 11:55 AM
Master of Micro Modding
valiantGLX's Avatar
Australia, SA, Burra
Joined Sep 2011
2,544 Posts
A bit of digging around brought me to this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1549707&page=2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladimir88 View Post
Here are the results of my practical measurements of thrust motor AP05 KV5000.

1) Prop "GWS 5030"

a) U= 3,5 V
- 63 grams (ESC "XP-7A"; I mot = 3,60 A; Eff = 5,40 g/W);
- 66 grams (ESC "XP-12A"; I mot = 3,83 A; Eff = 4,92 g/W);
- 68 grams (ESC "TMM-0703-3"; I mot = 3,60 A; Eff = 5,40 g/W);

b) U= 3,7 V
- 69 grams (ESC "XP-7A"; I mot = 3,64 A; Eff = 5,12 g/W);
- 75 grams (ESC "XP-12A"; I mot = 4,22 A; Eff = 4,80 g/W);
- 75 grams (ESC "TMM-0703-3"; I mot = 3,86 A; Eff = 5,25 g/W);

2) Prop "GWS 4530"

U= 3,5 V
- 56 grams (ESC "XP-7A"; I mot = 3,12 A; Eff = 5,13 g/W);
- 59 grams (ESC "XP-12A"; I mot = 3,57 A; Eff = 4,72 g/W);
- 59 grams (ESC "TMM-0703-3"; I mot = 3,37 A; Eff = 5,00 g/W)

3) Prop "GWS 4025"

U= 3,5 V
- 48 grams (ESC "XP-7A"; I mot = 2,55 A; Eff = 5,38 g/W);
- 51 grams (ESC "XP-12A"; I mot = 2,95 A; Eff = 4,93 g/W);
- 50 grams (ESC "TMM-0703-3"; I mot = 2,75 A; Eff = 5,19 g/W)


Actual weight motor - 5,80 gr.
Winding resistance - 0,175 Ohms.
This Vladimir chap sounded pretty interesting, so I checked out where he posts the most and found this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1207845

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladimir88 View Post
I apologize for my bad English, I use the electronic translator.

This theme is aimed at creating gearbox with brushless motors powered only from 1-Cell (1S).
This theme is for those who are not satisfied with the parametres of motors (even the very best that you can buy today).


[I]I think many people afraid to do their own gearbox.
In my opinion it is much easier that you are able to do.
You only need three main things:
1 - desire to do;
2 - drilling Machine;
3 - reamers.

Desirable to have a extra tool :
MICRO miller MF 70 - http://www.proxxon.com/eng/html/27110.php
Scroll saw DS 230/E- [http://www.proxxon.com/eng/html/27088.php

List of important information located in this topic:

1. List of parts for gearbox- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=56

2. My opinion on the use of propellers- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=120

3. Gearbox C05M(3:1)A (mounting system in Mustang P51D).
Weight- 5,35 gr., thrust - 83 gr.(3,7 V; 3,8 A; prop-130x70mm).
The description here after the list here after the list.

4. Gearbox HP03S(4:1)A (mounting system in Mustang P51D).
Weight- 4,50 gr., thrust - 72 gr.(3,7 V; 3,3 A; prop-130x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=31

5. Installing Gearbox HP03S(4:1)A in Mustang P51-D.
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=38


6. Gearbox HP03S(4:1)B (mounting system with carbon tube).
Weight- 4,40 gr., thrust - 72 gr.(3,7 V; 3,3 A; prop-130x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=45

7. Gearbox HP03S(5:1)A (mounting system with carbon tube).
Weight- 4,60 gr., thrust - 80 gr.(3,7 V; 3,0 A; prop-160x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...3&postcount=49

8. Gearbox HP03TR(5:1)B (ultra-light design mounting system).
Weight- 3,70 gr., thrust - 80 gr.(3,7 V; 3,0 A; prop-160x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...8&postcount=63

9. Installation Gearbox HP03TR(5:1)B on "Ultra micro 4 - Site".
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=67


10. Gearbox HP03TR(4:1)C (mounting system in Su-26).
Weight- 4,10 gr., thrust - 72 gr.(3,7 V; 3,3 A; prop-130x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=84

11. Gearbox HP03TR(4:1)D (ultra-light design mounting system in Su-26).
Weight- 3,70 gr., thrust - 72 gr.(3,7 V; 3,3 A; prop-130x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=101

12. Gearbox HP02TR(4:1)B (ultra-light design mounting system).
Weight- 2,50 gr., thrust - 35 gr.(3,7 V; 1,5 A; prop-140x45mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=103

13. Gearbox HP02TR2(6:1)A (ultra-light design mounting system).
Weight- 2,50 gr., thrust - 40 gr.(3,7 V; 1,7 A; prop-140x45mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=117

14. Gearbox HP06V2(5:1)A (ultra powerful).
Weight- 7,93 gr., thrust - 140 gr.(3,7 V; 5,7 A; prop-GWS 8 x 4).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=118.

15. Gearbox HP02TR4(6:1)B (ultra-light design mounting system).
Weight- 2,20 gr., thrust - 40 gr.(3,7 V; 1,45 A; prop-140x45mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=127

16. Gearbox HP02TR5(6,7:1)C (ultra-light design mounting system).
Weight- 2,50 gr., thrust - 46 gr.(3,7 V; 1,84 A; prop- MCF6030SS).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=130

17. Gearbox HP03TR6(6,7:1)F (with good efficiency).
Weight- 3,60 gr., thrust - 67 gr.(3,7 V; 2,44 A; prop- 130x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=154

18. Gearbox HP05S1(4:1)E (with very good efficiency and big thrust).
Weight- 5,80 gr., thrust - 100 gr.(3,7 V; 3,28 A; prop- 160x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=158

19. Gearbox HP03TR7(6,7:1)F & HP03TR8(6,7:1)F (with very good efficiency and reliability of a design).
Weight- 3,70 gr.
For mod.TR7- thrust - 60 gr.(3,7 V; 1,94 A; prop- 160x70mm).
For mod.TR8- thrust - 70 gr.(3,7 V; 2,30 A; prop- 160x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=160

20. Installation gearbox HP03TR7(6,7:1)F on "UMX EXTRA 300 3D".
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=163


21. Gearbox C05M(5,3:1)E (with very good efficiency).
Weight- 4,75 gr., thrust - 80 gr. (3,7 V; 2,83A; prop- 130x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=190

22. Installation gearbox HP03TR8(6,7:1)F on "EXTRA 330 Carbon 3D".
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=213


23. Gearbox HP02TR6(6:1)E (with good efficiency).
Weight- 2,60 gr., thrust - 40 gr.(3,5 V; 1,55 A; prop- MCF6030S).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=226

24. Gearbox HP02TR6(7,3:1)F (with good efficiency).
Weight- 2,60 gr., thrust - 39 gr.(3,5 V; 1,39 A; prop- MCF6030S).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=227

25. Gearbox HP03TR10(7,3:1)B (with good efficiency).
Weight- 3,35 gr., thrust - 56 gr.(3,5 V; 1,96 A; prop- MCF6030SS).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=228

26. Installation gearbox HP02TR6 (7,3:1)E on "M-Zone" (Wingspan- 445mm; Weight- 21,0 gr.!).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=229

27. Gearbox HP05S2(4,2:1)Sb for «UMX Sbach 342».
Weight- 6,5 gr., thrust - 102 gr.(3,5 V; 4,11 A; prop- 160x70mm).
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=247

28. Gearbox HP02TR6(7,3:1)G with weight – 2 gr.(!) and realy the thrust 33 gr.(!) for 3D.
The description- http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=248

Extremely powerful motor with gear with 83 grams of thrust for the aircraft Mustang P-51D & Su-26m (ParkZone)!

With this motor - gear plane Mustang P-51D has a fantastic flight dynamics, it just simply astonishing.
Middle position handles "gas" of the transmitter is in the 1/3- 1/2.
And on a complete "gas" the plane can go vertically up 100 meters for 3- 5 seconds!
With such a motor-installing the Mustang P-51D there is a possibility fly in the wind 3 - 5 m/sec.


Parameters gearbox C05M(3:1)A :

Motor - C05M-11000- http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...runner_11000kv
Total weight of the motor with gear - 5,35 grams.
The total weight of the motor with gear with the regulator, wires and connector is - 7,40 grams.

The static thrust with a propeller of the P-51D Mustang (130x70mm)-
- 75 grams (U = 3,5 V; I mot = 3,4 A; T mot = 45 C; Eff= 6,30 g/W);
- 83 grams (U = 3,7 V; I mot = 3,8 A; T mot = 49 C; Eff= 5,90 g/W);
- 100 grams (U = 4,1 V; I mot = 4,5 A, T mot = 55 C; Eff= 5,42 g/W).

The static thrust with a propeller on the Su-26m (160x70mm)-
- 85 grams (U= 3,5 V; I mot = 4,1 A, T mot = 52 C; Eff= 5,92 g/W);
- 115 grams (U= 4,1V; I mot = 5,3 A, T mot = 67 C; Eff= 5,29 g/W).

Tests were conducted with the Spectrum AR6400 receiver and magnificent the Czech regulator "TMM 0703-3 EXPERT"- http://mgm-compro.com/index.php?tid=...-0703-3-expert

The main problem when designing a new gearbox was the fact that at low gear ratio reducer decreases the diameter of large gears and the main axis of the gear because of this unacceptable approaches to the body of the motor. This problem was solved by installing the shaft in bearings with flanges.

To increase the diameter of holes in the gears I used the scan -
http://www.microflight.com/Online-Ca...amers-Set-of-3
or "tapered reamer set/ 6 pieces: 0.3mm to 1.5mm diameter"-
http://www.homefly.com/products.asp?id=11
To fix the gears with increasing diameters use plywood with a hole.

As a large gear, I used G336 36t (36 teeth) -
http://www.bsdmicrorc.com/index.php?productID=832,
but you can use a from the reducer gear Su-26m or the Mustang.

As a small gear, I used G312 097 12t (12 teeth) -
http://www.bsdmicrorc.com/index.php?productID=831
http://www.homefly.com/products.asp?id=37

Rolling bearings "1.5mm bore ball bearing w/flangewith" bought here - http://www.homefly.com/products.asp?id=9

Fee gear cut from carbon sheet thickness of 1,5 mm (actually 1,75 mm).
(Better use of material other-Fiberglass Sheet (Black) 2,3 mm - http://www.espritmodel.com/index.asp...OD&ProdID=2230 ).

As the main shaft gear I used a shortened 1.5-mm shaft gear Su-26m and Mustang- http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=PKZ3528
valiantGLX is online now Find More Posts by valiantGLX
Last edited by valiantGLX; Jan 30, 2013 at 12:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 12:54 PM
-=BS=-
BlazingStar's Avatar
Thousand Oaks, CA
Joined Jul 2009
1,172 Posts
Here's a real basic question:
How does the pinion attach to the motor shaft? Simple slip-on? Any special tools or adhesive needed?
Thanks
BlazingStar is online now Find More Posts by BlazingStar
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 30, 2013, 01:04 PM
Master of Micro Modding
valiantGLX's Avatar
Australia, SA, Burra
Joined Sep 2011
2,544 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazingStar View Post
Here's a real basic question:
How does the pinion attach to the motor shaft? Simple slip-on? Any special tools or adhesive needed?
Thanks
I'm just going to use a dab of locktite and hope for the best
valiantGLX is online now Find More Posts by valiantGLX
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sold Eflite Celectra 1S 3.7 Lipo Charger AC UM Adpater for MCPX Winterdd Aircraft - Electric - Batteries & Chargers (FS/W) 0 Aug 24, 2011 07:56 PM
Sold Celectra 4-Port 1S UM charger $25 Shipped AggressorBLUE Aircraft - Electric - Batteries & Chargers (FS/W) 2 Jul 24, 2011 10:11 PM
Sold Five (5) 1S UM Lipos philipa_240sx Aircraft - Electric - Batteries & Chargers (FS/W) 1 Jan 20, 2011 10:10 AM
Discussion Taking the UM's brushless.... staying 1s darksiede Micro Ready-to-Fly 72 Sep 01, 2010 08:05 PM
Sold hyperion 25C 160mAh -1S-UM pttse Aircraft - Electric - Batteries & Chargers (FS/W) 0 May 10, 2010 01:21 AM