Espritmodel.com Telemetry Radio
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 08:33 PM
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Joe,

thank you for the detailed answer.

Now being the cheap a _ _ Italian that I am can you tell me what I would be giving up by using the XG8 for my Pike Perfect versus the XG11?

Stefano
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 09:36 PM
launch low, fly high
New Zealand, Hawke's Bay, Havelock North
Joined Dec 2004
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The primary delta between the two is the ability to individually adjust the various surfaces by flight mode. Functionally, this results in only the loss in capability to do differential flap set point by flight mode (change just the left flap for example). If your linkage is reasonably good, this is not really required. If you do a poor installation (different horn lengths on L vs R or different horn angles), this is an important function to fine tune the installation so as to overcome the bad radio installation.

There is one other delta of note IMO, in that the 11 has the camber slider on the back of the tx, and the 8 has the slider on the side. I am comfortable with both locations. For accuracy, the slider on the back appears to give a bit more tactile feedback to help in defining just how much camber is input, but one needs to get used to the different location.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 09:45 PM
PaulG
Newcastle, NSW Australia
Joined Dec 2004
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Stick Break (brake)

Does anyone use this function to switch off Aileron-Rudder mix when the rudder stick or elevator stick are moved past a settable amount of movement?
I can see the point of it, in that Ail/Rud mix is great (along with aileron differential) for getting you smoothly to the bank angle you want but after that you are better controlling bank angle with the ailerons without having unwanted rudder movements and adjusting the yaw required with the rudder stick. It's just that with me, when I'm flying in competitions I forget all that and mostly fly only with the aileron/ elevator stick and it does not seem to make a great deal of difference. I remember from my full size days that you only needed a little in-turn rudder in normal conditions, although some people did use the rudder to steer the glider into the best lift but I never used that technique because you got funny accelerations like in a side slip where you felt you were being pushed to one side or the other of the cockpit.
Another question, can you switch flight modes with a stick switch on XG8 or XG11? I used to love the feature on my SD10G where the spoiler stick turned landing mode on.
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Old Dec 05, 2012, 05:47 PM
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I called Horizon's technical support today. They said they did not expect any software updates for the JR XG8 that would allow adjusting the trim of each flight control in each flight mode. The XG11 does allow for individual trim on each surface in each flight mode.
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Old Dec 05, 2012, 08:46 PM
launch low, fly high
New Zealand, Hawke's Bay, Havelock North
Joined Dec 2004
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Hoot,

You can set four out of six control surfaces individually via a combination of trim settings and the group setting flight mode trim settings (flap and flaperon). For example, if the ailerons are a bit mismatched in thermal mode, put a click or two of aileron trim to center them. The control trims are based on the flight mode, so the trim adjustment will only show up in the designated flight mode. As noted in a prior post, the only two controls that do not have individual trim capability is the two flaps.

One note for clarification. If you correctly install the servos and control horn length/angles so they are the same left/right, you will not need to do left vs right adjustment of trims. If the installation is a bit in error for left vs right, you can get pretty close to the same result via adjusting the servo travel gain for the left vs right so that the output movement of the control surface is the same for a given stick input. With this adjusted servo travel, the flight mode presets should result in symmetric movement that does not require individual servo adjustments. I've not found any need for the individual flight control trim after performing the above steps.
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Old Dec 05, 2012, 08:47 PM
launch low, fly high
New Zealand, Hawke's Bay, Havelock North
Joined Dec 2004
1,781 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pigly View Post
Does anyone use this function to switch off Aileron-Rudder mix when the rudder stick or elevator stick are moved past a settable amount of movement?
I can see the point of it, in that Ail/Rud mix is great (along with aileron differential) for getting you smoothly to the bank angle you want but after that you are better controlling bank angle with the ailerons without having unwanted rudder movements and adjusting the yaw required with the rudder stick. It's just that with me, when I'm flying in competitions I forget all that and mostly fly only with the aileron/ elevator stick and it does not seem to make a great deal of difference. I remember from my full size days that you only needed a little in-turn rudder in normal conditions, although some people did use the rudder to steer the glider into the best lift but I never used that technique because you got funny accelerations like in a side slip where you felt you were being pushed to one side or the other of the cockpit.
Another question, can you switch flight modes with a stick switch on XG8 or XG11? I used to love the feature on my SD10G where the spoiler stick turned landing mode on.
With the latest software, you can define a stick switch to change flight modes.
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Old Dec 06, 2012, 10:44 AM
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Joe,

you are absolutely correct and that is why I am tempted to buy and use the XG8 for my F3J/TD needs as opposed to the XG11. Not only it is half the cost but also it seems to be a more comfortable size and comes with the 8 channels receiver which will be easier to fit in my Perfect.
Really the only other item to consider is the size of the screen but that is not an issue once we are done setting up the model.

Stefano
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Old Dec 06, 2012, 11:00 AM
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Skellefteċ, Sweden
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Joe W, it seems that you are happy with your JR XG8. Glad to hear that a toppilot is satisfied with such a relatively simple transmitter.
I use the Mpx Cockpit SX which can "almost" be fully approved as F3X glider radio.

/Ville
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Old Dec 09, 2012, 02:41 PM
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Why buy an XG8 or XG11 ?

I was ready to pull the trigger and order an XG11 then I started reading the posts about the XG8. I like the idea of a smaller transmitter with the XG8 but don't like the lack of subtrim for each flap in different flight modes. My concern now is why buy either radio for sailplane flying? I like the idea of voltage monitoring and altimeter readings but other than those features, what else am I getting for my money? I already have a 12X that does more than I am able to program !
Thanks !
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Old Dec 09, 2012, 04:38 PM
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Put your money in receivers for the 12X ... telemetry is cool, but it's hardly a necessity if you are even half-way careful with your equipment.

I have worried about the mushrooming popularity of telemetry when viewed by the FAA ... it would not be a stretch that altitude, airspeed and position data would make it VERY easy to blame a modeler for some FAR infraction. The FAA Modernization Act has been signed into law, but has yet to be "accepted" by the FAA as being a definitive HANDS OFF MODELS directive from Congress. I can easily imagine that this "basic" telemetry would be required by the still forthcoming NPRM ... and the longer it takes the feds to finally approve and submit the NPRM to the public, the more of this telemetry use could be causing changes to the FAA's directives.

Don't get me wrong, telemetry is fun, I have my share of varios, loggers and analysis tools, but I don't rely on them and I certainly don't advertise the fact that I am currently, or capable of, logging the basic parameters of any given flight.

My 2 cents, YMMV ...
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Old Dec 09, 2012, 05:44 PM
PaulG
Newcastle, NSW Australia
Joined Dec 2004
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Modern Transmitters

My advise is if you are happy with your current system stick to it. I have been through Multiplex 3030/Multiplex 4000/JR9303/Airtronics SD10G/XG8. All have their strengths and weaknesses. I think that all present systems are very old fashioned in the way they are programmed, there should be better interfaces with the computer so that one can see what the affect of the programming changes on the aircraft are. None of the modern radios seem to have any examples to give you a starting point and the XG 8's manual apart from the hints and tips, is a complete joke and seems to have been machine translated from its original ( Japanese?). It seems like you have to be a computer nerd or have the ability to imagine the whole of the program inside your head . My mate poured over the manual for 6 weeks before he could make head or tail of it. My manual has annotations all over it telling me what certain features do. I am still not sure how the switch selection system works. I don't understand why JR won't let you choose what channel does what like the Multiplex and SD10's do. I don't understand why they sell a full range receiver with a short range telemetry satellite (631). I got lots of "No Receiver Battery Voltage" beeps before I figured that one out and bought a long range satellite to go with the receiver, putting the price of the receiver up to $150 for a 6 channel receiver. I also had one complete loss of signal with the system that almost lost a $3000 Electric Egida. Never did figure out that one. I have also had one faulty long range satellite replaced under warranty when it would not range check over 5m.
I have had the XG8 for 5 months now and am coming to terms with it. When you know it it is quicker to program than the SD10G but is not as flexible. It does have some nice features and it is light and handy and the switches have a better quality feel than does the SD10 but that has more switches, all 3 position and they are all assignable too. Having looked at the XG 11 manual it seems better and the XG 11 has some features like subtrim on all surfaces that would be useful. I hate using aileron trim to get the ailerons and flaps lined up.
My interest is F3j/F5J gliders and I bought the XG 8 because of its ability to program V tail differential which the SD10G cannot do directly ( but can be approximated through a mix)
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 03:37 PM
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That is something that is not clear in my mind.
The 2.4 antennas are directional so when installing other SPEKTRUM/JR systems we use three or four antennas and point them in different directions (X,Y,Z).
The XG receivers come with 2 antennas (plus the telemetry antenna) so we can only cover two directions. Without a better understanding of how the system operates (different modulations) it would seem that the older system should provide a more reliable connection. Is that not the case?
Stefano
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:13 PM
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liukku's Avatar
Skellefteċ, Sweden
Joined Sep 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanoc2 View Post
That is something that is not clear in my mind.
The 2.4 antennas are directional so when installing other SPEKTRUM/JR systems we use three or four antennas and point them in different directions (X,Y,Z).
The XG receivers come with 2 antennas (plus the telemetry antenna) so we can only cover two directions. Without a better understanding of how the system operates (different modulations) it would seem that the older system should provide a more reliable connection. Is that not the case?
Stefano
Strangely, may seem. But many other manufacturers seem to manage with only two antennas. So why not JR, but above all, why not Spektrum? One can really wonder why?

/Ville
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 04:59 PM
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Just unpacked my XG8 that I will be using for the Perfection (that package should be here tomorrow).
Does not look like a straight transition from the 9303. Has anybody written a programming guide for open saiplanes?
Stefano
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 08:27 PM
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Stefano,
Looking forward to seeing your new XG8 transmitter
Gibson
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