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Old Oct 22, 2012, 04:32 AM
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Mackey's .049 flying wing, the RedWing. Scratch built one and it was a whole different perf envelope than the flying bricks.
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Old Oct 22, 2012, 11:20 AM
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I have no idea what it was.

My father built it out of several older plane parts, put a McCoy redhead 19 on it and he taught me how to fly with it. That was back in 1964 or there abouts.

Control line was really beginning to take hold back then in the Northwest. My father had flown in several local contests and was a CD back then as well. He was a pit crew member of the 64 hour record flight by the Prop Spinners of Eugene Or.

George
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Old Oct 22, 2012, 11:27 AM
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Wow, George, that is impressive, 64 hours by a CL plane. I could imagine the teamwork it took to maintain that, constant feed of glow fuel from a stationary source through control handle under constant regulated pressure or a large aircraft that is a flying fuel tank, switching off of flyers every 10 to 15 minutes whilst maintaining flight for 2-1/2 days continuous flight.

I bet you learned a lot from your Dad!
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 12:30 AM
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OkiThumper,

Yes, I did learn a lot from my Dad. However, I make my own mistakes... The pilots took 30 minutes at a time on the handle... You can read more here on the 64 hour flight if you like...

http://obastclair.com/index.html

and here:

http://flyinglines.org/History.07.html (scroll down towards bottom of page)

George
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 09:47 PM
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Yes, I did learn a lot from my Dad. However, I make my own mistakes... The pilots took 30 minutes at a time on the handle... You can read more here on the 64 hour flight if you like... http://obastclair.com/index.html and here: http://flyinglines.org/History.07.html (scroll down towards bottom of page)
Really interesting reading, George. Your Dad was quite a man and humble at that. I'd expect one to make their own mistakes; it is the only way one learns. Otherwise, it is all academic. I've certainly made my share of them. It's how I learned to repair my creations and get better at building by replacing expired creations.
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 09:54 PM
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Thanks OkiThumper. A lot more info there than expected? It is good reading.
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 10:45 PM
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Thanks OkiThumper. A lot more info there than expected? It is good reading.
I thought it interesting how your Dad is considered the father of C/L. I thought it rather tacky that Jim Walker would sue L.M. Cox for using the bellcrank system and reel handles, since he did not invent them. It was too bad that he didn't team up with your Dad. Anyway, interesting reading. I thought the system of autoreeling in line when tension was lost due to wind ingenious. The court considering him the "father of CL" was a nice compliment.

Speaking of innovation, it kind of reminds me of a less ingenious achievement but worth helping out the noob.

Carl Goldberg came up with another scheme for the 1/2-A CL Wizard trainer, with rubber banded landing gear for extra give, rubber banded motor mount to shed the engine instead of breaking it upon a crash; and something about the control line controls, to cause the plane to fly outward to regain line tension when windy. Can't remember the exact details, don't know if it was an auto aileron or rudder that caused plane to move out or what.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 01:09 AM
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It wasn't as original to his Wizard. A "Sky Hook" is a outboard tip "rudder" of sorts, angled outward. Making the model "crab" with out rudder doesn't work at higher levels, and worsens the ability to perform a wingover, but the angled flying tab on the tip keeps working in all attitudes.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 08:48 AM
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I remember one of the neighbor kids had a Wizard with an elastic hookup to maintain line tension, but can't remember much. It said it allowed 52 ft. lines so you wouldn't get dizzy. I think it just gave a bit of up when the lines went slack, but it may have been a rudder offset. I didn't really look that close and it was almost 40 years ago.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 12:19 PM
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My father was not the inventor of the bellcrank system. And I did not mean to imply that. I knew Oba as a teenager.

However my father did know Oba St. Clair very well. In the picture of the record setting group, my father is stand, forth from left, Kinda hiding in the back.

Oba was a very quiet gentleman, never wanting to take credit for the invention. Jim Walker on the other hand was very out going and with very good showmanship abilities. Leroy Cox knew where the invention of the bellcrank originated and brought Oba into the law suit. I have heard that Jim Walker was having heart ailment issues during the Law suit. Dale Kirn told me I should go read the court transcripts. Though I never took the time.

George Gilbert
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 01:25 PM
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My bad, George. The problem with Internet and written communication is that it is difficult to express one's self (me) and ask questions, receive correction, discussion, etc. Regarding reading the court transcripts, I don't know if there really is any value in that, too much to read. Perhaps the concluding statements by the judge in a court paper might be more productive. It cuts to the chase. Your Dad didn't have anything to do with the Gilbert CL engines, did he?
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 01:28 PM
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I remember one of the neighbor kids had a Wizard with an elastic hookup to maintain line tension, but can't remember much. It said it allowed 52 ft. lines so you wouldn't get dizzy. I think it just gave a bit of up when the lines went slack, but it may have been a rudder offset. I didn't really look that close and it was almost 40 years ago.
I think you may be right on giving a little up elevator. AFAIK, it was a rubber band on the pushrod end of the bellcrank. I don't know if I'd want to try it on 52 ft. lines unless an almost perfect calm day, which is almost as rare as hens teeth in this neck of the woods.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 02:08 PM
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OkiThumper,

AC Gilbert was the owner of the engine stuff. There is a park and collection here in Salem Oregon dedicated to Gilbert toys. Which by the way made more on the "Erector Set" than anything else.

Definately not part of my family. Though my older brother had lots of erector set stuff.

George
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 03:24 PM
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AC Gilbert was the owner of the engine stuff. There is a park and collection here in Salem Oregon dedicated to Gilbert toys. Which by the way made more on the "Erector Set" than anything else. Definitely not part of my family. Though my older brother had lots of erector set stuff
Yes, those Erector Sets probably did more to spur children to become engineers more than anything else. I never had an Erector Set, but had a Kenner's Girder and Panel construction set, built bridges, buildings, etc. But always had the fascination for stuff in motion. Probably why I went to mechanical instead of civil engineering.

As they say, Mechanical engineers build weapons, civil engineers build targets.

I have a couple AC Gilbert engines and noticed the last name, hence why I asked.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 04:36 PM
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I forgot about that one, Kinner's girder sets were fantastic. To many small parts for today's safety standards.

George
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