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Old Feb 15, 2013, 03:15 PM
Fly Fast, Fly Hard, Fly Fun
rexless's Avatar
Canada, BC
Joined Apr 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banjo5 View Post
Can't help you out with the specifics for your radio, but basically use the sub-trim (or whatever they're called on your specific radio ... on my old Airtronics Vision it's the "center surface" function) to get the center to be zero in the KK2 Receiver test menu. Then there must be some sort of travel and/or end point adjustment that you adjust to get full throw at full stick. I guess it might be somewhere in the Dual Rates set up.

Again on my Vision I set it up so normal was 100% on the KK2 menu, then did a DR setting of less (don't remember what, but could look) for pitch and roll. Then after all that you can use the Scale Stick setting on the KK2 to further tame, or boost, things after that.

OK found my settings (FWIW)
I'm using stock settings for KK2 1.2 FW, tricopter (except for one yaw update).
SS's are 30, 30, 50, 90 for roll, pitch, yaw, throttle (I think this is where I upped the yaw SS a bit)
Or it might have been the P setting for yaw, it's at 70.

I'm using my Vision 8SP (Sailplane) TX.
So ail is 66% travel, so is elevator.
Flap (throttle) is 100% travel
Rudder is 80% travel
And Ail and Elev low rate is 60%

For the last half dozen flights I was using high rate (although still with 66% travel and SS30, so what that relates to in the end who knows!).
HTH. cheers,
Andrew
Well something is definitely not right. I don't get enough rudder to arm/disarm the KK2! I currently have the TX scale set to 150 and tried going to max 250 but that had no effect. I don't have any dual-rate stuff configured so that should not have any place in this ATM.

It seems to me that the TX thinks it's sending 100% (+/-150 so increments of up to 300?)

I'll probably play with rates later - once I get to know this setup better. Now I'm wondering if it's an OrangeRX issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmeisteriii View Post
Hey rexless
It sounds like you made some real progress. I got mine to zero like you so my transmitter and the KK2 agree what no input or zero input should be. Mine also does not go to 100% on inputs they range from 97 to 99% only one that goes to 100% was my throttle?? Not sure if that matters but understood that the 0 input on the KK2 and Transmitter should agree. So maybe one of the real pro's out there can give you and I an explanation for these settings so we will both feel better about a 97 - - I hope anyway
I think on my RX1002 I was getting around 97/98% to the KK2 and that worked fine. That was not with deviation firmware though.
For some reason with this deviation + orange I can't get there. I don't have a Devo RX anymore so I can't compare results...

So yeah, I need to get those numbers high enough to arm/disarm the KK2. There must be a way.

Also I notice the aileron number every so often starts fluctuating from 0-1. I keep adjusting but the behaviour keeps coming back. Weird.
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 06:13 PM
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DeBary, FL
Joined Nov 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeStyle View Post
Hi all, I had a quick question for more experienced pilots out there. I had my maisden flight today (had hovered around a bit in the garage before) and im finding thati cant really keep my altitude very well. when I give throttle the quad goes up naturally but once I hit a desired altitude how do I keep it there? do I have to lower the throttle a bit so it stays there and doesn't descend anymore or what?
When im flying a plane if I turn with ailerons I give it a bit of up and I don't loose altitude so how do I do this with a quad??

also was wondering about the throttle, theres no way for me to be lets say at 80% throttle without the quad wanting to climb up in the sky right???

Life
I am *not* 'more experienced' with rotary wing than nearly everyone else here, just a few months with QMX and two years with fixed wing. But the newbie time I've had with QMX I -can- answer some of what you're experiencing.

First, indoors, the heli will set up all sorts of rotating air currents going down, across the floor, up the walls, along the ceiling, and back down to the heli. It's like being in a constant downdraft which is also constantly varying slightly. Outdoors it's rare that you'll find pure windless weather and those air variations will come from different directions. As was mentioned heli flight is -constant- or at least frequent throttle adjustment especially hovering.

Second, the '80% throttle' thing, most model aircraft are designed to operate 'normally' at about half throttle. With fixed wing this is true with proper CG and elevator position, and more throttle = ascend, less throttle = descend. The design of a rotary (weight, motor(s), prop(s)) aims for hover at neutral throttle. That's for -today-, at the low end of the learning curve. Look at those vids - this is not a Hummer, or a Yugo, this is a Ferrari! Those screaming climbs and straight line runs leaning at 45+ degrees are where it uses and in fact -needs- that 80-90% throttle.

There are devices that can sense and maintain altitude automagically, but hot rods don't have them off the showroom floor.
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 06:18 PM
Fly Fast, Fly Hard, Fly Fun
rexless's Avatar
Canada, BC
Joined Apr 2012
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Nevermind... I got it working! It helps to double-check your cable markings. I've got them lined up correctly now and she flies!!!

So there it is... Devo 10 with deviation firmware, OrangeRX R615 DSM2 receiver, and Armattan CNC355 w/KK2. A few more tweaks of the model file and I think I've got a good base to work from. If anyone wants the model file I'll be happy to post it here once I tweak a few small details.
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Last edited by rexless; Feb 15, 2013 at 07:11 PM. Reason: She Flies
Old Feb 15, 2013, 07:14 PM
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United States, NV, Carson City
Joined Jun 2012
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Hey!! congratulations thats great. I cant wait to see a video of this baby flying. Wow!
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 07:22 PM
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Canada, QC, Montreal
Joined Dec 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbarchuk View Post
I am *not* 'more experienced' with rotary wing than nearly everyone else here, just a few months with QMX and two years with fixed wing. But the newbie time I've had with QMX I -can- answer some of what you're experiencing.

First, indoors, the heli will set up all sorts of rotating air currents going down, across the floor, up the walls, along the ceiling, and back down to the heli. It's like being in a constant downdraft which is also constantly varying slightly. Outdoors it's rare that you'll find pure windless weather and those air variations will come from different directions. As was mentioned heli flight is -constant- or at least frequent throttle adjustment especially hovering.

Second, the '80% throttle' thing, most model aircraft are designed to operate 'normally' at about half throttle. With fixed wing this is true with proper CG and elevator position, and more throttle = ascend, less throttle = descend. The design of a rotary (weight, motor(s), prop(s)) aims for hover at neutral throttle. That's for -today-, at the low end of the learning curve. Look at those vids - this is not a Hummer, or a Yugo, this is a Ferrari! Those screaming climbs and straight line runs leaning at 45+ degrees are where it uses and in fact -needs- that 80-90% throttle.

There are devices that can sense and maintain altitude automagically, but hot rods don't have them off the showroom floor.
Thnx Jbar, im kind of used to not playing with the throttle much so I guess I have to break that habit and get the left thumb a better workout.

Life
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 08:13 PM
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Creepy1's Avatar
Canada, ON, Kapuskasing
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexless View Post
Nevermind... I got it working! It helps to double-check your cable markings. I've got them lined up correctly now and she flies!!!

So there it is... Devo 10 with deviation firmware, OrangeRX R615 DSM2 receiver, and Armattan CNC355 w/KK2. A few more tweaks of the model file and I think I've got a good base to work from. If anyone wants the model file I'll be happy to post it here once I tweak a few small details.
Devo 10 works with dsm2?
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 10:01 PM
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Canada, ON, Merrickville-Wolford
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Progress

Feeling the pressure now that rexless has his CNC355 flying right away, so actually spent a bit of time working on mine.

I think I have *finally* solved how to do the power distribution. I'm fighting for height in the soap box, so don't want to stack things too high. Plus with the extra thickness of the box the bolts aren't quite long enough for the short nylon spacers to get a good bite. So I cut the corners out so it could sit flush to the bottom of the box, and then drawing from a power board I saw on whitespy (I think it was) that has notches instead of holes I modded mine. This allows the wires to come in from the side (rather than top/bottom) saving more height. Easier to see in the pic below than to describe.

So all the ESC's are soldered in and the battery connection wires too. The KK2 board fits in fine, and I can squash the ESC servo leads OK (didn't feel like cutting them just now). Now just have to fit the RX, and buzzer in there an all is good. Solder on the bullet connections for the motors and starting to run out of reasons not to fly (at last).

cheers,
Andrew
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 10:21 PM
Fly Fast, Fly Hard, Fly Fun
rexless's Avatar
Canada, BC
Joined Apr 2012
1,430 Posts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Creepy1 View Post
Devo 10 works with dsm2?
Yes - with third-party firmware developed by an RCGroups guru - www.deviationtx.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banjo5 View Post
Feeling the pressure now that rexless has his CNC355 flying right away, so actually spent a bit of time working on mine.

I think I have *finally* solved how to do the power distribution. I'm fighting for height in the soap box, so don't want to stack things too high. Plus with the extra thickness of the box the bolts aren't quite long enough for the short nylon spacers to get a good bite. So I cut the corners out so it could sit flush to the bottom of the box, and then drawing from a power board I saw on whitespy (I think it was) that has notches instead of holes I modded mine. This allows the wires to come in from the side (rather than top/bottom) saving more height. Easier to see in the pic below than to describe.

So all the ESC's are soldered in and the battery connection wires too. The KK2 board fits in fine, and I can squash the ESC servo leads OK (didn't feel like cutting them just now). Now just have to fit the RX, and buzzer in there an all is good. Solder on the bullet connections for the motors and starting to run out of reasons not to fly (at last).
cheers,
Andrew
I love what you did with the PDU Andrew. I can't wait to see how this all fits together.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmeisteriii View Post
Hey!! congratulations thats great. I cant wait to see a video of this baby flying. Wow!
Looking forward to sharing it! Thanks!
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 10:37 PM
Can you flip that over for me?
Canada, SK, Saskatoon
Joined Jan 2013
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Trader Rating: 2
Props to both Rexless and Banjo5. Great work. Please keep us informed.

Thanks
Stef

P.S. Still no GoPro mount videos from anyone. I can't believe it.
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Last edited by superfets; Feb 15, 2013 at 10:46 PM.
Old Feb 15, 2013, 10:40 PM
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Canada, ON, Merrickville-Wolford
Joined Jun 2012
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Pdu

Here's what I copied.

Looks like a good job. Not sure that the holes in the one I used were plated through like this one is. Seems a good deal for $3.http://witespyquad.gostorego.com/acc...ion-board.html

cheers,
Andrew
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banjo5 View Post
FWIW, because I can't ignore an interesting problem, I've been thinking about tricopter pivot designs that would be Armattan worthy. Needs to be solid, simple, and use the fewest number of readily available components. Nothing definitive yet, but you'll be the first to know.

cheers,
Andrew

PS. This topic TriCopter Yaw control setups.. has some interesting (and some wild) ideas. Quick way to see them is just to load the thread attachments to see all the pics. This attached image one has some merit but the servo mount needs work to avoid the need for a right angle bend with flat CNC style arms (which I figure is what's wanted right?). I think the pivot is some sort of heli flybar part, waiting to hear back. Maybe it'll be possible to make a small aluminum replacement and use those ball joints for the pivot.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 05:55 AM
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United States, PA, Shippensburg
Joined Feb 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeStyle View Post
Thnx Jbar, im kind of used to not playing with the throttle much so I guess I have to break that habit and get the left thumb a better workout.

Life
For throttle/rudder you might want to try pinch style of holding the stick. For me it's easier to move stick up and down for throttle control.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 08:12 AM
Can you flip that over for me?
Canada, SK, Saskatoon
Joined Jan 2013
112 Posts
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I got some awesome Armattan news today. Makes we want to dance.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superfets View Post
I got some awesome Armattan news today. Makes we want to dance.
Does it, by chance, start with a F and end with a V?

C.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 10:22 AM
Can you flip that over for me?
Canada, SK, Saskatoon
Joined Jan 2013
112 Posts
Trader Rating: 2
Yes it does! FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV .FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV. FPV . I'm Stoked!!!!!!!!!
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Last edited by superfets; Feb 16, 2013 at 10:38 AM.
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