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Old Dec 01, 2003, 12:10 PM
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Pollock Pines, CA
Joined Aug 2002
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Micro EDF Unit from Electric Powered Products

Does anyone have any experience with the Micro EDF 400 from Electric Powered Products, Inc. ? This was sold by the Electric Jet Factory. The brochure claims a static Thrust of 7 to 8 ounces with a 7x500AR or 8x500ARpace or 9x950AAU or 10x950AAU pack. Any info. will be of help. I am considering using it in the Flying Styro FA7-C Corsair II. I have a Vasa 55 on the bench, but was saving it for my F-16 from Flying Styro. Thanks. Gentlemen. Dennis
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 12:38 PM
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Ed Waldrep's Avatar
Las Vegas, NV
Joined Dec 1996
7,933 Posts
I had one several years ago, there are better fans out there now. The fan is basically the same as the Red Flame Blaster from Hiline products, but instead of a press on rotor it has a custom aluminum shaft adapter with a set screw. The rotor is kinda flimsy, it's ok for a speed 400 but might not be strong enough for a brushless motor. Also, the spinner is of vacuum formed plastic and is glued on. The set screw that secures the adapter is behind the spinner and in front of the rotor (the adapter is glued to the front of the rotor due to there being very little room between the front of the motor housing and the front of the outside duct. I mention the short distance because I used this fan housing with a brushless motor and a Kyosho fan rotor. After assembly I saw that the rotor was sticking so far forward that half of it was outside the housing! To fix this I put two 1/8 inch ply spacers inside the motor housing in the front, thereby moving the motor back enough so that the ran blades were fully enclose by the housing. What a pain.

One thing more to note, the EJF 400 fan doesn't have an inlet lip molded in. If you are putting it into a plane with inlet ducting, that's a good thing, but if it will sit in an open fuselage with not ducting, you'll need to make an inlet lip out of foam or balsa (no inlet lip means 20-30 percent thrust loss.

This was a bit of work and nowdays not really necessary because there are other fan units available. If you want a cheap fan then this unit is ok, but upgrading it would be difficult. You could put a small brushless in it if the motor uses a 2.3mm shaft, but I don't know how the flimsy rotor would hold up...it may be that with more power the blades would "flatten out" and lose their pitch, thereby negating any power increase. Just a theory.

I don't know if EJF even carries the fan anymore.

The EJF 400 fan is a 2.5" diameter fan, so are the Vasa 65 and the Wattage fan (more or less, not sure of diameter down to the 100ths of an inch. Both the Vasa 65 and Wattage fan have inlet lips, so they work ok inside the fuse of the Flying Styro planes if you don't use inlet ducting (I'm not sure what the current thinking is on these planes as far as if ducting is needed or not).

I've used both the Vasa 65 and Wattage. I like the lightness of the Vasa but not the price, and the rotor is a pain to get off of the adapter (tight fit). The Wattage Powerfan is cheap and will take a brushless motor. The rotor is flimsy (just broke another rotor the other day trying to loosen the nut on the adapter) but it holds up ok at 170 watts on my brushless setup. More power than that and you probably need to cut down a Kyosho rotor on a drill press to make it fit. The Kyosho can absorb more power.

I don't know how tight a fit these 2.5inch/65mm fans will be in a FS A-7 or if they will fit, you'll have to look for info in the various FS A7/F-16 threads here on the zone, use the Search function.

Well that's what I know/don't know. Whew!
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 03:32 PM
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James Frolik's Avatar
Cologne, Germany
Joined Dec 1996
2,396 Posts
No inlet lip causes approximately 20- to 30-percent thrust loss? Whoa!

Now I know why my Flying Styro F-16 struggles. I've always thought that with only about 5% more thrust it wouldn't wallow and actually start to climb -- it's always so close but just gently settles while rocking its wings.

The mistake when building it was deciding I'd affix an inlet lip afterwards. Then, once completely assembled, I couldn't get in there any more without major belly surgery. It appeared to have loads of static thrust, and everyone thought it was a "sure thing." But it wasn't.

Setup: Speed 300, Micro Fan, 8 x AR500, bungee launch. It's not the most potent setup, but now I know with an inlet lip it'll work okay. So, belly surgery is required.
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Old Dec 01, 2003, 08:22 PM
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Ed Waldrep's Avatar
Las Vegas, NV
Joined Dec 1996
7,933 Posts
Static thrust is most affected by the lack of an inlet lip. The faster you go the less impact it has. Once moving forward you are supplying the fan with more air so it doesn't suck as much from the sides. Imagine the sharp turn air has to make at rest when the model is first started. If you imagine the molecules are cars, the can make the turn at a city street corner only so fast because the turning radius is very tight. Now put them on the freeway (or autobahn in your case ) and the cars make make the much higher radius curves at much higher speeds.
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 03:32 PM
JB
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JB's Avatar
Copenhagen, Denmark
Joined Jan 2000
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Ed,
It reminds me of sitting in an aircraft on a rainy day watching the raindrops on the engine nacelles during take off: The raindrops move forward !!!
JB
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Old Dec 02, 2003, 04:23 PM
Balsa Flies Better!
Stamford, CT
Joined Oct 2000
6,734 Posts
Hi Dennis

I think that was my first attempt at ducted fan stuff. One quick trick to put a lip on the fan is to use some fuel tubing, slit it, and wrap that around the front. Getting it to stay on was a bit tough, but the Zap a Dap a Goo sort of did it.

Check with u812- Steve I think had a pretty successful version of this airplane- he liked it more than the F-16. It's certainly sturdier. I'd definitely kick around using li-poly technology to run the fans though- these airplanes are very weight sensitive and li-poly is a lot lighter than nickel chemistry. In terms of bang for the buck- I'd pick li-poly over brushless.

Another option if you're going li-poly- do a little digging- see if anybody has used a Rocket 400 motor it's a wind in between a 6V 400 and a 4.8V 400- Kirk sells them. This might work OK on a 2 cell li-poly approach- I'm worried that on 2 cell li-polys with a 6V motor- it won't get the amps to where they need to go. I think 3 cells will work, but I doubt the motor will last all that long- and they're a pain to replace when installed.

Regards

Sam
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Old Dec 03, 2003, 11:42 AM
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Larry Dudeck's Avatar
Williamsville, NY, USA
Joined Sep 2000
4,498 Posts
You can still buy the RFB direct from HiLine (no web or e-mail, advertises in mags). They are about $30, probably the least expensive of any EDF out there. But like so much of what we buy for E-power, the old adage holds true. "Buy cheap, buy twice"

I have had four of them, two from EJF. Robert @ EJF recommended 8x600AE packs for a single fan installtion. One of the speed 400 motors fried after 35 flights, the other is still usable but the plane it was powering isn't.

The last two units I purchased directly from HiLine and these had the aluminum shaft adapter with a set screw. I used these two, wired in parallel, with an 8XCP1700 pack. The pushed my 42 oz TwinBizJet around OK but left a lot to be desired during hand launch.

Ditto on the inlet lip,
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