HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Sep 13, 2012, 07:15 PM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,075 Posts
Discussion
New French VTPR aerobatics videos - Remi and Eric are back!!

GET STOKED!!!

Rémi Le Besque and Eric Poulain have made some new videos of their flying this summer in Brittany!! It's been a long time since we've seen anything new from these guys, but oh man, am I stoked to see them put out something new!

They are flying the Excalibur 2, a VTPR glider designed by Eric with inspiration from the Quartz of Francois Cahour. The Excalibur is one of the most famous and beloved French VTPR designs, and with good reason!!

Remi Lestrevet 1 (0 min 50 sec)


Remi Lestrevet 2 (1 min 0 sec)


Menez Eric 1 (0 min 36 sec)


Menez Eric 2 (1 min 0 sec)


In case you are new to VTPR and slope aerobatics, Eric and Rémi are two of the best-known French R/C glider aerobatics pilots and widely considered the original masters of VTPR . Their video Menez-Hom 2005 was hugely inspirational worldwide and helped build interest in VTPR and slope aerobatics here in the US especially.

They also fly F3A and 3D powered aerobatics but love to get out to the slopes of Brittany when they can. If I'm not mistaken, they have both (and I think Rémi still does) fly for the Breton F3A team along with Benoit Paysant Le Roux (legendary creator of the Madslide glider and an extremely talented F3A and 3D pilot himself).

Anyways, long story short, it's very exciting to see some new videos from Rémi and Eric!! Enjoy!!!

Steve
surfimp is offline Find More Posts by surfimp
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by surfimp; Sep 13, 2012 at 10:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Sep 13, 2012, 09:13 PM
If it can-it will!
cliffhanger's Avatar
Gower South Wales UK
Joined May 2007
2,075 Posts
Well with all due respect to two great pilots, I think the rest of the world have caught them up.
Especially on the West coast of USA, (and their compatriot "Le Frog!) where development of the technique has pushed the boundaries of VTPR forward.
cliffhanger is offline Find More Posts by cliffhanger
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 11:11 AM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,075 Posts
Fair enough, but for my part, the flying in Menez-Hom 2005 is a timeless statement, much like what BPLR presented with the Madslide back in 2000-2001. If anything, what we're doing over here is just bringing those two threads - Madflight and VTPR - into closer communion, and adding a bit of SoCal skate/surf flavor.

Honestly, and speaking only for myself and in no way criticizing the views of others which surely vary, the whole comparing / competing thing is really passé and totally misses the point. Was Miles Davis a better jazz musician than John Coltrane or Duke Ellington? The question is, for me, nonsensical... tastes vary but each will forever be recognized a master.

For me, this kind of flying is only about personal expression and finding one's personal joy on the day... I love to see good flying because it inspires me, not to try to outdo someone else, but to give me new ideas and motivation.

When I get to fly with Dawson, Justin, Peter, Michael and others and we just laugh and have a great time at the slope, there's no thought of competition, only joy... that's what this flying is for me, only.

Anyways, my $0.02!

Steve
surfimp is offline Find More Posts by surfimp
RCG Plus Member
Old Sep 14, 2012, 11:25 AM
Flagstaff, AZ
dawsonh's Avatar
USA, AZ, Flagstaff
Joined Mar 2003
3,808 Posts
Thanks for sharing some wonderful videos. Those guys are pure flyers. I loved that nice eight point roll in the first vid.

Maybe this time next year we will have shots of ourselves doing it just like Eric and Remi.

Dawson
dawsonh is online now Find More Posts by dawsonh
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 12:13 PM
Silent Flight
Twyl's Avatar
United States, CA, Cypress
Joined Jul 2005
3,951 Posts
I think the difference between the videos in the OP and Menez-Hom 2005 is purely wind and slope conditions not to mention the lack of jelly fish. Although the videographer and editing also have a huge part in it, I think it just goes to show that no matter what the skill of the pilot the wind and slope conditions are just as important as skill in making a memorable video experience.

I do agree with Cliff though that these videos are rather meh when strictly compared to the Menez-Hom 2005, but I also agree with Steve in that it's not really a competition so who cares. By all accounts they look like they are having a blast and that's all I look for when I go to the slope, not to win ribbons.

Steve, I do think you walk a fine line when you talk of comparing and competition as being passé. Especially after you just hosted a competition on precisely this same subject matter, slope videos... Not trying to rag on you or say I didn't enjoy watching all the video entries, but just saying, most of us don't get to have our cake and eat it too.

-Jonathan
Twyl is offline Find More Posts by Twyl
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 12:41 PM
-----
Woodstock 1's Avatar
Ireland, County Kerry, Kerry
Joined Dec 2005
6,888 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by surfimp View Post
... the whole comparing / competing thing is really passé and totally misses the point. ....

For me, this kind of flying is only about personal expression and finding one's personal joy on the day...

Steve
MAN, has surfing mellowed out the dude, or what ?

Chris
Woodstock 1 is offline Find More Posts by Woodstock 1
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 01:53 PM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,075 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twyl View Post
Steve, I do think you walk a fine line when you talk of comparing and competition as being passé. Especially after you just hosted a competition on precisely this same subject matter, slope videos... Not trying to rag on you or say I didn't enjoy watching all the video entries, but just saying, most of us don't get to have our cake and eat it too.
For me, it's different, in that it's a video contest first and foremost, not a flying contest... the art of producing a video that makes someone want to go out and fly right now, or creates a beautiful aesthetic experience, or is in whatever way truly inspirational is something that is not necessarily tied to the quality of flying in the film per se, and I'm never confused on that subject. Great flying can be filmed poorly and vice versa.... flying alone does not a good video make.

Beyond that, there's the issue of audience... remember, we have a public voting system here at RCGroups, and not everyone is an expert at aerobatics nor have any firsthand idea of the difficulty of the figures involved. There are plenty of folks who will oooh and aaah at, for example, a glider doing high speed passes. The flying skill required to perform those passes is quite basic (though landing that heavy plane is another story altogether!), whereas a presentation of highly technical flying - requiring absolute mastery of stick inputs and timing - might not "wow" a general viewer (i.e. non aerobatic specialist) as much, even though the technical challenge of the flying is much, much higher. That's because it's "just" a light glider flitting about in mediocre wind (for example)... you see what I'm saying here?

And that, to be honest, has always been the rub with the video contests. There are those out there who feel the current system of voting, as democratic as it is, fails because it does not properly judge the video against standard aerobatic criteria, using properly qualified judges.

For my part, I just want people to be aware of and inspired to participate in the joy of aerobatics flying with gliders on the slope. A video contest that allows anyone to enter, and anyone to vote, is the most open and inclusive format I can think of, and it encourages anyone and everyone to give it a shot.

I point to the growth in popularity of aerobatics flying that these contests have helped foster and get the impression that "it's working". Beyond that, the level and quantity of aerobatic flying has (by objective standards) improved year over year and we've seen some really great entries. It's something I'm proud of - because, year after year, the best videos always succeed in getting someone stoked to fly, to get out there and give it a shot.

At this still early stage in the renaissance of slope aerobatic flying, I think it's a net positive, and it's something that everyone can participate in. Otherwise we're faced with a situation in which people just put out videos in their home-language forum, and there's no international dialogue, and nobody knows what anybody else is doing. As far as I'm concerned, we already did that, and it's time for that to stop, so to the extent that these contests help bring people together worldwide, they are valuable.

But judging the flying? Well, there are objective means of doing so, for those so interested. For my part, I just want to be stoked on good flying, and I know that when I see it. We all do.

Steve
surfimp is offline Find More Posts by surfimp
RCG Plus Member
Old Sep 14, 2012, 02:11 PM
Silent Flight
Twyl's Avatar
United States, CA, Cypress
Joined Jul 2005
3,951 Posts
Point taken Steve, and I guess I like how you differentiate one from the other. To digress slightly in regards to the video comp, I was a bit disappointed (in a "damn it could have been so much better way") in the quality of some of the videos solely because of the videographer's hand/skill. There were a few entries that it was obvious the flying was superb, pilot skill level riveting, and pretty excellent editing, but the material (video file) they were working with was shaky, unfocused, or the plane too distant for good viewing.

What i tried to get across in my earlier post regarding the videos you posted was that the wow factor was not there as much as it was in the 2005 clip, but I attribute that to the conditions of the day and not that somehow the skill of the pilot had regressed (if that is even possible). I'd welcome more videos of our friends from France or from wherever any day of the week. Thanks for posting.

-Jonathan
Twyl is offline Find More Posts by Twyl
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 03:03 PM
FSD
Definite Flight Risk
FSD's Avatar
Joined Apr 2008
2,675 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twyl View Post
I think the difference between the videos in the OP and Menez-Hom 2005 is purely wind and slope conditions not to mention the lack of jelly fish. I think it just goes to show that no matter what the skill of the pilot the wind and slope conditions are just as important as skill in making a memorable video experience.

-Jonathan
Now, you've gone and done it! There are many here that don't share your opinion...I, for one, agree with you. I agree that topography and the consistency of the winds (lift) is critical for VTPR. I wish I could perform as well as those in the video, but alas, my slope does not lend itself to "pure" VTPR. Now, others (as I have stated before) may have the skills to fly Crestline and duplicate what we see above...but it ain't me.

-Paige
FSD is offline Find More Posts by FSD
RCG Plus Member
Old Sep 14, 2012, 03:44 PM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,075 Posts
I agree with both of you on that score.... lift and topography are important. I will say that, in my experience, the ultralight planes have vastly expanded the range of sites and conditions that permit fun aerobatic flying. In the past, I had no choice but to fly a Weasel or Alula once the wind was under 10mph at my normal spots, meaning I had much less opportunity to practice "unlimited" (full 3 or 4 axis) aerobatics, but now I'm pretty much able to go crazy in about 6-7mph at Ellwood (the most typical of typical conditions there) and have been able to deal with on/off slermally stuff quite nicely at the Ruins, Greens Peak and Del Cerro.

But that said... if you want to fly just like they do at Ménez-Hom... better go to Ménez-Hom!!

Steve

P.S. - And re: the latest videos of Rémi and Eric vs MH2005... Rémi told me that MH2005 was filmed in pretty epic conditions (for that site), which you can tell because there are few/no paragliders (too strong for them). I think these newer videos are more representative of the "average day" sort of flying they have on offer there: lighter lift, a lot more distractions from paragliders and spectators... harder to focus, less mental space to "stretch out", more stress. If that's true, it would also at least partially explain the preference for larger gliders (more efficiency, make the most of what's on offer). But that said, I suspect an ultralight plane would perform quite nicely in those conditions... hopefully someday I can find out personally
surfimp is offline Find More Posts by surfimp
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by surfimp; Sep 14, 2012 at 03:50 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 04:50 PM
Silent Flight
Twyl's Avatar
United States, CA, Cypress
Joined Jul 2005
3,951 Posts
It really is impossible to separate the two. A skilled pilot can only perform to the max that the environment allows for. He will be able to extend the grandiose of his/her routine only by the conditions improving. This of course assumes the tool is the same for both situations.

Ultralight west coast VTPR machines are a totally different tool.

Personally I like the higher energy retention of the models used in the MH videos, but if your slope can not support your tool, then you are forced to adapt.

-Jonathan
Twyl is offline Find More Posts by Twyl
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14, 2012, 04:53 PM
Registered User
Snewk's Avatar
United States, FL, Indialantic
Joined Dec 2011
858 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodstock 1 View Post
MAN, has surfing mellowed out the dude, or what ?

Chris


Like flying, you get mellow if your mind is right! IMO Steve's mind has never been far from perfect tuning. Really like what he's said on this thread. My own take on the video contest was pretty much in line with Steve's goals, as was my response. "I Wanna' Fly!!"

Gotta' agree with Paige that the site and conditions dictate what you can fly and how it can be flown. Having a great site like in the above videos is an incredible asset but not an absolute necessity for the development of expertise. An exemplar of this point is Kelly Slater in the surfing world. Sometimes honing one's skills in lousy situations makes the great condition days easier to excell in.
\
Ken
Snewk is offline Find More Posts by Snewk
Reply With Quote
Old Sep 16, 2012, 01:50 AM
Air is huge!
pgts's Avatar
France, Midi-Pyrénées, Toulouse
Joined Oct 2011
145 Posts
Hi everybody, nice vids and discussion here ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by surfimp View Post
the art of producing a video that makes someone want to go out and fly right now, or creates a beautiful aesthetic experience, or is in whatever way truly inspirational is something that is not necessarily tied to the quality of flying in the film per se [...].... flying alone does not a good video make.
+10!
A good video is a lot of time with the computer... trying to balance vantage points, to synchronize music and moves, to keep only the most "oooh and aaah" parts which sometimes are not more than 2 seconds...
Depending of the level of flying of people watching the video, the ooh and aah moments will not be the same...
A good video make you want to go to slope!

In 2010, François Cahour posted this : Glider aerobatics competition, a formula to re-invent
In my point of view, the video contest is the new-school way of aerobatic glider competition, even if it does not nominate the "best pilot", it makes all of us want to progress! And that is the good part of competition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by surfimp View Post
There are those out there who feel the current system of voting, as democratic as it is, fails
Even if I proposed a little change, this is not me .
I just point that there were videos with same number of votes after first vote and a big difference between these two very same videos after run-off (7/7 and then 28/9). Maybe that means if we could vote for more than one video we would have something more representatvie of democratic judging of all vids

Quote:
Originally Posted by surfimp View Post
For my part, I just want people to be aware of and inspired to participate in the joy of aerobatics flying with gliders on the slope. [...] it encourages anyone and everyone to give it a shot.
[...]Otherwise we're faced with a situation in which people just put out videos in their home-language forum, and there's no international dialogue, and nobody knows what anybody else is doing.
+10!
That is cool with the web! I know a man who performed J-Flip just one day after your video Steve !

Once again, thanks Steve!
pgts is offline Find More Posts by pgts
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 24, 2013, 01:48 PM
Registered User
mustang_jmz's Avatar
Joined Feb 2005
81 Posts
I shot an excalibur

but the conditions were too weak ofr its pilot taste (who'is getting boring quickly when it comes to perform some aeroabtics while the wind decide to calm down)

Excalibur - Aerobatic glider (VTPR) (0 min 54 sec)
mustang_jmz is offline Find More Posts by mustang_jmz
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 31, 2013, 04:48 PM
Feeling FrSky
surfimp's Avatar
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Feb 2003
20,075 Posts
Just came across this recently - I think some of the clips may have been featured previously, above, but some of it definitely looks new. And it's all set to a sweet soundtrack - really nice!

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xtz...-bretagne_tech

STOKED

Steve
surfimp is offline Find More Posts by surfimp
RCG Plus Member
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Poll SlopeAerobatics Video Contest Voting Thread: Best VTPR Aerobatics surfimp Slope 5 Sep 06, 2012 03:58 PM
Discussion Eric Clutton gets his bird back! RyanNX211 Other Websites 0 Apr 29, 2012 07:48 PM
Discussion New Video: How to fly VTPR Aerobatics (VTPR Clinic from WeaselFest) surfimp Slope 12 Apr 18, 2012 12:53 PM
Cool New Video: California Medley (VTPR / academic / hover aerobatics) surfimp Slope 29 Apr 02, 2012 09:31 PM
Discussion New Whale & Aerobatic/VTPR Thoughts Big Gas Slope 23 Mar 12, 2012 10:46 PM