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Old Dec 23, 2012, 09:29 AM
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United States, NC, Butner
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Flip Starting DLE 30

I've got a DLE 30 that is broken-in, or close to it. I like the motor, except for the fact that it is impossible to flip-start. I've always had to use a starter on the thing, and I have to borrow a friend's Sullivan Dynatron since my smaller starters don't really have the torque to start a 30cc. I can start it with the smaller starters, but it really struggles. So I'm wondering if there's any ideas for making this thing easier to flip start.

Thx,

Ben
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 01:39 PM
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United States, LA, New Orleans
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those engines should flip start easily. is it priming when you flip with the choke closed?
if not, you should check your fuel delivery for any obstructions or leaks. if that checks out then its possible that you have either an air leak between the carb and the reed block, OR you have a reed that is not seating properly. if you have a reed that doesnt seal you will have plenty of problems getting the engine to draw fuel at all.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 02:24 PM
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Hey Ben I have the same problem with my DLE 30 . Its tough to start on the first flight of the day but after one run it starts with one hand flip the rest of the day.Dont know why but ill live with it , its a great engine.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 03:15 PM
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It sounds like you've had it a while,and it may need a little maintenance.

Disassemble some things,and look for unusual marks.....gaskets leaking,bolts loose,and a piece of grass in the reed.

I have a little primer bulb I carry in the field box,with a curved tube to prime the carb.

Taxiing in grass can stir up a piece of dirt,and it'll wedge in the reed,often....
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 07:54 PM
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United States, NC, Faison
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My DLE 30 starts easy! I give it full choke and full open on the throttle stick. Flip it three to four times and she kicks. Then I drop the throttle downt to about 5-10% take the choke off and flip it once or twice and she is off to the races.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 08:03 PM
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Many of the small gas engines prime easier if the choke hole is soldered closed. Doing so usually doesn't require removing the choke plate from the carb. Use a wire brush wheel in a rotary tool to clean the plate. Use a soldering gun to solder closed.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 09:54 PM
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Great posts, everyone, thanks for the input. This DLE only has about 2 gallons through it. But I've heard the same thing from all the other guys flying DLEs at the field, everything from 30cc to the 55cc. All need starters.

So that leads me to believe that we're just not doing something right.

I put on a new 20x8 prop on it and it starts easier with my Hobbico starter now. And after it was flying a little bit I was able to flip start it in a couple of flips. So I'm going to try some of the suggestions here and see if I can get it to flip start more reliably.

Thanks, everyone!

Ben
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 10:29 PM
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I think it is hardest when the engine is started for the first time of the day, especially if it is cold outside. The main trick is getting it primed to start. I normally, choke the engine flip it over a few times, then turn on the ignition, and flip it over until it catches and runs for a second or two and stops, then I un-choke it, and it usually fires up right away. I then let it warm up for a while, as at first it usually doesn't want to run much faster than a fast idle speed, until I can get it to go full throttle, and know it has warmed up OK. Then I can fly it.

Yeah it doesn't take too much to have the reeds not close properly, a little debris can make it harder to start. One thought is the little screen filter inside of the Walbro carb may have debris accumulating on it too. That can affect the engine in odd ways, not just full throttle too. I have had to pry the screen filter out and put in a new one. Whatever the debris is, it seems to get stuck good to that little screen. Another thought is the pump and regulator diaphragm may have gotten hard or stiff. or the diaphragm may have gotten soft and stretched out a lot and become, sort of, baggy and not working as well as it should.
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 05:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ognolman View Post
Great posts, everyone, thanks for the input. This DLE only has about 2 gallons through it. But I've heard the same thing from all the other guys flying DLEs at the field, everything from 30cc to the 55cc. All need starters.

So that leads me to believe that we're just not doing something right.

I put on a new 20x8 prop on it and it starts easier with my Hobbico starter now. And after it was flying a little bit I was able to flip start it in a couple of flips. So I'm going to try some of the suggestions here and see if I can get it to flip start more reliably.

Thanks, everyone!

Ben
If that is the case, then I'd not think too highly of DLE engines. I've Zenoah, JC-Evo and MLD engines and have never used a starter on any and they start easily either cold or hot but the easy cold starting came only after soldering the choke hole closed.

I'm betting there is nothing different about DLE and the other brands... and that if the choke holes were soldered closed, they would prime much easier.
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 07:18 AM
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I ordered a Frank bowman ring and he sent me a long email with pics saying that most of these Chinese engine require the removal of the reed block and the surface finish is awful
Remove the reeds an sand flat with a piece of 320 or finer sandpaper taped to a sheet of glass
If the reeds do not seal the result is hard starting because the reeds act as a one way valve for the air fuel charge
Can't suck and blow at the same time !!
I haven't tore my motors apart because my rings aren't here yet
I have an rcgf 30 as well that needs help starting too
The smaller the engine the more important that this becomes
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 07:26 AM
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Mach,


It is Frank Bowman, not Tom...
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 08:23 AM
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United States, TX, Weatherford
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Been flip starting your car? That stopped when Henry Ford put an electric starter on his cars. Seems kinda risky to me to be flip starting a 30 CC engine. Your engine, your airplane, your hands, go for it.
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 08:54 AM
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Hardly, Chip.

With current CDI ignition systems, kick-back cannot happen.
And there is no Dynatron or another Sullivan starter, that will spin-start big spark-ignition engines.

The owners of these up-to-250 cc engine planes obviously have enough money to buy a starter, but all of them flip-start their engines.

It is hardly a chore...
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarZeelon View Post
Hardly, Chip.

With current CDI ignition systems, kick-back cannot happen.
And there is no Dynatron or another Sullivan starter, that will spin-start big spark-ignition engines.

The owners of these up-to-250 cc engine planes obviously have enough money to buy a starter, but all of them flip-start their engines.

It is hardly a chore...
AMEN!!!

My 3W 150CC is so easy to start it is almost scary. I use the same technich as the smaller gassers. Full choke and full throttle. When it kicks, low throttle open choke and shes off. I have never fliped more than 5-6 times even on a cold day. My DLE 30CC, Same way. Perhaps the OP and others having issues might check their tunning. A fine tuned engine, even a magneto, should flip start easly.
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 10:14 AM
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The "solder the hole closed" tip is advice I follow for sure. They need to be pretty rich to start easily. The other thing I see a lot of is the LS needle adjusted just a little lean? That'll make them a bear to start as well - especially in cooler weather!

None of my gas engines have ever had an electric starter used on them - ever. If I can't flip start it, it's not right....
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