Originally Posted by Twizter68

The problem I see is that you can't often separate the possession charge from other charges; the statisticians use a catch-all, "drug-involved" and batch those in with the possession cases to make the numbers appear worse. The problem is, the possession charges are often on top of something else, assault, robbery, B&E, and so forth. It's all well and good to get pious and scream "That's Racist!" about incarceration rates, but you have to look at the crimes that accompany the relatively minor possession charges; I know when I worked for the SO in Georgia, possession charges were only add-ons to the major charges someone got pinched for, because at the times they were arrested, more often then not they were high or had dope on them.

For simple possession poor people and minorities get harsher sentences than white people and wealthier people do. Plenty of people are arrested for just possession so you can just look at that metric. You don't have to separate anything out.

Originally Posted by Twizter68

And say if you legalize it...is that going to stop people from robbing and stealing to get the money to buy dope?

My guess is NOT.

Dope will be much cheaper so it will reduce it. You won't stop people robbing and stealing completely. They usually do it to spend money on something. I'm sure people spend their robbery money on cigarettes and alcohol but you don't hear them being connected.

I understand your point Sherlock, but simple possession, even with minorities recieving harsher sentences, is still short time, county jail stuff. I'm talking long-term +1 year lockups. As for dope getting cheaper...you sure about that? Legalize it, regulate it and tax it like booze and smokes...I don't see the cost coming down.

It's all really simple, if you don't want to go to jail for selling drugs , DON'T SELL DRUGS.

It would be like ousting the dog to the backyard because the cat tore up the drapes.

Originally Posted by Sherlock

Dope will be much cheaper so it will reduce it. You won't stop people robbing and stealing completely. They usually do it to spend money on something. I'm sure people spend their robbery money on cigarettes and alcohol but you don't hear them being connected.

But WRT drugs, they ARE connected to other crimes as a statistical data point. In my county in GA (about 1000 years ago), 95% of robberies and B&E were drug related crimes. Now, the ones perpetrating those crimes, would still have been burglars and robbers without the dope (most were before they got into drugs; and before you start going off about it, I can say this with confidence because I GREW UP WITH THEM, and know how they were as kids), the drug involvement just made it easier to catch them. Face it, a stoner burglar makes a lot more mistakes and leaves more evidence than a "clean" burglar. We even caught one guy who decided to smoke a bowl AFTER he broke in, and fell asleep in the middle of looting the joint.

Originally Posted by 62pilot

It's all really simple, if you don't want to go to jail for selling drugs , DON'T SELL DRUGS.

It would be like ousting the dog to the backyard because the cat tore up the drapes.

^^^this x1000

Originally Posted by Sherlock

For simple possession poor people and minorities get harsher sentences than white people and wealthier people do.

I agree. Poor people can't afford the quality legal services that get rich people off with warnings or even dismissed altogether.

Got any stats on the crimes commited by rich whites vs. poor blacks? Offenders vs. population, type of crime, etc?

Could it be that lower income blacks commit more crimes than higher income whites?

Originally Posted by Sherlock

No, many people use drugs, not just the "welfare class". Poor people and minorities get harsher sentences than whites and wealthier people do.



Yes

I take it you have never seen section 8 housing... When people are not doing something constructive like a JOB they tend to do things that most consider crime.

Originally Posted by RCWorks

I take it you have never seen section 8 housing... When people are not doing something constructive like a JOB they tend to do things that most consider crime.

Yeah sure... Your reason doesn't make sense, as retirement communities don't have such a high rate of crime.

It's got nothing to do with, nothing to do.

Originally Posted by Kenny Sharp

Yeah sure... Your reason doesn't make sense, as retirement communities don't have such a high rate of crime.

It's got nothing to do with, nothing to do.

Take in to full view the section 8 family....

No father, kids that are not watched... they learn bad habits that turn in to jailable offences... all because they had no structure in their lives other than collecting someone elses money.

The so called "War On Drugs" has been an unmitigated disaster. It has cost hundreds of billions of dollars, corrupted entire governments, made the scum of the earth richer than most kings and more pointedly not even made a dent in accomplishing the stated goals.
A more troubling fact is that far more people have been killed in relation to the war on drugs than have ever been killed by the drugs themselves.


There are other hidden costs as well....

http://www.cjpf.org/11ways


Part of the problem is the attitude that if something is bad than government must get involved in trying to improve the situation. Sometimes this works but all to often it just makes things worse and government is very, very slow to shrink ANYTHING that it has gotten into that costs billions and employs tens of thousands.

Legal does not always = good.
Illegal does not always = bad.

Originally Posted by 62pilot

It's all really simple, if you don't want to go to jail for selling drugs , DON'T SELL DRUGS.

It would be like ousting the dog to the backyard because the cat tore up the drapes.

True. The law should be changed to allow people to sell and consume drugs ... Much in the same way people are allowed to sell and consume alcohol and tobacco products.

Originally Posted by logan5

True. The law should be changed to allow people to sell and consume drugs ... Much in the same way people are allowed to sell and consume alcohol and tobacco products.

But where do you draw the line? At weed only, or do you legalize coke, heroin, X, ruffies, all of them?

What's really funny about this thread is that Logan didn't seem to care about civil rights at all... until Obama got elected.