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Old Nov 28, 2012, 09:32 PM
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New RG-65

A new RG-65 available soon from JoysWay.
Dragon Force RG65 Yacht Prototype.mov (4 min 41 sec)
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 12:13 AM
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A Littlke more Info...

http://www.rcyachts.org.uk/epages/St...ragon_Force_65

Looks pretty good...
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 02:29 AM
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I saw this at the MYA AGM trade show it's been developed by two British guys who are very experienced in the model sailing scene and Ripmax UK.
It should sell by the bucket load and get the RG65 pushed forward onto the lakes.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 04:09 AM
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Lets hope before they sell by the bucketload that a tight set of class rules (within a class) are offered. Otherwise we will see the same as what happened with the Micro Magic where the newcomer is led to believe his equipment is good enough to compete at all levels of competition, only to find he needs x amount of lower rigs, stiffer spars, ball raced parts and new sails.
Having a plastic hull with a metal fin, one rig with single panel nylon sails and what looks an oversized bulb, will this boat honestly compete with the carbon versions in this class? If the answer is no then this needs to be made clear to the newcomer.

All this said, as a one design at the price offered it will take off so long as tight rules are in place.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 04:46 AM
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Originally Posted by al harrington View Post
Lets hope before they sell by the bucketload that a tight set of class rules (within a class) are offered. Otherwise we will see the same as what happened with the Micro Magic where the newcomer is led to believe his equipment is good enough to compete at all levels of competition, only to find he needs x amount of lower rigs, stiffer spars, ball raced parts and new sails.
Having a plastic hull with a metal fin, one rig with single panel nylon sails and what looks an oversized bulb, will this boat honestly compete with the carbon versions in this class? If the answer is no then this needs to be made clear to the newcomer.

All this said, as a one design at the price offered it will take off so long as tight rules are in place.
Rules for the RG-65 class in the U.S. are here.

http://theamya.org/boats/rg65/


The RG-65 is an International development class with a 30 year history. The class rules limit only the length of the hull (65 cm), the height of the rig (110 cm) and the sail area (2250 square centimeters). The class originated in Argentina and is popular in South America and Europe.

Boats are light, quick, and responsive. A typical boat weighs 1 kilogram with a l lb or 500 gram trolling sinker for a bulb. Many designs can be found on the Internet and some kits are on the market and under development. A competitive balsa-hulled boat can be built for well under $200, radio included, and easily transported in even the smallest of cars.

The Class is managed in the U.S. by a Class Owners Association which is accredited as the National Class Authority by the RG-65 International Class Authority.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 05:27 AM
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Rules for the RG-65 class in the U.S. are here.

http://theamya.org/boats/rg65/


The RG-65 is an International development class with a 30 year history. The class rules limit only the length of the hull (65 cm), the height of the rig (110 cm) and the sail area (2250 square centimeters). The class originated in Argentina and is popular in South America and Europe.

Boats are light, quick, and responsive. A typical boat weighs 1 kilogram with a l lb or 500 gram trolling sinker for a bulb. Many designs can be found on the Internet and some kits are on the market and under development. A competitive balsa-hulled boat can be built for well under $200, radio included, and easily transported in even the smallest of cars.

The Class is managed in the U.S. by a Class Owners Association which is accredited as the National Class Authority by the RG-65 International Class Authority.
Thanks for that. I am aware of the class rules.
It may be true that a balsa boat can be on the water for under $200 in the US but as with the Marblehead class, that bubble will burst the minute someone desperate to win turns up with a high spec boat from Bantock, Brazil or similar.
If this boat was made as a one deign class of its own, then I see no reason for it not to be a success. Boats can also still race within open RG65 competition. A class within a class as I tried to say. Win win.
As a stand alone boat it will struggle to measure up against the top boats without modification, much in the same way the of Windstar IOM.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 05:43 AM
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We see quite a lot of prototypes and cottage industry kits, but with a big name distributor behind them, rather less. If pricing is as keen as indicated (less than the MicroMagic) and with a 2.4 GHz radio, it should give the class a boost.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 05:53 AM
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Originally Posted by al harrington View Post
Thanks for that. I am aware of the class rules.
It may be true that a balsa boat can be on the water for under $200 in the US but as with the Marblehead class, that bubble will burst the minute someone desperate to win turns up with a high spec boat from Bantock, Brazil or similar.
If this boat was made as a one deign class of its own, then I see no reason for it not to be a success. Boats can also still race within open RG65 competition. A class within a class as I tried to say. Win win.
As a stand alone boat it will struggle to measure up against the top boats without modification, much in the same way the of Windstar IOM.
It is quite possible to build a seaworthy all balsa hull that will weigh no more than the latest hi tech carbon fibre/kevlar hulls. I think your criticisms are overly pessimistic.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 07:04 AM
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My understanding is this is a Prototype at the moment & some additional developments may be undertaken prior to final product.
from an initial contact between Mike (RC Yachts) and Ripmax to develope a radio controlled racing yacht that is ready available at an affordable price. Working with Joysway and also bringing onboard Mark Dicks as designer and John Tushingham (Graphite) with his technical expertise we decided to base the new yacht on the RG65 class
Looking who is involved with the project I am confident the final result will be a good all round product.

Yes Upgrade in Rigs etc may be available & quite possibly desirable for some..

The standard rMM meets most peoples needs. I do quite well with my Out of the Box Kit Built MM..

Time on the water is the most important thing. You can't buy experience.

To keep a product affordable & appealing to the New Skipper then a Basic Usable Product is all that is needed.. If you want to play & win at the top end then you expect to put a little time & effort into sailing practice & working out what rig setups work for different conditions.

If that means a few choices in Bulbs, Rigs etc then that is what you expect at the top end of competition. This looks to be marketed as a good entry level & affordable RG65

What I would like to see are some additional video alongside other RG65 boats, not necessarily the same design..

Just for comparison...
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 07:42 AM
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It is quite possible to build a seaworthy all balsa hull that will weigh no more than the latest hi tech carbon fibre/kevlar hulls. I think your criticisms are overly pessimistic.
This may well be the case Martin but how often do we see this at the front end in competition? How many balsa low cost Marblehead's do we see now? The perception is that unless you have a skapel then don't bother showing. The RG is going the same way looking at some of the costs of boats that placed at the last major events.
Just saying people should be aware that a lower spec mass produced boat may not be as competitive in class racing, in the same way that that a single rig rtr Micro is not without extra rigs and new sails.
I hope it does well and yes we need inexpensive well sorted start up boats. Include some one design rules as the Micro should have done and learn from their mistakes. Then it may be huge.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 07:48 AM
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The video showed at least that it didn't nose dive too much on downwind in a reasonably fresh breeze in what might be close to the upper limit of A rig conditions.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 11:09 AM
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Al - only a supposition ----- that perhaps balsa Marbleheads "would" be at the upper end of performance "IF" an owner were willing to carefully build one. During the development of the RG65 Class here in the US, I found that like many other classes, the next new thing was being dominant - until a well and carefully built balsa boat appeared.

Let's face the additional fact that no (commercial) builder is going to spend time building a balsa "strip" boat when they can do a mold and pump out polyester, epoxy, carbon, Kevlar hulls with higher material cost, but much less time. If someone were to develop a method for building a balsa hull in a mold there might be more "wood on the water" than one would think. I am still working on my "Woodie" - it being a balsa stick frame with 1/20 thick wood veneer. Of course, this build of mine was directed toward a "pretty" boat - and if it happens to be lightweight fast, so much the better.

I agree that if the company can come in with the pricing noted, it probably will sell well, and like most other inexpensive boats, will find a bigger percentage of "pond sailing buyers" compared to hard core racing ones.

Unfortunately, the lack of dedicated builders of wooden boats of most all classes just leads to the reduced number of wood boats sailing - in my opinion.

Cheers, Dick
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 01:56 PM
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Always good to see a major manufacturer put money into a mass production model sailboat from an established designer. But has been pointed out in this thread, claiming that the under 200 pound kit boat can do well in an open class like the RG65 is just plain misleading. Anyone who buys the kit to race as an RG65 will be very, very disappointed. Facts are facts. Carbon fiber fin beats out steel, wood or aluminum. Sailmaker built multi-panel sails beat out a single piece of mylar. Carbon fiber or kevlar hulls are lighter and stiffer than blow mold or vacuform. Purpose build carbon fiber masts are way better than aluminum, wood or even off the shelf carbon fiber tubes. Better to be clear from the outset that this is a well sailing kit and a competitive one design for club racing that also happens to fit under the RG65 rules.
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 03:11 PM
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Who said anything about this being a race boat ? And at how many local ponds will you find an over priced rg65 ? The same designers that build over priced ioms are jumping on to the rg bandwagon .
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Old Nov 29, 2012, 03:49 PM
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It has to be better than their Footy which is only 10 inches long when it could have been over 14!
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