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Old Oct 13, 2012, 08:01 PM
Don't take any wooden nickels
finguz's Avatar
United States, CA, San Diego
Joined Mar 2012
2,365 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by xtian3188 View Post
i already watch those videos from day 1 to 10 and that convinced me to skip sims and fp's. I'll be blaming him if my first 450 crashes. just kidding.
Be careful, take it slow, and keep the tail pointed towards when you do decide to hover. Tail and side-in is going to be a beast learning without a sim, not to mention inverted (if you choose to do so).

Again, be careful. It's at least good to see you're educating yourself with videos. Good luck.
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 09:17 PM
KDS450QS(ZYX4),V977,CX-20
FyreSG's Avatar
United States, CA, Monterey
Joined Apr 2012
5,589 Posts
Something has to be sacrificed from the low priced KDS450QS.

Unlike the more expensive helicopters, this largely plastic helicopter damages very easily and even slightly damaged plastic parts must be replaced. I found out the hard way. If the parts are made of metal, I might have saved more money than replacing the plastic parts over and over again.

I'm not trying to be mean but it is really difficult to learn flying with a KDS450QS. And I have experience with various quads and helicopters. And... I know many people like me who struggled with their 450 helis, but they are lucky to have durable helicopters so while their initial start up cost is higher, they save a lot more money in repairs.

To end off, remember - replace damaged plastic parts. You will break the helicopter, you must replace the parts. Do not be impatient and fix them with glue. It may cause more damage to the helicopter or even hurt people around.

Good luck!
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 06:45 PM
Tuguegarao City Philippines
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Joined Sep 2012
375 Posts
thanks for the advise fyresg. too bad i already got one just this past friday.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 07:04 PM
Tuguegarao City Philippines
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Joined Sep 2012
375 Posts
my first 450 arrived 2 days ago.

the heli is smaller than i expected because for over a month, its just pictures and videos of it that i see. its even smaller than my s033g. anyways, its only now that i got the chance to test it and attempt to hover it. surprisingly, ITS VERY DIFFICULT TO FLY! it really liked tip over to the side luckily i secured my homemade training gear. as of now, I'm familiarizing myself with the controls and scooting or skidding (i dont know what they call it) on the pavement. i'll post some videos if i can hover it at least 2ft above the ground.

oh and i am not able to make an unboxing video since its my first 450, can't help myself getting very very excited.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 08:17 PM
KDS450QS(ZYX4),V977,CX-20
FyreSG's Avatar
United States, CA, Monterey
Joined Apr 2012
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Ensure that the screws and bolts are tight and the crucial ones are secured with loctite. On mine, a tail ball link and a swashplate ball link flew out while in flight on 2 separate ocassions. The crashes were spectacular.

You should perform a full helicopter setup especially the tail and swash, because this heli is not truly RTF. I had to setup the tail and swash after realizing while in flight that the heli was drifting all over, but I thought it was normal for a CCPM heli until I got a pro to try. After setting up correctly the heli was much more manageble, but still worlds apart from my V911.

If you don't know, never flick the Idle-1 switch.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 08:21 PM
Tuguegarao City Philippines
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Joined Sep 2012
375 Posts
i noticed that also. i performed torque test on the screws on the moving parts. some are not tight enough.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 08:26 PM
Tuguegarao City Philippines
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Joined Sep 2012
375 Posts
does hovering at a higher altitude makes the heli more stable than lower? mine sways from sideways. scares me a lot.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 08:32 PM
KDS450QS(ZYX4),V977,CX-20
FyreSG's Avatar
United States, CA, Monterey
Joined Apr 2012
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But do not over tighten certain screws like the ones holding the main rotor blades or the tail blades.

Also check the belt tension. It was a little too tight on mine so I had to loosen it. But too tight is better than too loose.

Do not apply rudder trims on the transmitter. I did this on my toy helis to fix the tail drift but it is wrong. You may wish to read up on this. I am still having a lot of problems with tail drift. Gonna redo tail setup later.

The 4 x 9G servos are poor quality. Two of them wore out just after a few flights. I replaced the tail servo with a N590. It's expensive, 10 times the cost.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 08:36 PM
KDS450QS(ZYX4),V977,CX-20
FyreSG's Avatar
United States, CA, Monterey
Joined Apr 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xtian3188 View Post
does hovering at a higher altitude makes the heli more stable than lower? mine sways from sideways. scares me a lot.
Too low, there'll be ground effect. It's not that great, I feel.

Too high, there'll be breezes which will send the heli up and down a lot. That is quite scary as you need to adjust the throttle very quickly.

The instablility is normal, as in the heli will not be as stable as a coaxial or a fixed pitch. But it can be tweaked to be more stable if you know how. You gotta read up cos I'm not expert.

I got pros to help me improve stability by ensuring the heli was properly setup. There was quite a lot of tweaking.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 09:56 PM
Cranky old fart
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Germantown, WI.
Joined Oct 2007
21,486 Posts
Hover at least waist high. You haven't crashed yet, so you have already beat the odds.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 10:09 PM
Tuguegarao City Philippines
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Joined Sep 2012
375 Posts
in my case, no one here in our place plays rc except me. i'm learning on youtube and here in the forum from you guys.

finished practice hovering just now and i'm quite happy with my progress. its my 4th flight (actually attempted flight) on my kds450qs and i managed to hover for at least 10 seconds. not much for you guys but to me, it means a lot. compared to my first 3. it may be easier if i let go off the training gear but its to early. the battery is charging for the 5th time for my 5th attempt on flying.

speaking of the battery, is it safe if i charge the 2200mAh 20c battery at 4amps? cant find the c rating for charging on this battery.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 10:16 PM
Tuguegarao City Philippines
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Joined Sep 2012
375 Posts
no crash yet as of now. im afraid i might get over confident again (like in the first post on this thread) and attempt a higher altitude flying which may result to my first crash.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 11:52 PM
My goal is fly more crash less
United States, DC, Washington
Joined Jul 2012
75 Posts
What happened to the hype?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtian3188 View Post
weather good or bad, I will post it here.


yep, licensed electronics engineer. sensitivity of the controls can be decreased in EPA and EXP.

What? I think everyone thought you would set it up and just go for it. You know, like you said. Waited so long for the spectacular first flight video only now to learn you were putti training gear on?!?

Seriously...smartest move you could have done since you seemed determined not to go with the simulator route when you started this thread.

:-)
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Old Nov 18, 2012, 01:28 AM
KDS450QS(ZYX4),V977,CX-20
FyreSG's Avatar
United States, CA, Monterey
Joined Apr 2012
5,589 Posts
Some points for your reference

I'm amazed that at your 4th try you could hover for 10 seconds. Here're some notes just in case you're unaware.

Do not deplete the battery fully. Set the timer to 6 minutes and ensure you don't exceed that. You may wish to reduce battery usage but using a lower max throttle. For me, my last 2 points are 80 and 85.

Rest your battery before charging. Do not keep your battery fully charged for more than X days. For me, I pick X = 3. I fly my heli over the weekends so I'll charge them on Friday nights. If it rains on Saturday or Sunday, I'll discharge the batts to 3.75V before storing them away. If I get to fly, I'll deplete the batt to 3.75V and but keep them in a safe place before charging them the next Friday.

You need to put your finger at Throttle Hold, and learn to activate it when you realize you can't save your helicopter. Reducing throttle to 0 will simply smash your helicopter hard onto the ground. For a start, you may set your first 2 pitch points as 47 and 49 so if you accidentally reduce throttle when you panic, it will not drop that fast. Note that negative pitch is required as a safety measure against sudden gust of wind. I learnt that the hard way - a sudden gust of wind came, sent my heli high up, and caught me by surprise. I reduced throttle but it wasn't sufficient and soon it was 2 meters above me. It was extremely scary and I couldn't think properly, so the helicopter crashed.

Your training skids are your best investments right now. If you find it affecting your hover, maybe you've made it too big, bogging your helicopter with too much weight. I don't feel the training skids to impact negatively during hover training. In fact, I hovered better with it as I know my heli has a "safety net". More confidence, less worries, better flyer performance!

Take the time now to buy replacement parts. It is impossible to stay crash free. Avoid waiting too long for the parts to arrive. After a 3 week break from hover training, I found myself struggling to hover.

You may wish to order the following:
  • Wooden blades
  • Flybar metal pole (get the original KDS part unless you're sure it fits)
  • Rotor head (get the original KDS part unless you're sure it fits)
  • Swashplate
  • Ball links and screws (get the original KDS part unless you're sure it fits)
  • Linkage rods (get the original KDS part unless you're sure it fits)
  • Main gears (get the original KDS part unless you're sure it fits)
Despite crashing hard a few times, my main shaft and feathering shaft are still ok. I suspect it has to do with the use of low head speed and activating throttle hold on time.

Disclaimer: I may have stated some stuff wrongly because I'm also new to this hobby. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old Nov 18, 2012, 01:36 AM
KDS450QS(ZYX4),V977,CX-20
FyreSG's Avatar
United States, CA, Monterey
Joined Apr 2012
5,589 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by xtian3188 View Post
sensitivity of the controls can be decreased in EPA and EXP.
By the default the two EPAs are 100 (switch up) and 60 (switch down). For hover training, use 60. Avoid putting a high negative expo (too low expo value). Yes, it decrease sensitivity but when you need to make emergency corrections, you may need to move the stick so much that the correction is not executed fast enough. When I first started, I used an expo of -5 for the cyclics and rudder.


Show us some videos of your learning experience!
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