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Old Dec 01, 2003, 05:31 PM
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Aveox 36/30/2

Hello all:

I know you guys at the top of the eheli scene get sick of guys like me at the bottom. I'm trying to learn! My head is spinning, but I think I have narrowed this motor choice down. I am just learning to fly heli's so duration is everything. Would a Aveox 36/30/2 be a good choice in the beginning. If I can get my hands on one, I would like to go with a TP 5s3p. Or would a 4s4p be better in the beginning. I forgot to mention I will be using a Logo 10. I used Dan's spreadsheet, it looks to be a wonderful tool for Logo enthusiasts. My problem is I don't know enough about electric motors or helicopters to make an educated decision about the way to proceed.

From what I can see, Cincinnati is void of electric helicopter hobbiest. I have to try to learn this stuff from you guys.
Example: I dont have a clue as to what headspeed I should shoot for when learning to hover.

When can I expect one of the Senior members with vast amounts of epowered heli's to write a book? Or could anyone point me towards a good book on the subject.

Thanks for anything I pick up.
Thanks for any reply

Dave Hughes
"motorless in Cincinnati"
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 05:51 PM
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Re: Aveox 36/30/2

Quote:
Originally posted by Stearmandriver
Hello all:

I know you guys at the top of the eheli scene get sick of guys like me at the bottom. I'm trying to learn! My head is spinning, but I think I have narrowed this motor choice down. I am just learning to fly heli's so duration is everything. Would a Aveox 36/30/2 be a good choice in the beginning. If I can get my hands on one, I would like to go with a TP 5s3p. Or would a 4s4p be better in the beginning. I forgot to mention I will be using a Logo 10.
"motorless in Cincinnati"
That is about a 1400KV motor which should be close for what you have in mind. Add a heat sink to the motor for lithium use as the long runs can get things pretty warm.

I have been flying the 3624/2 in my Logo 10 for just under 2 years of trouble free flying!

Steve
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 06:00 PM
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Thanks Steve!

I'm looking forward to starting.

Dave
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 07:12 PM
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Steve, which heat sink works best for the 36/24/2 motor?
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 10:38 PM
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There aren't any books which cover electric helis, to my knowledge. They all cover nitro helis.

The EHBG v11 (in the top few threads of this forum) is practically a book - it's up to 110 pages. Have you read it yet?

Toshi
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 10:43 PM
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I used that exact setup for several months and it worked great! In fact, it has been my benchmark for comparing all the higher voltage setups we've been testing.

Two things make this a great combo. First, with the 5s configuration, you get the benefit of the higher torque/power due to the higher voltage. Secondly, the 36/30 ihas a can size that is longer than the standard "600"-size, like a Kontronik 600-xx or Hacker B/C50-xxL, which also means added torque/power.

As for heatsinks, I just used a couple of Associated car-type snap-on heatsinks that I go at my LHS.

You will get run times roughly equal to a 4s4p setup, as this combo will draw less current. I was getting 18-20 minutes.

-- Gary
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 01:37 AM
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What about other AVEOX

Aveox 36/38/2 (1130 RPM/V, 341g),
Aveox 36/30/3 (990 RPM/V, 285g),
Aveox 36/24/4 (980 RPM/V, 243g), in math, are they aslo potential candidates for TP/Tanic 6-8S/2S li-po with smaller pinion setup? will them Inferior to Hacker equivalent Kv B50 brushless?
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 09:16 AM
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As a matter of fact, I just installed a 36/38/2, with a 1/8" shaft/12T pinion in my stretched Logo 10. It has a "marked" kV of 1195. I'm going to test this today, hopefully, with the 8s2p Tanic pack and an 8s3p TP setup. Later, I will change to a 10T and then try a 10s2p TP configuration.

I had a B50-14XL installed before the new Aveox and it worked great as long as I used it with something other than a Hacker/Jeti controller. I couldn't get the headspeed above 1950 with the 48-3P, even with the 8s2p Tanic pack. It eventually quit working and I switched to an Aveox SH-48. The headspeed shot up to 2400 (!), which is why I started looking for something with a 1/8" shaft. Hacker couldn't be bothered but Aveox had no problem providing me with one. I've also switched now to the SH-96 controller, just for an extra margin, currentwise. With the 8s2p Tanic pack, we were seeing currents above 50A briefly, when it was pulling 1400W in a tight climbing spiral.

What I've found so far is that 1000W is about all you can squeeze out of a Logo 10 with 500mm blades. The most I ever saw with the 36/30/2 and the 5s3p pack was about 750W. You need to go to 8s2p to get to 1000W. I didn't try it, but I think the 36/30/2 with a 1/8" shaft and a 10T would get there, and maybe a 36/24/3 (1300 kV...) with an 11T as well. Both of these setups should work with a TP 8s2p pack as the maximum sustained current would be kept under 9C. For anything above 9C, the TPs will start dropping voltage quickly. The Tanics seem to be about 3C higher, across the board.

To get more than 1000W, you need to go to the stretched boom so you can use regular 30-size 550mm blades. This is where you can really use the extra torque/power that the larger 36/38 and B/C50-XL motors can provide. The 36/38/2 with the 12T pinion and the 8s2p Tanic should provide insane power but I think that might even be improved on a bit with a 10s2p TP or Tanic configuration and a 10T pinion. On paper that combo would put out well above 2000W but I doubt I'll be able to get that with the 550 blades. Maybe in Ben's Logo 20 with the 50-size 600mm blades. Can't wait for the next slimer drag race!

-- Gary
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 09:36 AM
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Thanks to everyone for the replies.

I have read Toshi's newbie guide. The frequently asked question section is good also.

Gary- How do you like the Aveox esc?

Thanks
Dave
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 10:57 AM
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I love the Aveox controller. It has a perfect governor mode and a nice smooth startup. It'll also work with up to 10s configurations.

-- Gary
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 11:34 PM
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Gary, what on earth do you need over 1950 HS for

Dave, you may also want to look at a standard setup also. With a 1500-1800 KV motor you can learn on 12-14 cell packs, then go to Lipos for longer flights.

I use a Kont 600-17 (1700 KV) in mine with 4s4p and get 1850 HS and the heli is solid as a rock.

The same KV motor with 12 cells will get you flying nicely. Add lipos later and go crazy
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Old Dec 03, 2003, 01:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fred Bronk
Gary, what on earth do you need over 1950 HS for
Because I can...


Actually, the Logo 10 has a natural "sweet spot" at just over 2000. It just flys much smoother at that speed for some reason. The other reason that you need the speed for is to get the max power. Granted this is necessary for 90% of most people's flying, including yours and mine, but I'm trying to see just how far it can be pushed.

-- Gary
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Old Dec 03, 2003, 12:29 PM
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Thanks Gary for the additional info.

Hey Fred, what would be a good Aveox motor that would compare to the Kon 600-17?

Dave
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Old Dec 03, 2003, 05:17 PM
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The 36/30/1.5 is a bit on the hot side for HV and lipos (cept for Gary) with a KN of 1840. But would work well on 12 cells.

The 36/38/1.5 is a bit mild, but would work well with 12 cells for learning and handle HV later with lipos since the KV is 1500.
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Old Dec 03, 2003, 09:44 PM
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I guess I'd still vote for the 36/30/2 and the 5s3p configuration. I got a headspeed of 1880 with a 13T pinion and 1920 with a 14T. It will run cooler than a 4s4p configuration because it draws less current for the same power. The 36/30/1.5 actually has a kV of 1980 and is hotter than the 600-18. It is really closer to a C50-13L. As such, it will run very hot with a 4s4p setup.

Since you didn't mention anything but LiPos, I'm assuming you will start with them, which I think is the correct path, if you can afford it. That way you don't have to make compromises just so NiCd/NiMH packs can be used. I know I'll probably get flamed for this but that's how I feel.

-- Gary
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