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Old Oct 01, 2012, 02:49 AM
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South Africa, WC, Cape Town
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Kerwin,
I have to disagree with you.
The TWIST has HUGE control surfaces and is a fully aerobatic plane.
In the hands of most people who've only flown a high-wing trainer it is likely to get out of control very quickly or at best they will struggle to control it and not enjoy the flights.

There is a huge varierty of planes that are far more easy to control and offer a better choice as a 2nd plane.

Examples - Sig Star 40, Pulse 40 or better yet Pulse 60.

Brgds,
Danny
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Old Oct 01, 2012, 05:43 PM
Hutch
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United States, Mt, Bozeman
Joined Jan 2012
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I like my 4*40, but it may not be the best "second" plane, if you like to make steps that aren't too big.... its easy enough to fly, but taildragging can be tough for some (I've only flown a foamy tricycle gear). My father in law got the GP Easy Sport, and likes it well enough. Lands a bit easier than the four star, but doesn't have near the performance envelope. I'm guessing the Pulse.. Escapade... and others perform much similar to the 4*. I'd really like to get my mitts on a 4*60 or 120. I always thought bigger planes looked easier to fly, at least in the montana wind.
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Old Oct 01, 2012, 07:13 PM
Garfield is my Pilot
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Good point if you are transitioning to a tail dragger, the 4* may not be the right plane. At least the 120 size wouldnt be. It tends to swing its nose rather fast on takeoff, so if you arent prepared for it you could lose it on takeoff. If you never flew a TD before, maybe converting a trike to TD first would be the next step.
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 08:04 AM
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The key to ensure good direction control on take-off with a tail-dragger is to advance the throttle real slowly, this makes the transition less sudden and allows you much easier control with the rudder.
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 08:43 AM
Garfield is my Pilot
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It is also a good point to make sure the tail wheel is straight, and not to use the rudder trim to correct ground handling. Also having correct thrust angles for the engine is highly recommended. The 4*120 that I lost the other day I had just resolved a problem with it veering left on both takeoff and in vertical flight by adding in more right thrust. The two takeoffs I did were spot on, needed very little rudder to correct once the tail wheel left the ground. Sadly though the right wing snapped off, which resulted in a death spiral. Thankfully SIG came through and is replacing the ARF with a kit.
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 01:59 PM
Hutch
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United States, Mt, Bozeman
Joined Jan 2012
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Did someone say gyro?
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=10113

I don't use one in my 4*, but i did use one on a taildragging camera plane I had that was the biggest pain to taxi/takeoff.

For (cross) windy days it is really nice
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 06:34 PM
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winston mo
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Yes the twist is a fully aerobatic airplane. The biggest problem with a twist vs the other planes, is she will give you bad habbits because this plane is very hard to stall.
Even beginer solo pilots can fly a twist 40. But O yes she can get away from a novice.
But thats where common sense comes in an not to fly past your limitations.
For learning basic aerobatics the twist is the best out there.
Learning to fly a vertical, inverted, split s, stall turns, flat spins. This plane makes it all too easy.
In the wind is where this plane really excels.
In my 20 plus years of flying I've never found an easier nitro aerobatic trainer, and I've flown them all including the 4 star.
As a matter of fact the 4 star is a quicker, faster plane than the fat winged twist
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 07:34 PM
Garfield is my Pilot
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Oh I dont know, the 4*120 was pretty easy to do all you mentioned. Stall turns were a blast. I havent done any flat spins though, not sure how to yet. Its very predictable too when it stalls, it will always drop its nose.
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Old Oct 06, 2012, 04:44 PM
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winston mo
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the sercert to a flat spin is lot's an lots of rudder.
I like to fly vertical and then just like a stall turn I chop the throttle and kick the rudder. I hold the rudder and then after a second or so I pull hard elevator. Left rudder for up rights and right for inverted. Add throttle if needed to raise the nose.
Do this 3 mistakes high.
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Old Oct 06, 2012, 08:25 PM
Garfield is my Pilot
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Well, now I have a goal for when I get my new 4* built!
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Old Oct 08, 2012, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
In my 20 plus years of flying I've never found an easier nitro aerobatic trainer,
Sure, the Twist is good if you want to learn aerobatics.

IMO the person who has just got past the stage of learning to fly solo with a high-wing (most of them with generoud Dihedral) trainer and is looking for his first low-wing plane is not yet ready for a plane that is designed for full aerobatics.

The question in the OP of this thread was what is a good plane after a trainer, and I dont think that the Twist or any other full aerobatic plane is suitable.

A suitable plane would be with a low-wing, low wing loading, some dihedral and a non-simetric airfoil shaped wing. this will allow it to be flown relatively slow without risking a stall yet will be possible to do a fair degree of aerobatics once the pilot becomes familiar and confident with it.

As an example, google the Hangar-9 Pulse 60. any similar plane would be suitable.

Brgds,

Danny
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Old Oct 08, 2012, 09:30 AM
Garfield is my Pilot
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You described the 4* series to a T. Very slow flyer, and very predictable stalls. It drops its nose when it stalls, not a wing. It also performs all the maneuvers quite well. It is also a very easy kit to build, it can almost put itself together.
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Old Oct 09, 2012, 07:01 AM
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South Africa, WC, Cape Town
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Hi Acdii,
That is exactly why I mentioned it on my first response to the opening post.

In general I often see people rushing to get larger, faster and very aerobatic models because it is cool to have them and they either struggle with them to the point where they dont enjoy the flights or worse, they end up pranging them to bits.

IMO it is better and more fun to go through the various planes in a more progressive way, one step at a time.

A person will do himself a favour if he gets the more aerobatic (which are more demanding, prone to tipstalls and less forgiving) in due time when he is ready for them.

Brgds,

Danny
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Old Oct 09, 2012, 09:23 AM
The Prez....... again
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United States, IA, Rockwell
Joined Jul 2011
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In my opinion, it is the pilot not the airframe that is usually the limiting factor in what the plane will do.

We have a pretty good pilot at our field with a 4 star 60. He does rolling circles and all the other maneuvers just fine. The 4 star series IMO make a pretty good second plane.

Learning a tail dragger is just another step. A tail dragger is only a "problem" on the ground. Some taxi practice, both low and high speed for 20 minutes or so will solve that problem quickly.

Ken
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Old Oct 09, 2012, 10:46 AM
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South Africa, WC, Cape Town
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Quote:
In my opinion, it is the pilot not the airframe that is usually the limiting factor in what the plane will do.

We have a pretty good pilot at our field with a 4 star 60. He does rolling circles and all the other maneuvers just fine. The 4 star series IMO make a pretty good second plane.

Learning a tail dragger is just another step. A tail dragger is only a "problem" on the ground. Some taxi practice, both low and high speed for 20 minutes or so will solve that problem quickly.

Ken
+1

The real problem is when pilots take off with a plane that is beyond their ability to manage.
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