New Products Flash Sale
Thread Tools
Old Jan 03, 2013, 09:27 AM
cityevader is offline
Find More Posts by cityevader
IT'S NOSE HEAVY!!!!!!!
cityevader's Avatar
United States, CA, San Jose
Joined Mar 2012
3,789 Posts
I was under the impression that once something is out on the web and afterwards deleted, it's "still out there" somehow. I dunno.
cityevader is offline Find More Posts by cityevader
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Jan 03, 2013, 09:33 AM
Ron van Sommeren is offline
Find More Posts by Ron van Sommeren
homo ludens modellisticus
Ron van Sommeren's Avatar
Netherlands, GE, Nijmegen
Joined Feb 2001
12,029 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordysoar View Post
... I flew rc sailplanes in Germany, and most other countries...you?
I have reported this thread to be closed.
Last time I flew was 20 years ago, only in the Netherlands. Helicopters only, never gliders, nor planes, nor electric. And I had the gall to post this in three (subfora). Oh dear.

Several people in this thread have asked the moderators to close this thread. Just out of curiosity, what report category?
Offensive content?
Spam?
Trolling?
Obnoxious behavior?
etc.

Vriendelijke groet Ron
Ron van Sommeren is offline Find More Posts by Ron van Sommeren
Last edited by Ron van Sommeren; Jan 03, 2013 at 09:40 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 09:44 AM
edfmaniac is offline
Find More Posts by edfmaniac
Registered User
Joined Jul 2009
567 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron van Sommeren View Post
Several people in this thread have asked the moderators to close this thread. For what reason?
Offensive content?
Spam?
Trolling?
Obnoxious behavior?
etc.
No, it's just that our government has become so willing to pass laws to protect us from ourselves that some people are afraid to discuss safety issues such as this death on an open forum. In their opinion, this draws undue attention to the matter. I don't believe it's a problem myself. We should be much more worried about the growing use of drones in our civilian airspace and the repercussions of regulating that market. Without the continued protection from a very few responsible politicians, we would already be seeing those proposed FAA altitude, weight and speed limits kicking in.
edfmaniac is offline Find More Posts by edfmaniac
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 09:53 AM
Siv is offline
Siv
Find More Posts by Siv
Siv
Registered User
United States, TX, Richmond
Joined Jan 2006
194 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dharban View Post
Surely, safety is the application of common sense. But it is also the result of a continuous process of not only asking oneself "what can go wrong here?", but a more basic process of looking at everything we do with regard to how it might be made safer.
Hear hear!

Talking about safety creates awareness and also helps people push solutions that improve everyone's safety. I'm all for it.
Siv is offline Find More Posts by Siv
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 09:58 AM
davidmc36 is offline
Find More Posts by davidmc36
No bounce, No play.
davidmc36's Avatar
Canada, ON, Ottawa
Joined Oct 2010
4,568 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cityevader View Post
I was under the impression that once something is out on the web and afterwards deleted, it's "still out there" somehow. I dunno.
Depends, some search engines make archive pages. There is a time frame and number of hits that go toward making things like that happen.
davidmc36 is offline Find More Posts by davidmc36
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:07 AM
SoaringDude is online now
Find More Posts by SoaringDude
Team Hello Kitty
SoaringDude's Avatar
near Sacramento, CA
Joined Aug 2010
1,095 Posts
I'm very glad that everyone is still able to post their opinions here. It's been a good exchange so far.

Shutting this thread down would be nothing more than censorship in an area that clearly needs more awareness and attention. If a significant percentage of posters here are more concerned about bad RC soaring PR than they are about getting their field safety plan and insurance coverage in order, it's a sad commentary on priorities.

Ignoring this critically important issue won't make it disappear...

Chris B.
SoaringDude is online now Find More Posts by SoaringDude
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:13 AM
DrlSgt is offline
Find More Posts by DrlSgt
R.C. Designs - I fab. things
DrlSgt's Avatar
United States, MI, Sterling Heights
Joined Oct 2009
129 Posts
Attacks on Gordy

So when Gordy attacks one of us it's alright but if we disagree with him we are offending you or
someone else and that's not alright, is that what you are saying?
This post is a question to post #44.
DrlSgt is offline Find More Posts by DrlSgt
Last edited by DrlSgt; Jan 03, 2013 at 10:28 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:20 AM
rdwoebke is offline
Find More Posts by rdwoebke
I'm all about that bass
rdwoebke's Avatar
United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Feb 2004
16,181 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cityevader View Post
I was under the impression that once something is out on the web and afterwards deleted, it's "still out there" somehow. I dunno.
There are archive engines and if somebody were to of course take screen shots of this it is still out there. But it would make finding this thread a lot more difficult.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron van Sommeren View Post
Several people in this thread have asked the moderators to close this thread. Just out of curiosity, what report category?
I simply selected the category of "close this thread" and put in a few sentences on why I felt the thread should be closed and that I thought it should be deleted as well.

Ryan
rdwoebke is offline Find More Posts by rdwoebke
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:27 AM
rdwoebke is offline
Find More Posts by rdwoebke
I'm all about that bass
rdwoebke's Avatar
United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Feb 2004
16,181 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoaringDude View Post
I'm very glad that everyone is still able to post their opinions here. It's been a good exchange so far.
Huh? This has been a terrible exchange. Other than a reminder to people that RC gliders is amongst the list of things that can be dangerous (and that list includes essential things such as water) there hasn't been any details exchanged here. There isn't any information for anyone to use to change a safety procedure or flying procedure because there isn't any information on the accident that has been posted.


Ryan
rdwoebke is offline Find More Posts by rdwoebke
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:39 AM
SoaringDude is online now
Find More Posts by SoaringDude
Team Hello Kitty
SoaringDude's Avatar
near Sacramento, CA
Joined Aug 2010
1,095 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwoebke View Post
Huh? This has been a terrible exchange....there hasn't been any details exchanged here. There isn't any information for anyone to use to change a safety procedure or flying procedure because there isn't any information on the accident that has been posted. Ryan
Ryan, you're jumping the gun juuuust a bit. This is still a new thread. Give people a chance to digest this terrible event. I would not be surprised to see a few new threads spawned soon that address the importance of a field safety program for both insurance and actual safety reasons.

I offered in my original post to give out more details on what I discovered regarding what AMA insurance will and will not do in fatal accidents like this. I would hazard to guess that most clubs have no idea what could happen. This thread will eventually point them in the right direction.

Chris B.
SoaringDude is online now Find More Posts by SoaringDude
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:39 AM
Phil.Taylor is offline
Find More Posts by Phil.Taylor
Phil.T-tailer
Phil.Taylor's Avatar
Devon, UK
Joined Jun 2003
4,315 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwoebke View Post
Huh? This has been a terrible exchange. Other than a reminder to people that RC gliders is amongst the list of things that can be dangerous (and that list includes essential things such as water) there hasn't been any details exchanged here. There isn't any information for anyone to use to change a safety procedure or flying procedure because there isn't any information on the accident that has been posted.

Ryan
the information is:
- someone in Germany was killed because an RC glider hit them on the head
- this was reported in German news media
- that news has spread elsewhere in the world - as news does these days

the implication is
- how are you going to plan to stop this happening where you fly?

Phil.
Phil.Taylor is offline Find More Posts by Phil.Taylor
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:54 AM
rdwoebke is offline
Find More Posts by rdwoebke
I'm all about that bass
rdwoebke's Avatar
United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Feb 2004
16,181 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoaringDude View Post
Ryan, you're jumping the gun juuuust a bit.
My opinion is that this thread being started on a tiny amount of information is jumping the gun, Chris, but we can agree to disagree on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoaringDude View Post
I offered in my original post to give out more details on what I discovered regarding what AMA insurance will and will not do in fatal accidents like this..
I think that would be valuable information. I'm not sure where it is appropriate to have that conversation.

Ryan
rdwoebke is offline Find More Posts by rdwoebke
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:55 AM
Cap_n_Dave is offline
Find More Posts by Cap_n_Dave
Registered User
Joined Mar 2008
649 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwoebke View Post
I'm not sure where it is appropriate to have that conversation.
Erm, how about this thread?
Cap_n_Dave is offline Find More Posts by Cap_n_Dave
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:59 AM
rdwoebke is offline
Find More Posts by rdwoebke
I'm all about that bass
rdwoebke's Avatar
United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Feb 2004
16,181 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil.Taylor View Post
the implication is
- how are you going to plan to stop this happening where you fly?
We don't have any information to use to make any corrective actions. The best we can do is simply evaluate every aspect of what we are doing for possible safety problems. That's something we should be constantly doing already.

Flipping that a bit:

the information is:
- someone in Germany was killed because an automobile hit them on the head
- this was reported in German news media
- that news has spread elsewhere in the world - as news does these days

the implication is
- how are you going to plan to stop this happening where you drive?

Ryan
rdwoebke is offline Find More Posts by rdwoebke
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 03, 2013, 11:01 AM
perttime is offline
Find More Posts by perttime
Registered User
perttime's Avatar
Tampere, Finland
Joined Nov 2004
4,459 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil.Taylor View Post
the information is:
- someone in Germany was killed because an RC glider hit them on the head
- this was reported in German news media
- that news has spread elsewhere in the world - as news does these days

the implication is
- how are you going to plan to stop this happening where you fly?

Phil.
I like your summation.

Feel free to add questions, here's a few from me:
- Should you fly without a vigilant assistant/observer who is looking out for unexpected hazards?
- Are you sure your skills are up to flying "that plane" in "these conditions"?
- Is your plane up to flying in "these conditions"?
- Have you planned for crashing your plane in the rocks if hitting something important is otherwise likely?


On legal issues, there are big differences on how things are handled in different countries.
Where I live, I am responsible for the consequences of my actions, whereever I might be.
I hear there are places where the land owner is responsible if something goes wrong.
"Involuntary manslaughter" is, to me, defined as death caused through negligence.
perttime is offline Find More Posts by perttime
Reply With Quote


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Careful! Model kills spectator Ron van Sommeren Electric Plane Talk 5 Jan 06, 2013 12:28 AM
Careful! RC Plane nearly KILLS the Camera Man! RobscoRC Electric Plane Talk 21 Oct 29, 2012 06:59 AM
Question Video TX kills 2.4 ghz RC link Bram1982 FPV Talk 26 Jun 01, 2012 01:41 PM
Ukrainian Plane Kills 70 Spectators Aaron13 Life, The Universe, and Politics 2 Jul 29, 2002 04:09 AM