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Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:05 AM
Mr. Crash and Burn
Joined Jan 2013
430 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajah235 View Post
Dweenie,
The turbo version will not increase the heli's performance.

This is due to the limiting factor of available power, (ie; Voltage & current), supplied.
That is all down to the 7.4 Volt 650 or 850 mA, Li-Po battery.

To get more performance will introduce the wear & reliability factors you mentioned.
& that will require a higher battery voltage.
The electronics are not designed for such.

Buy a nitro heli if you want more performance.


As I mentioned, all I'm trying to do is upgrade the motor.
yes im aware of the performance due to lack of voltage but my theory is if you take a high performance motor but never give it the voltage required then it wont wear out as quick that would be like taking a v8 engine and never giving it full throttle it will last longer then one that has been given the full throttle
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:21 AM
Just a 9116 flyer.
Rajah235's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Wollongong
Joined Dec 2012
623 Posts
That is exactly what I'm trying to accomplish but just by using a serviceable motor.

These Super 16D motors are rated at 12 Volts & we used to race them for weeks before they needed anything "major" replacing.
Mainly the brushes & springs.

& the power supply was from a couple of very large capacity car batteries & they switched on a high capacity charger, when the racing started.

They dragged many more Amps than these heli batteries are capable of supplying & had more than 14 Volts applied.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:46 AM
Ain't crashing often anymore
mikefromgermany's Avatar
Germany, Berlin
Joined Jun 2012
3,426 Posts
Hmm, just to get this right:
You want to insert a ~15 USD Slotcar-tuning motor that lasts 3-4 races before burning out in a 9116?
How long do you think it will last if pumped with 40 Watts / ~8 Amps?
I don't want to blunt your enthusiasm, but wouldn't it make more sense to develop a cheaper solution, suitable for daily use by functionality for everyone?

-mike-
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 12:18 PM
Just a 9116 flyer.
Rajah235's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Wollongong
Joined Dec 2012
623 Posts
Hi Mike,
I'm not suggesting that everyone try the Super 16D motors.

I'm going to try it myself, when I get the motor.

& FWIW...
They lasted a whole lot longer that 3 or 4 races. eg; The race series comprised of 8 heats, one race on each lane per night & was concluded after 3 or 4 weeks, may have been more, but it was a few years ago.
The applied power was 12 to 15 volts (high cap batteries + charger) or so with unlimited current available.
The motors dragged about 5 or 6 Amps on avg.

The previous long post was just to show the possibility of using them & how they were so close in characteristics/dimensions etc.

Never know, it may just crash & burn.

I know I smoked a few motors ATT.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 12:32 PM
Ain't crashing often anymore
mikefromgermany's Avatar
Germany, Berlin
Joined Jun 2012
3,426 Posts
Don't get me wrong - I appreciate your enthusiasm - I'll wait for the results
Thanks for putting me right about slot car motors life span.

-mike-
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 12:41 PM
Just a 9116 flyer.
Rajah235's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Wollongong
Joined Dec 2012
623 Posts
Hi Mike,
I'm a stickler for reliability & serviceability. If it breaks, I try to fix it.

Sorry if I came on too strong.

These motors were very reliable for the work we put them through.
We even skimmed & polished the comms & re-balanced them.
Boy, the stuff we didn't do to them.
We may have replaced the occasional bad motor during the series but mostly they just lasted the distance.

This is just a work-in-progress at the moment.

L..
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 12:45 PM
Cranky old fart
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 01:29 PM
Just a 9116 flyer.
Rajah235's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Wollongong
Joined Dec 2012
623 Posts
Hi Balr14,
From memory, the 8 heats lasted for just 3 Mins.
Motors were rather warm but they liked to throw the solder off the comm at times.
That sure slowed them down.
Never had any actually catch fire, just smoked a lot.

L..
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 01:36 PM
Cranky old fart
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 05:52 PM
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 06:11 PM
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 06:23 PM
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 07:17 PM
Just a 9116 flyer.
Rajah235's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Wollongong
Joined Dec 2012
623 Posts
Steve,
To answer a couple of your questions...

[q]
Are these motors ball bearing?
[/q]

No. They're not, just a standard bronze bush. (They are replaceable.) I'm not sure but I seem to remember that we could & did solder ball bearings into them.
Anyway, you can buy motors with ball bearings.....for a few dollars more. (Where's Clint Eastwood hiding?)

[q]
what about using the stock 9116 armature in your slot motor?
Are the dimensions even close?
[/q]

Without knowing the exact mechanical specs, I cannot say.
They look similar to a standard un-balanced 16 armature but ???

The commutator may be at the incorrect distance from the laminations/windings/end of shaft.
The shaft size could be different & it may well be, because of the smaller can dimensions.
The armature may be a smaller diam, again, due to the smaller can size.
.."......."............"......."...."......"...... ...."..."...meaning that the armature to magnet face may be too great & the radii not suitably matched.

[q]
The solution needs to cost less in the long run than a stock unit.
[/q]

As every part of the Super 16D's is serviceable, I see a much greater benefit of using them
over having to replace the stock motor every, whatever.

Of the 2 old S 16D's that I picked up, one had an 8 tooth pinion, the other a 10 & it looks like they will engage just nicely with the main drive gear in the heli.
As I mentioned, the pitch looks the same when mated. (Can I say that?)

& you won't have to worry about those stupid, cheap brass brush assy's failing & getting dragged to the opposite side of the commutator & shorting out, only to have the MOPS cct cut the power & having the inevitable crash.

Regarding the power requirements of the S 16D's, they are designed to run at the full 12 Volts & more was applied because of the battery chargers being turned on during the racing.

Mind you, they did run warm to hot & we did smoke a few but O/A they were a good motor in my day.

The new variety are even better.
That adjustable timing one looks great for this application.

I'll try it out when I've gone through the 1st bit of rubbish, they call a main motor.

(Gee. I hope I don't have to eat my hat.)

Regs, L..

ps. Steve. I have the time, knowledge? & $$ to do this with ease.
After all, it's only $20 or so dollars & my time is my own.
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 02:08 AM
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 02:41 AM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2013
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Hey i have a question. Im from utah, U.S. and its pretty cold outside, mostly between 0 F and just below freezing right now. Does cold air affect flight differently than hot air? Iv noticed i dont have an overheating issue, hopefully ill get longer life out of my motors. But other than the motor temp, will warmer air change the flight characteristics? Hopefully it will last long enough to fly in spring air. I am getting better with each flight, and am loving this little machine.
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