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Old Nov 16, 2012, 08:45 AM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Question
Desired functions for Heli Guardian (2D/3D?)

First of I was one of the fairly early Guardian 2D/3D beta testers and found the unit totally amazing . One of my first thoughts was if only this unit could provide such fantastic self uprighting / leveling for a heli I could stop crashing so darn frequently.

I have spent the last six months or so mostly flying helis and have made the transition to all FBL ones. I am pleased with the performance of the now inexpensive Tarot ZYX and Copter X FBL units however they lack any form of self leveling ( Horizion) or recovery (Rescue) modes.

There are units available with these feactures ,the top of the line one HC 3XS goes for $500 which has all these feactures , then there are the Beat X ,Ikon and a few more at $220 or so and just introduced NAZA H Single Rotor Controller at $270 with various levels of self leveling and emergency recovery (bailout).


Being a realist ( at least part of the time) I do not expect a realative inexpensive unit to compete with the top of the line ones thus I would be extremely pleased if the ET Guardian 2D/3D could merely(?) be used with a Tarot / Copter X class FBL unit and add Guardain 2D type recovery mode. Flip a switch and have the heli maintain self level such as present Guardian 2d/3D mode for fixed wing ,flip the switch again or press a button ( depending on Transmitter programing ) and have the heli upright and climb (programable) collective set point.

I realize that the ET unit could be developed to be an all in one FBL and flight stabilization package but there are so many advanced feactures allready available in the inexpensive FBL units and there are programming boxs,and computer GUI software allready availbale that make setups and tweaking so simple that IMO it would require a lot of reinventing the wheel to go all in one. Then also there is that simple fact that helis do not glide well and why should I remove a know working properly setup FBL unit and start all over.


Above are my thought , know what are yours?


Charles
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Last edited by everydayflyer; Nov 19, 2012 at 05:59 PM.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 04:03 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Clarkston
Joined Apr 2007
80 Posts
Would it be possible for a 2D flight level reset to be provided?

Trying to set up my flight level by setting the rear stab at some sort of level on blocks than doing the switch toggling was not very accurate. Had to make many flights to test out the new level setting and when 2D activated had to take notice if the last leveling block height was correct or not. If not and still plane noses down, than added more riser to the blocks and try again. Much to time consuming and not that accurate. Would be much easier to trim plane for level flight with 2D/3D stabilizer in off position then do something with the transmitter toggle switch (or another switch?) to set the new flight level setting for the Guardian unit.

Possible?
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 04:09 PM
ancora imparo
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Melbourne, Australia
Joined Jul 2005
6,767 Posts
Charles it would be really neat if the Guardian could have an externally switchable "hard deck" function added as per the FMA CoPilot.

Suspect it is not that simple given the effort that FMA have had to go to to get reliable height sensing with the external streamer sensor but imagine if Eagletree could build in an automatic barometer that would set a 15m/50ft hard deck altitude when you power it up!

If the plane gets within 50 ft of the ground 2D mode automatically kicks in. Fabulous training aid for beginners. And a mighty reassuring thing to have on the maiden of a new model.

That data port is just crying out to be used for an add-on like that. Mind you, given the back log on production, I think new features are a fair way off.

John
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Last edited by jj604; Nov 19, 2012 at 05:16 PM.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 04:19 PM
Your customer
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Berkley, MI
Joined Dec 2009
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ooops. wrong thread....
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Last edited by Silverexpress; Nov 19, 2012 at 04:38 PM.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 06:10 PM
Rick
United States, CA, Santa Clara
Joined Mar 2011
2,165 Posts
I would like to see:
  • A method of adjusting the level setting other than just resetting it.
  • An altimeter implementing altitude hold or a hard-ceiling/hard-floor.
  • A gps return home function.
  • Gimbal functionality.
  • For a future model, bluetooth PC connect with iOS & Android apps.
A number of methods are possible for tweaking the level setting. One simple way would be to enter "tweak" mode with switch flips in the 15 sec window and then use the gain pot to adjust your level. Alternately you could use stick movements to nudge it up or down from the existing setting.

The altitude settings would probably need to be established in advance with a PC connection and would become active with 2D. Perhaps they could be toggled on-off in 2D by reducing gain to zero and back up.

Activating return-home could be problematic. You would like it to activate on a signal loss but I'm not sure Guardian can detect a signal loss. Perhaps flipping mode from 2D-3D-2D-3D-2D within 2 seconds would be workable. Or activate automatically after 30 sec in 2D with no aileron changes (signal loss) and deactivate with a wing wag.

With a gimbal you should be able to specify which channels are gimbal channels and which are aircraft. A Guardian can, for example, fly a rudder-elevator plane and manage a camera leveling roll gimbal at the same time. Or in some cases manage a 3 axis gimbal.

Bluetooth would solve a lot of access problems and physical connection problems. Smartphone apps would make field adjustments easy.

Edit: Sorry, I didn't notice you were looking specifically for heli suggestion here, I'll delete this if you like.
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Last edited by choochoo22; Nov 19, 2012 at 06:46 PM. Reason: Wrong thread?
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 06:16 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
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Tnanks for the post gentelmen but are those suggestions for a Heli version or the fixed wing version?
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 06:38 PM
ancora imparo
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Melbourne, Australia
Joined Jul 2005
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Good point. I'm not a heli flier but the Hard Deck seems to have been developed mainly for helis.

Maybe we need another thread for Guardian functions for fixed wing?? I will see how the current standard Guardian thread goes for now.

John
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Originally Posted by everydayflyer View Post
Tnanks for the post gentelmen but are those suggestions for a Heli version or the fixed wing version?
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Old Nov 20, 2012, 04:05 PM
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Joined Nov 2003
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All, thanks for these great suggestions! Many of these are already in development.

choochoo, re RTH, we can detect signal loss, but there are a few other problems we are thinking about how to solve, and I'm not sure that the existing Guardian will be suitable for it.

Re Bluetooth, that would be so cool!
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Old Dec 03, 2012, 08:12 AM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
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Seems like most did not understand this was an attempt to get input for a heli version simple /basic versus advanced etc. It also seems that does who visit the ET forum are not really into helis and perhaps they are just to the level that self leveling . Rescue Mode etc.. are not desired feactures.

Stabilization units (3 Axis gyros) with advanced feactures are being released frequently . I recently posted that it seems like by spring most anyone will be able to fly a heli as the self stabilizition units are becoming that advanced.


Charles
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Old Dec 03, 2012, 06:01 PM
Your customer
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Berkley, MI
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http://helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7

Helifreak.com might be a better source for obtaining this info. Above is a link to the sub-forum that has pretty much all current flybarless units available.
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Old Dec 03, 2012, 08:26 PM
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United States, GA, Rockmart
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverexpress View Post
http://helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7

Helifreak.com might be a better source for obtaining this info. Above is a link to the sub-forum that has pretty much all current flybarless units available.
Funny you gave link to HF there is not even one post over there that i know of about the guardian I know why, cause its for planes and quads as of right now. I did see one person ask about mounting it but that's it. Once they get one for helis I am sure be plenty talk about it
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Old Dec 05, 2012, 01:36 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverexpress View Post
http://helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7

Helifreak.com might be a better source for obtaining this info. Above is a link to the sub-forum that has pretty much all current flybarless units available.
Snip from first post

Quote:
I have spent the last six months or so mostly flying helis and have made the transition to all FBL ones. I am pleased with the performance of the now inexpensive Tarot ZYX and Copter X FBL units however they lack any form of self leveling ( Horizion) or recovery (Rescue) modes.

There are units available with these feactures ,the top of the line one HC 3XS goes for $500 which has all these feactures , then there are the Beat X ,Ikon and a few more at $220 or so and just introduced NAZA H Single Rotor Controller at $270 with various levels of self leveling and emergency recovery (bailout).
I am aware of what is available and how much they cost. Once againg I was trying to get feedback / input on what others would like to see in an ET Guardian 2D/3D Heli version as in simple versus complex.. I thought taht perhaps there would be an interest in a fairly inexpenzive simple recovery mode such as the fixed wing 2D which perhaps would be fairly simple for ET to develop.. I guess there are just not that many interested at this time and I have decided to go with an alternate for now.

Charles
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