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Old Sep 05, 2012, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by ny_hawk View Post
I don't recall my trainer doing that.. Although it was long ago..

That is not something that would be remembered, but when you start flying basic trainers again to instruct others things like that really show up. Adverse yaw is another thing that is pronounced in a positively stable aircraft.

So if they are the same then why bother with a 3 channel?

Those things have already been discussed many times.
...
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 04:52 PM
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New Rochelle, NY
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Originally Posted by Gerry__ View Post
Because a 3ch plane will be more docile and much less likely, in the hands of an unaccompanied beginner, to end up in a very bad attitude close to the ground.
Look, either as stated by RR they are the same or not.. IF they are the same, in effect roll the same, correct the same, but then now somehow again they are different? C'mon..already.. Totally exactly the same except very different...got it..check please.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 04:59 PM
Bye Bye VP Aug 2010 - Aug 2012
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United Kingdom, London
Joined Jan 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ny_hawk View Post
Look, either as stated by RR they are the same or not.. IF they are the same, in effect roll the same, correct the same, but then now somehow again they are different? C'mon..already..
RR doesn't speak for me. Have you ever flown a plane like the multiplex easystar? If you have a simulator, try the easystar and then compare it to the twinstar 2 by the same company. Also, try the Radian v the Radian Pro.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 05:03 PM
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United States, AZ, Mesa
Joined Jul 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ny_hawk View Post
Time for a diversion.

Here's a nice "high wing" plane...
I'll jump on that bandwagon... here's a plane with excellent yaw control

F-22 Raptor Airshow practice (2012-8-24) (11 min 52 sec)


F-22 Raptor at Colorado Sport Aviation Airshow 2012 (9 min 48 sec)


I don't know, I think the practice run was better...
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 06:14 PM
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Bingo Gerry_, I hope he gets it now.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 09:19 PM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ny_hawk View Post
I don't recall my trainer doing that.. Although it was long ago..

So if they are the same then why bother with a 3 channel?
It's like I said earlier. It seems like the hobby companies are terrified of advertising a four channel plane with dihedral because the Greek chorus of "aileron planes with dihedral fly like crap" will follow the plane into the grave. You see those unpaid members of the harpie chorus in lots of threads here and elsewhere, and it would be all good, but they're dead wrong. Most full size aileron planes have some dihedral and they fly well.

There is absolutely no reason not to produce and advertise a self-stabilizing 4-channel plane and even say it can be flown as a 3 or 4-channel. And as a three channel it could be flown aileron/elevator or rudder/elevator! If they really wanted to be adventurous they could provide a much flatter aileron wing for sport use after you learn to fly and........no, it's all about the cash. Why sell one plane when you can sell two. The good of the flier be damned!

That's one thing that is really cool about a Slow Stick. It's basically a boilerplate test bed. You can strap just about any kind of wing you want to it: sailplane, undercambered 3-channel, Clark Y 3-channel, no dihedral full symmetrical aileron stunt wing, you name it!

But a purpose-built, ideally EPP 4-channel trainer with dihedral, marketed as a first flier and able to back it up would take us to the next step in learner planes. I'd love to see it because there is no 4-channel plane today marketed for learning to fly for the unassisted newbie.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 09:50 PM
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RR, Hobbytown has such a plane. It is called the Ares Gamma 370. It has a lot of dihedral as a 3 channel trainer with a brushed motor. There is available, an aileron equipped wing with a flatter profile and a bolt on brushless upgrade for it. I have one, but have not upgraded it yet as I use it to introduce newbie friends and family to RC flight. The only downside to this plane as it comes out of the box is the use of Tamiya type connectors on the ESC and battery. At $80.00 bucks RX-R and $130.00 RTF, it is a great deal. Hobbytown carries all the parts too.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 10:45 PM
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That plane looks decent but there is no dihedral on the aileron wing. If the wings had the same dihedral the "struggle" to transition from 3ch to 4ch wouldn't exist, because you could fly it either way.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 02:23 AM
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United States, VA, Richmond
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Originally Posted by black6088 View Post
At the risk of bringing the rath of the "experts" down on this poor noobs head, I just can't resist a comment. It's pretty simple when you think about it. Not all of us have been doing this for years---- more like months or weeks--- so of course we're going to ask questions that have been asked before. How could one expect otherwise on a "Beginners" forum (hey, what are you experts doing hanging around here anyway....). But as to whacky answers, this conversation is a great example of that. Someone deriding a noob's question as some sort of ploy to gain attention--- and this from someone with over TWENTY THOUSAND posts in 5 years. That's about a DOZEN PER DAY, folks! Who is it that can't get enough attention.........?

Tom
I've noticed this a lot since joining rcgroups and quote frankly it deters me from asking questions in fear of ridicule. Not everyone wants to look through every single past thread to find an answer. If people were more helpful instead of condescending and hijacking threads it would make this whole thing more enjoyable. Unfortunately a newbie asks a question and it gets quickly derailed by showing who has the bigger d*ck
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 03:57 AM
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Do you have a question that you would like answered?
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 06:40 AM
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Australia, WA, Perth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins View Post

There is absolutely no reason not to produce and advertise a self-stabilizing 4-channel plane and even say it can be flown as a 3 or 4-channel. And as a three channel it could be flown aileron/elevator or rudder/elevator!
So how close does the Bixler come to that? It's a 4 ch that flies fine on 3.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Babadush View Post
I've noticed this a lot since joining rcgroups and quote frankly it deters me from asking questions in fear of ridicule. Not everyone wants to look through every single past thread to find an answer. If people were more helpful instead of condescending and hijacking threads it would make this whole thing more enjoyable. Unfortunately a newbie asks a question and it gets quickly derailed by showing who has the bigger d*ck
Nonsense. It's not hard to google your question before asking it (hint: add "site:rcgroups.com" to the end of your search terms). Not doing so and expecting people to yet again answer a question that has been comprehensively answered before is unreasonable. This forum has answered many of my questions without me having to ask or anyone else go out of their way to provide an answer.

Expert on this (or any other) forum are not here just for your or my benefit. They are here first and foremost for their own benefit. They help out newbies like you and me out of their own generosity and for the good of the hobby they love.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 07:14 AM
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Joined Mar 2008
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Understood, but why dont the "experts" stay off our "stupid" "newbie" threads then? If they dont like the question, or dont like the way it was asked. Why not just leave it alone? Why post just to deride? Personaly, after many, many years in this hobby, cars/trucks untill a year ago, I pretty much steer clear of ANYone else in the hobby. Tried my hand at racing off road, hated it, hated the "high and mighty" oldtimers. I'm 50+ myself, so I'm not talking about age. But attitude. This hobby has turned me into a loner, LOL To many Knowitalls.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 08:01 AM
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Australia, WA, Perth
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Nature of the net. Takes all sorts. Silently weed out any 'attitude' you don't like, but hoard the knowledge gems. You can't change others; only your response to them. Personally I'd rather suffer an abrasive expert than no expert.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 09:24 AM
So broke I can't pay attention
Naples FL USA
Joined Mar 2009
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I'm no expert on RC planes, got my first plane a few months ago, land and water RC's have been my hobby for years. When the idea of getting into aircraft became a goal of mine, it took a while for me to research where to start, and a 3ch high wing trainer seemed to be the right choice.
No doubt there are people who have the talent and skill to start with a more advanced model and are able to do very well right off the bat, but for me and others who need a not so steep learning curve, very basic no frills trainers are very much required. I am extremely happy with my choice, and enjoy the relaxed low and slow flying experience, Just my two cents worth.
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