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Old Jan 13, 2013, 07:11 PM
Heads up...
RMCCOR7737's Avatar
United States, VA, Stafford
Joined Jun 2009
744 Posts
Nice build Glenn. Where did you say you got this kit from?

Edit: never mind I missed it in your other post. Aero-werks huh? I'll have to check them out. Is the kit quality good?
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Old Jan 13, 2013, 08:27 PM
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glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
4,917 Posts
They are excellent quality kits. The kits in the WW series are short kits, and the builder has to supply the usual stuff. Dave imports the old plans into CAD and massages the parts until everything actually fits then laser cuts the parts out of good quality wood. WAY different from the original parts that didn't fit and were cut from die crunched oak. He also has a line of complete kits on his website. His stuff is WELL worth the cost and I highly recommend them.

Glenn
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Old Jan 13, 2013, 10:42 PM
Fly, dangit!!!
Led Zepplin's Avatar
Little Rock, AR USA
Joined Jan 2007
1,050 Posts
Nice work Glenn! Can't wait to see how this one turns out. I'm amazed you are getting planes like this to fly on that 8mm motor.

Dan - Let's see that N28, it's one of my favs!!!

J. B.
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 08:28 AM
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glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
4,917 Posts
Hi J.B.
The trick to getting these to fly well is building them light. There is a lot of excess weight that can be removed because the structure doesn't have to resist the tension or torsion of a wound rubber band.

The side keels and the opening in the formers were worked over with the sanding drum to remove about half the weight. Normally I would replace the formers aft of the TE with ones cut out of really light wood, but Dave uses decent wood in his kits so I felt this wasn't necessary.

Once I dry assemble the model and get an idea where the balance point is, I might be able to remove some weight out of the cowl block. Since the nose is so short on this one, the extra weight will probably be necessary to get the CG.

Glenn
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 09:50 AM
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Bill Smudge's Avatar
United States, KY, Bowling Green
Joined Jul 2011
1,075 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by glewis View Post
The control linkages will be connected by small magnets. This allows them to disconnect when the tray is removed. I 'borrowed' this idea from Paul Bradley's Comet Stinson build. http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...=comet+stinson

It is now being used in the whim series of Parkscale Models kits too. http://www.parkscalemodels.com/shop/....aspx?catid=23

My model will be powered by the parkzone um P-51 8.5mm motor/gearbox and powered by a single 160mAh cell.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey Glenn, when you "borrow" an idea like Paul Bradley's tray deal you can't go wrong..., it really worked really well on his Stinson.

I'll be watching this one the whole way through, can't wait to see her fly.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saw your little "Ugly" that you got side-tracked on. Everybody should have one,
here's mine. (not as pretty as yours) The little dude flys very nicely, with ailerons.

Bill
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 10:10 AM
ET
eteet's Avatar
United States, DE, Hockessin
Joined Apr 2006
700 Posts
Hi Glenn,

Looks like a cool build and that control rod setup is very innovative.

Do you think the UM power you are using will provide enough wattage? I want to do some Guillows conversions but I was thinking of using the UMX setup. That uses a 180 sized BL outrunner and a 2S lipo. Uses around 3 amps and puts out 21 watts (I think).

Eric
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 10:12 AM
Registered User
Norfolk, England
Joined Sep 2001
7,792 Posts
Glenn,
Is there a particular reason so many of you guys leave in all those fuselage stringers aft of the lower wing? Is it just to retain the original model look, despite the weight penalty? On flat sided types like the Camel, N11 and Dr1 it seems more logical to omit them and trim away former material between upper and lower longerons so only the longerons show. Lighter and a better scale appearance.
Just curious mate.

Pete
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 11:35 AM
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glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
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Hey Bill. Nice Lilstick!
Mine is a hoot to fly and zips along pretty good. Flew the heck out of it yesterday on 2 and 3 cell batteries. The thing rolls like a drill, but the rudder is kind of weak. I'll increase the throw again and see if it improves.

Eric, that setup would work well. I'm going to be on the lower limit power wise and the 180 would really be more like it. The 2 cell battery will help with the cg on such a short nose model too.

Pete, good point. Never really considered that. The horizontal keel would have to stay but the other 2 stringers there are just along for the ride and could easily be removed due to the flat sides not needing them. Since I'm currently replacing some stringers that were over sanded (oops) maybe I'll just cut those extra ones out.
I just replaced the longerons with bass and could use the weight reduction aft of the TE. After all, every gram saved...

Glenn
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 02:36 PM
MPP
In Unusual Attitude Recovery
MPP's Avatar
Danbury CT (DXR)
Joined Oct 2005
2,152 Posts
Nice Glenn, this is going to be great. My SE-5 in this series got a little porky at 2.8 OZ.'s. I wish I had waited and tried a better battery before I did the 2s conversion. Plug in is way cool!

M
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 04:06 PM
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glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
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MPP? New handle eh?
I went back and looked through your thread the other day. I'm hoping to keep the weight down to about 70 or so grams ready to fly. Should be do-able if I can get the printed tissue thing to work and not have to paint. I'll weigh the stuff tomorrow and report back what it weighs.
My 24" span Stuka weighs in around 70 RTF and it's full house control and painted tissue.

Next up, the landing gear. I'll be making my usual balsa core, foam tire wheels but with a bit of a twist this time.

Glenn
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:31 AM
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Lnagel's Avatar
Moab, Utah, USA
Joined Apr 2003
6,285 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by glewis View Post
Pete, good point. Never really considered that. The horizontal keel would have to stay but the other 2 stringers there are just along for the ride and could easily be removed due to the flat sides not needing them.
Once the stringers are installed on the fuselage upper and lower corners to act as longerons why would the horizontal keels have to stay? For that matter, if the tops and bottoms of the formers were reinforced with square stock with the grain running across the fuselage the vertical keels could be eliminated also. One could then hog out most of the former material saving even more weight. Just look at Pete's designs. Their fuselage strength is quite adequate with no formers or keels. They only have longerons on the fuselage corners held in place with vertical and horizontal bracing.

Larry
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 07:03 AM
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gupi's Avatar
Vienna, Austria
Joined Jul 2010
857 Posts
What a cool build! I'll be watching.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 07:47 AM
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glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
4,917 Posts
Hi Larry, that's my thinking too.
The horizontal and vertical keels are just an assembly aid to get everything aligned and squared up. They set the fuselage profile and after that their work is done.

Before I put the stringers on, the keels were drum sanded down to about 1/16 square and they become just another stringer.
The main longerons are bass to give the model some crush resistance. Once the longerons are sanded to a quarter round the balsa ones get pretty weak.
I feel the weight penalty is a necessary evil, I need to be able to handle the model.

After the longerons are installed the formers are opened up with the drum to just a thin frame. The stringers are pre curved by rolling a pencil on them to reduce the tension as they are put onto the lightened frame and not bow it into a banana.
After assembly about 1/3 of the stringer thickness is sanded away to further reduce weight.

As Pete suggested, there are a few redundant stringers that could be removed and I might just cut them out to reduce weight aft of the TE. I'll just have to remember to be careful handling the model in that area so I don't poke a finger through the covering.

Working on the printed tissue graphics, this will eliminate the weight of paint and decals and should leave me a model with an adequate power/weight ratio.

Also still noodling on how to assemble the landing gear. The plan calls for balsa gear struts. Those will never survive one of my landings....

Suggestions anyone?

Hi gupi, thanks for the comments.



Glenn
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 09:28 AM
Registered User
Norfolk, England
Joined Sep 2001
7,792 Posts
Replace the balsa u/c with 1/16 ply? Even balsa faired carbon rod should work, but you need the weight at the nose so thin wire is always an option.

Pete
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:23 AM
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glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
4,917 Posts
Thanks Pete.
I made the struts out of bass and I'm not sure they are strong enough. I was trying to avoid wire but you raised a good point (again) I'll need the nose weight anyway. Guess I'll be making a wire frame like you use on your designs.

Glenn
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