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Old Jan 02, 2013, 08:11 PM
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Traian's Avatar
United States, GA, Roswell
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Evolution 3- the E Pluribus Unum DLG group build log

Ok I am biting the proverbial bullet and I am reaching for the stars.
We (the Air Heads) are embarking on a journey to make the best all-around fully molded DLG in existence. To introduce the Air Heads are the members of the group build: amongst us we have a Locked Martin Aviation engineers Electrical engineers, yours truly journeyman Machinist and designer doctors etc.
Evolution 3 is the last in the series of Evolution DLGs actually is the Flag Ship of the series. In the past I started Evolution 1 which is an entry level Drella foil, two piece fuse, designed to be easy to build and fly. Evolution 2 would be a step up from Evo1 with one piece fuse and V2 platform (not yet made I have bypassed this version and I am going straight to Evolution 3)
EVOLUTION 3
What is new:
Among the changes we are trying to address here are the fact that we all go to competitions and have planes with 1.5M span 6 degrees dihedral that take a lot of space it is very hard to transport from point A to B safely. So the first thing I (we) are embarking here is a 2 piece wing take apart system, and a removable full flying stab that a gun case will easily accommodate or the size box that accommodates a plane now will acomodate5 in a space smaller than what we use to carry one model. Besides the fact that the model is transportable having 2 piece wings makes it easy to change the damaged wing in case you have midair. It costs half what it costs to replace a whole wing. Even though you remove the Horizontal the control system does not come apart.
Another place I want to address here is bad servos. When one servo goes bad in a hollow molded wing is not a pretty site. Call in the surgeon take out the operating table and go nuts. I will put in easily accessible servos that can be changed on the fly in about 10 min and return to competition.
For parameters the platform is Zone V2 hollow molded D box, one piece fuselage, rudder with integrated mounting system to attach to the boom, left handed people friendly. The build time of Evolution 3 kit is about 2 hours from the moment you open the package. Actually there is not much to build since the only component to be glued is the rudder (and that is done to accommodate lefties) and the launch peg. The rest is done.
Traian
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Last edited by Traian; Jan 03, 2013 at 03:26 PM.
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 08:57 PM
Team USA F3F Member
ttraver's Avatar
USA, CA, Carlsbad
Joined Feb 2011
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that sounds nice and all, but aren't you going to end up adding a lot of weight with the structures that will allow you to have the two piece wings?

Won't you have to have some kind of joiner to help distribute the loads between the two sides?, and all of the alignment pins, etc...

And then whatever structures you will have to have in place to be able to easily remove and replace servos.

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of it all, but how are you going to do it without adding a couple of ounces to your model?
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 09:22 PM
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United States, GA, Atlanta
Joined Feb 2011
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Hello all--My name is Rich and I'm also part of this group build. I'm not an engineer, or machinist, (I'm a salesman) but I like to build stuff that flies. It will be fun to have 6 brains involved in the eventual finished product. I'll defer to Traian's expertise since this idea came from his head-- but we all drank the koolaid

OK, so maybe we are a bit ambitious regarding what we hope to achieve in the finished build- but nothing ventured, nothing gained
As far as weight is concerned, any structural components to join the wing will be right on the CG so we wont have to add extra nose weight to compensate. With the removable stab and wing, the versatiltty of being able to travel with this plane will far outweigh any perceived penalty in AUW. Think of how many times you go on vacation but just don't have space to bring a plane without fearing it will be crushed by your wife's luggage. Not to mention, repairs or replacement tails are as easy as changing out a screw- no more glue!
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 09:36 PM
Aurora Builder
United States, MD, Lusby
Joined Nov 2003
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Fantastic to see this project alive and kicking!

The removable stab won't add any weight, every DLG I own has a removable stab, nylon or aluminum 4-40's are lightweight.

Your idea for a two piece wing is intriguing....done right the weight penalty will be pretty minimal. The issue is one of aerodynamics, designing the wing to fuselage intersection becomes critical in this case (look at full scale glider development). Pylons have amongst the lowest drag but requires creative engineering to get the weight down with a 2 piece wing and you probably won't achieve super light weights.

Best of luck!
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 10:45 PM
Team Hong Kong F3K
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Hong Kong
Joined Sep 2010
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Welcome back Traian, very interesting project and moulds are wonderful as to be expected from you guys!!

Looking forward to the progress, I'll probably need to get a travel plane too!!

Thomas
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 11:22 PM
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United States, AZ, Arizona City
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" the best all-around fully molded DLG in existence." is a pretty lofty goal.

What defines that? I don't think ticky tacky things like 2 piece wings, etc., have much to do with "best all around" at all. But that would depend on how one defines that, I suppose.

Why don't you publish your design goals, and see what the community has as a reaction ?


Good luck.

Gary
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:19 AM
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Fuse

Molds are done next step is to polish them. We will try to get a group session and get it going Sunday.

The removable stab won't add any weight, every DLG I own has a removable stab, nylon or aluminum 4-40's are lightweight

Sam this is a removable full flying stab. And yes I also use 2 4-40 screws.
Pylons are nice but unfeasible for a 2 piece wing. Almost all DLG's have the wing mounted on the top or bellow the fuse and loose the center section surface except perhaps Supergees.

Gary I know is lofty but I do not like to go half way. So the question is what makes it best? Many little thins here and there. First the machine I use to make the molds has a high precision and repeats within .0001in and that alone will create a mold that has a great deal of finesse and accuracy so the airfoil is a bit better the stab and rudder and fuse molds are all a bit better. Looking at the shape of the fuse is more streamlined than most blunt nose ship I have seen there and it has a 10mm nose so again little bit better. User friendly and builder friendly there are no holes to make or add no harnesses to make, no control systems to assemble etc., so there is a little bit better. Yes the take apart will add a bit of weight but it id on the CG or slightly forward and it will add maybe 6-7g but in the same time I am missing the section of the wing which is minus 2-3g so there is a bit of give and take. It is portable and here it is second to none and this is a little bit better. Also the throwing blade is new. I had good luck with my flexible design so I am implementing it in this project. I have been dreaming about this for at least 1 and a half years now so I am doing it now enough dreaming and planning it is time for action.
I am putting some fuse molds picks here. Enjoy
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:57 AM
M Seid
Solana Beach, Ca
Joined Sep 2006
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Ticky Tack? Thank you for your reaction Gary. Lets see how little more you can challenge yourself to say. Traian does some pretty cool stuff, so maybe you should wait to see what he produces?
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 11:09 AM
a.k.a. Matt Nelson
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Cool project - love to see builders doing their thing! About time somebody tried making a mid-wing DLG!

One nit... Why full-flying stab? I've found that full-flying develops slop with use, so I only use fixed stabs now. Note that all the top performing contest gliders these days use a fixed stab w/ elevator...

can't wait to see progress on this one!
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 11:27 AM
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United States, TX, Dallas
Joined Mar 2009
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Interesting project, original for sure. Good to see you guys trying out new ideas.

@ Matt: I have flown many years Steigs and I did not notice any increase in slop and I still consider the Steig tail one of the cleanest that I have ever had. I would still rank it as a top plane as last years scores proved.
And for transport it was neat too.

With having said that, my current planes have all fixed stabs and building them was much easier that way.

Reto
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 11:38 AM
excelling at mediocrity
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Franktown, CO. USA
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Yes very cool project Traian. You have a challenge and my rapt attention.

John
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:20 PM
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Joined Apr 2009
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A collapsable travel glider mid way between Blaster and Elf ( shorter fuse, shorter box ) that came in its own carry box would I feel be a winner for hols/beach fun etc.
A flatpack full size comp dlg, 3 in a box sounds VERY appealing
You'd do well to call for feedback on any Blaster two piece wing fliers re physical pros and cons.
Best wishes, I'm subscribed.
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:34 PM
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Good luck Airheads!

Looking forward to seeing what method you choose to secure the wings to the fuse, I'm sure it will be ultra cool.

E
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:37 PM
Launch high. Fly low.
United States, CA, Lake Elsinore
Joined Aug 2003
4,201 Posts
+1

Finally! A mid-wing design.
Yeah, I like fixed stab much, much more.
Would like to see a removable vertical as well.

Can't wait to see this plane's 'evolution' in this thread. Please keep the pictures coming.

Jun

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattN View Post
Cool project - love to see builders doing their thing! About time somebody tried making a mid-wing DLG!

One nit... Why full-flying stab? I've found that full-flying develops slop with use, so I only use fixed stabs now. Note that all the top performing contest gliders these days use a fixed stab w/ elevator...

can't wait to see progress on this one!
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Old Jan 03, 2013, 12:43 PM
a.k.a. Matt Nelson
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North Tustin, CA
Joined Oct 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetoF3X View Post
@ Matt: I have flown many years Steigs and I did not notice any increase in slop and I still consider the Steig tail one of the cleanest that I have ever had. I would still rank it as a top plane as last years scores proved.
Right you are, Reto. I forgot about the Steig (and Fireworks too). I was thinking about the more common style of FF rather than the bellcrank style.

I'm still very curious how this project will take shape...
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