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Old Feb 06, 2013, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by MrRCFlying View Post
Anyone know how to upload .wav here?
.zip
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 07:47 PM
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I went with Soundcloud to store the files, as my web page software will allow me to emebed from there. I am working on a sound sample page.

Anyway, here they are in the native resolution. They are 16 bit PCM, 22050Hz. I decided on the lower resolution for memory space reasons. Myself, I can't hear the difference between 22 and 44. On the speakers in the plane, I am sure no one will notice the loss.

Each demo file is actually 3 files. I have worked hard to blend them so they transition smoothly from start up, idle, and shutdown. This eliminates any jarring audio effects from the transition from one to another. The V4 sound card will be using these files, and should blend as seamlessly as you hear here.

The startup on most of them are about 7 seconds or so. The Double Wasp is almost 20 seconds. Reason being, it just sounds so good to hear the full start of a large radial engine like that.

I will try to get some more from the WWII pack up tomorrow.

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/continental-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/lycoming-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/merlin-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/daimler-benz-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user87535029...uble-wasp-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user87535029...c-turbine-demo

Andrew
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 08:38 PM
WAA-08 THANK FRANK!
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Impressive!
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 03:07 AM
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Sweden, Gävleborg County, Gävle
Joined Aug 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRCFlying View Post
I went with Soundcloud to store the files, as my web page software will allow me to emebed from there. I am working on a sound sample page.

Anyway, here they are in the native resolution. They are 16 bit PCM, 22050Hz. I decided on the lower resolution for memory space reasons. Myself, I can't hear the difference between 22 and 44. On the speakers in the plane, I am sure no one will notice the loss.

Each demo file is actually 3 files. I have worked hard to blend them so they transition smoothly from start up, idle, and shutdown. This eliminates any jarring audio effects from the transition from one to another. The V4 sound card will be using these files, and should blend as seamlessly as you hear here.

The startup on most of them are about 7 seconds or so. The Double Wasp is almost 20 seconds. Reason being, it just sounds so good to hear the full start of a large radial engine like that.

I will try to get some more from the WWII pack up tomorrow.

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/continental-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/lycoming-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/merlin-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user875350290/daimler-benz-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user87535029...uble-wasp-demo

https://soundcloud.com/#user87535029...c-turbine-demo

Andrew
Impressive Andrew!

These sounds are much crisper and has more presence than on V2 and V3, also all the startup and shutdowns are more tru to the real thing.

Propably the enginesouds, maybe with the jet as an exeption, has below 11kHz of max frequency. That could explain why you don´t hear any difference between 22 and 44kHz samplingrates.

"Sampling theorem
The Nyquist–Shannon sampling theorem states that perfect reconstruction of a signal is possible when the sampling frequency is greater than twice the maximum frequency of the signal being sampled, or equivalently, when the Nyquist frequency (half the sample rate) exceeds the highest frequency of the signal being sampled. If lower sampling rates are used, the original signal's information may not be completely recoverable from the sampled signal.[2] For example, if a signal has an upper band limit of 100 Hz, a sampling frequency greater than 200 Hz will avoid aliasing and would theoretically allow perfect reconstruction.

The full range of human hearing is between 20 Hz and 20 kHz.[3] The minimum sampling rate that satisfies the sampling theorem for this full bandwidth is 40 kHz. The 44.1 kHz sampling rate used for Compact Disc was chosen for this and other technical reasons."

Cheers Lasse
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Last edited by lassehellsten; Feb 07, 2013 at 03:16 AM.
Old Feb 07, 2013, 06:14 AM
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As to the 20s startup from the double wasp, it is lovely, but I'd rather do without the startup sound altogether (due to the fact that electric motors cannot simulate startup).

You should think about changing from firmware to software (ref benedini), so one is able to configurate to one's liking. Also, software updates are easier than firmware. And you could change to providing one big sound library, rather than a set of xx sounds.

Just a suggestion.

Regards Dave
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by struggleforlife View Post
As to the 20s startup from the double wasp, it is lovely, but I'd rather do without the startup sound altogether (due to the fact that electric motors cannot simulate startup).

You should think about changing from firmware to software (ref benedini), so one is able to configurate to one's liking. Also, software updates are easier than firmware. And you could change to providing one big sound library, rather than a set of xx sounds.

Just a suggestion.

Regards Dave
Due to the proceesor and memory being used, software and updates will not be an option on this version. Something to think about for the future.

Andrew
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 09:00 AM
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[QUOTE=Sculptor;24052334]
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Originally Posted by jbarchuk View Post
+1 DJ
When I got my budget B model I was pleasantly surprised at how much better it sounded and louder than the representations in the videos.
Looking forward to this new one.

Quote:
Also when the sound is disassociated from an airplane even if well recorded is disquieting to me.
Sure but the whole point is to give accurate representation of what the user is buying. It's like the difference between seeing a band live vs any kind of recording. Doing a sound system install is going to give a completely different mental/emotional effect in the shop vs in the air but it still has to be tested and even played with a bunch for the -anticipation- effect of how it's going to sound in the air.

Quote:
Puts me in mind of what my dad said at an air show when I was a boy. We were looking at a plane with a radial engine and it was about to startup and dad said "son when that planes starts up it's gonna sound like it's about the blowup before it really gets going".
Same is true of auto racing. It's oxymoronic that low frequencies are easier in electronics and software to convert analog -> digital than higher frequencies (and vice versa,) yet more difficult to reproduce -mechanically-. Partly it's that at the speaker end of things it's very difficult for a small diameter device to resonate 'slowly.' But equally importantly is that as in the full scale motor engines situation is that the -body- feels the -physical- effects of the resonating air. It's not even necessarily a consciously recognised effect but more subliminal. For example you unexpectedly hear a bang or a boom sound, and by hearing -and- feeling it the body instantly intuitively calculates how big/far away it is and whether it should jump into a fight-flight mode, or that it's OK to relax.

This sound reproduction-*projection* issue is about the only area I'm going to fool with much. It's the 'tupperware effect.' I have a Sig Senior that I'm probably going to build solid plywood chambers into the wing. Maybe CF plate to save a little weight. In this case I don't care what it weighs because it's not built for speed and already has a ton of extra power.

Another possibility is that I just picked up a Radio Shack Auvio bluetooth speaker (for use for music at the field actually.) It's still on sale now till the 16th for $50. It's 12oz, but that include 6hr of lipo power, and all that extra case weight. I'm going to open it up and see if it can be stripped down to half that, and use just the speaker and waveguide-box portion of it. Playing music at the field I turned it up, walked 50 away to the runway, pointed it back toward the pits, and walked back. It was *totally* hearable and *very* loud for the distance.
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 11:47 AM
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[QUOTE=jbarchuk;24060566]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sculptor View Post

Looking forward to this new one.



Sure but the whole point is to give accurate representation of what the user is buying. It's like the difference between seeing a band live vs any kind of recording. Doing a sound system install is going to give a completely different mental/emotional effect in the shop vs in the air but it still has to be tested and even played with a bunch for the -anticipation- effect of how it's going to sound in the air.



Same is true of auto racing. It's oxymoronic that low frequencies are easier in electronics and software to convert analog -> digital than higher frequencies (and vice versa,) yet more difficult to reproduce -mechanically-. Partly it's that at the speaker end of things it's very difficult for a small diameter device to resonate 'slowly.' But equally importantly is that as in the full scale motor engines situation is that the -body- feels the -physical- effects of the resonating air. It's not even necessarily a consciously recognised effect but more subliminal. For example you unexpectedly hear a bang or a boom sound, and by hearing -and- feeling it the body instantly intuitively calculates how big/far away it is and whether it should jump into a fight-flight mode, or that it's OK to relax.

This sound reproduction-*projection* issue is about the only area I'm going to fool with much. It's the 'tupperware effect.' I have a Sig Senior that I'm probably going to build solid plywood chambers into the wing. Maybe CF plate to save a little weight. In this case I don't care what it weighs because it's not built for speed and already has a ton of extra power.

Another possibility is that I just picked up a Radio Shack Auvio bluetooth speaker (for use for music at the field actually.) It's still on sale now till the 16th for $50. It's 12oz, but that include 6hr of lipo power, and all that extra case weight. I'm going to open it up and see if it can be stripped down to half that, and use just the speaker and waveguide-box portion of it. Playing music at the field I turned it up, walked 50 away to the runway, pointed it back toward the pits, and walked back. It was *totally* hearable and *very* loud for the distance.
When you get that bad boy done show us some pictures of it. Thanks for your exploration of these sound concepts, it's very interesting.

DJ
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 12:15 PM
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I have seen some guys use the plywood speaker box concept in wings, motor boxes , etc , with great results. The key is to make the box solid inside , like coating it with epoxy to make it hard, then stuff it with acoustic fiberfill. For more sound and bass, porting it out through any ABS or light weight carbon tube will add a lot. The more bends and turns in that tube, the better.
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by corsairnut View Post
I have seen some guys use the plywood speaker box concept in wings, motor boxes , etc , with great results. The key is to make the box solid inside , like coating it with epoxy to make it hard, then stuff it with acoustic fiberfill. For more sound and bass, porting it out through any ABS or light weight carbon tube will add a lot. The more bends and turns in that tube, the better.
Thanks for the info. I will have to do some experimentation.
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 07:32 AM
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so.... gettting close to 15th Andrew! How are things getting along?
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 08:33 AM
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Originally Posted by MrRCFlying View Post
Due to the proceesor and memory being used, software and updates will not be an option on this version. Something to think about for the future.

Andrew
Speaking of future enhancements... I'd like to brainstorm on a way to simulate engine start up - but not just the sound; I'd like to see the prop turning slowly for those first few seconds while the starter is working and then pick up speed when the engine ignites to life. First, I'm not an engineer so yeah some of these ideas will be naive.

Seems to me electric motors go from 0 to 100 as soon as even the lowest current is applied (lowest throttle setting). Is that a function of the ESC? If a lower, trickle current were applied,would the motor turn slowly? If so, we just need to get you into the ESC business . Think about it - either build ESC or insert your sound unit and a regulator between receiver and the ESC.

If electric motors just go for 0 to 100 no matter how low the current - then the solution would be more complex and mechanical. I begin to see gears and dedicated servos turning the prop - i.e., a dedicated starter just like in real cars and planes, etc. That gets hairy. Anyway, in the spirit of brainstorming and thinking outside the box, those are some to chew on.
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 08:52 AM
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Starting sound;
At a recent warbird event, I found that upon starting my SE-5, the prop speed didnt get peoples attention but the engine start sound sure took them by surprise. They liked it, I like it, I think you should keep it. The experience wont be any better if it goes from silence to idle or someting, the starting sound sounds great to me. I hope to have my SE-5 at Top Gun this year, would be interesting to see and hear peoples reactions to the audio from start-up to shut down. I am betting it will be impressive to many.
Denny
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tenacious101010 View Post
Starting sound;
At a recent warbird event, I found that upon starting my SE-5, the prop speed didnt get peoples attention but the engine start sound sure took them by surprise. They liked it, I like it, I think you should keep it. The experience wont be any better if it goes from silence to idle or someting, the starting sound sounds great to me. I hope to have my SE-5 at Top Gun this year, would be interesting to see and hear peoples reactions to the audio from start-up to shut down. I am betting it will be impressive to many.
Denny
I agree with Denny... the start-up and shutdown sounds are great and well liked by me and my club members too.
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by struggleforlife View Post
so.... gettting close to 15th Andrew! How are things getting along?
Close, very close. I am pushing it to get my testing done by the 15th, but I fully anticipate the first of the units to go out between the 16th and the 22nd. The larger production run is backed up by a couple of weeks, so the first batches are going to be small, but should be enough to cover pre-orders within 2 weeks. By then I should have a bunch in stock.

I have seen a couple of tech demos at this point, mostly showing how it works, so I will know the system from the inside. The hardware was shipped on Thurs. but has not gotten to me yet, I expect it will be here today. My understanding is the firmware is nearly 100% at this point. Once I get it in hand I will be doing hours of testing, and making minor adjustments to the code. Even if I have to stay up all night for the next week, I will make sure it meets my expectations and standards, so when the first boards go out the door, they are the best I can make them.

Andrew
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