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Old Aug 30, 2012, 10:46 AM
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Norway, Hedmark, Brumunddal
Joined Aug 2012
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VULCAN Multiframe SkyHook Octo 1200mm

Hi!

I'm all new here, and also newbie to multirotors.

I've been flying alot of other RC things, and since I'm also in to photography I was wondering if I should combine my to hobbies.

I was set on the DJI 550 with all the gps and so on, but the I found this one:
"VULCAN Multiframe SkyHook Octo 1200m" from UAVshop.co.uk (http://www.uavshop.co.uk/catalog/pro...roducts_id=248)


I use SLR for my photography, and would like to have a system that when I'm good enough to fly it, could carry the gear.

It also looks pretty vibration free..
Vulcan MultiFrame Vibration Test (2 min 39 sec)


The dji 550 I was thinking could be a good learning platform, and use my gopro hero hd2, but then I have to get a bigger one later...

So what do you think? Could the Vulcan be a good chose? Could I still use dji electronics and gps, or not?

As you understand, I'm a total newbie on this, but I'm above average good builder, so I'm pretty sure I can make this with some help choosing the right components!

I have been searching a lot, but can't seem to find any info on the forum about the Vulcan..

So please come with your inputs,and help me decide what to do, and if you have more time then that, all help om witch motors, electronics and props I should use would be great!

Best regards
Tormod
Norway

PS. Sorry for any misspelling, English is NOT my first language
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Old Aug 30, 2012, 12:03 PM
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Norway, Hedmark, Brumunddal
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And one more thing, in my head big = heavy = better in windy conditions.. or not??
I live along the Norwegian west coast, and here it's a lot of wind..
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Old Aug 30, 2012, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
And one more thing, in my head big = heavy = better in windy conditions.. or not??
I live along the Norwegian west coast, and here it's a lot of wind..
More weight does definitely bring more wind stability. But there are other factors, and if you need a very wind-stable machine, you need to consider them.

Total disk area, and relationship between total disk area and frame size are big factors.

Coaxial designs (Y6 and X8) are more wind stable than having the motors in one plane, because effective disk area is reduced while thrust only drops slightly. But they are also less efficient.
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Old Aug 30, 2012, 05:45 PM
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Norway, Hedmark, Brumunddal
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Thanks for the input TS00, is good to get some info and advice from people that know what they are talking about

What do you think about the frame linked in my first post?
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Old Aug 30, 2012, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
Thanks for the input TS00, is good to get some info and advice from people that know what they are talking about

What do you think about the frame linked in my first post?
Well, I think if this is your first multicopter, you should start with a 400-500mm quad. You will cry a lot less when you crash that, than when you crash an octo

The vulcan frame looks nice. I think if you're into building stuff, you can build your own out of aluminium tube and GRP sheet for a quarter the price, but only if you like building. Something like this:



What flying experience do you have?
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Old Aug 31, 2012, 01:40 AM
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That's true, and believe me I KNOW there will be a lot of crashes!
I have mostly been flying fixed wings, both with and without motors.

I also have been flying a nitro helicopter, but with that thing i defiantly used 10x as much time fixing after crashes then flying :S

I have no problem making a frame like that, I have the mechanical skills, the tools and a place to build it, I've just read so many placed that most people prefer buying the frame finished..
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Old Aug 31, 2012, 05:06 AM
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Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
That's true, and believe me I KNOW there will be a lot of crashes!
I have mostly been flying fixed wings, both with and without motors.

I also have been flying a nitro helicopter, but with that thing i defiantly used 10x as much time fixing after crashes then flying :S

I have no problem making a frame like that, I have the mechanical skills, the tools and a place to build it, I've just read so many placed that most people prefer buying the frame finished..
If you like building, why don't you start off building your self a nice 450mm quad? Material cost will be minimal, so you can spend your money on good motors, ESCs and FC. It only takes a couple of hours to build a frame.

Once you've crashed it as much as you want to, you can then use the same techniques for building a large octo frame.
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Old Aug 31, 2012, 05:30 AM
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Norway, Hedmark, Brumunddal
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Originally Posted by TS00 View Post
If you like building, why don't you start off building your self a nice 450mm quad? Material cost will be minimal, so you can spend your money on good motors, ESCs and FC. It only takes a couple of hours to build a frame.

Once you've crashed it as much as you want to, you can then use the same techniques for building a large octo frame.
It's been a long time ago since I've learned that I should listen to advise given by people that actually know something ;-) - so back to the drawing board and learn how to build this things from the scratch.. I feel that I don't know enough about the electronics and all this, so I'll think I have to start there, the frame it self I have read a lot about so I think that it should go ok.

Do you advise me to buy a complete naza setup for my first rig?

And one more thing, is the quad easier to fly then a octo since a advice me to go that route? Or is it just cost to repair that is on your mind?
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Old Aug 31, 2012, 05:44 AM
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Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
It's been a long time ago since I've learned that I should listen to advise given by people that actually know something ;-) - so back to the drawing board and learn how to build this things from the scratch.. I feel that I don't know enough about the electronics and all this, so I'll think I have to start there, the frame it self I have read a lot about so I think that it should go ok.
There are lots of people here to help you get started from scratch. Sometimes it takes a while, but we always get people flying in the end



Quote:
Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
Do you advise me to buy a complete naza setup for my first rig?
I don't have any experience of Naza. Those who fly it like it.

I have flown mainly KK and MultiWii. I find MultiWii does exactly what I want, and has a great community for support.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
And one more thing, is the quad easier to fly then a octo since a advice me to go that route? Or is it just cost to repair that is on your mind?
The more props you have, the more stable, slow and sluggish the machine.

I don't have an octo, but I have tricopters, quadcopters (many), and a couple of hexas. The hexas are much more stable. But they are also a lot less fun to fly, and they are less stable in windy conditions.
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Old Aug 31, 2012, 06:11 AM
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Thank you, your amazing helping me like this!

My dream is something that is ok easy to fly, stability is great and that could manage wind.
My main object is ap so I don't mind if it's slow and don't manage acro ;-)

For now it"s ok not lifting more then gopro / point and shoot camera. But if I could have more lift in the first build in would go for batteries for longer flight time..
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Old Aug 31, 2012, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
Thank you, your amazing helping me like this!

My dream is something that is ok easy to fly, stability is great and that could manage wind.
My main object is ap so I don't mind if it's slow and don't manage acro ;-)
I think given that you are new to multis, starting off with a mig-sized quad makes good sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
For now it"s ok not lifting more then gopro / point and shoot camera. But if I could have more lift in the first build in would go for batteries for longer flight time..
Ah, but more batteries does not always equal more flight time

You can refine your AP skills on a quad, a 1kg 450mm quad will easily carry a gopro.
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Old Sep 11, 2012, 04:07 PM
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South Africa, GP, Johannesburg
Joined Sep 2010
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Originally Posted by tormodnt View Post
Hi!

I'm all new here, and also newbie to multirotors.

I've been flying alot of other RC things, and since I'm also in to photography I was wondering if I should combine my to hobbies.

I was set on the DJI 550 with all the gps and so on, but the I found this one:
"VULCAN Multiframe SkyHook Octo 1200m" from UAVshop.co.uk (http://www.uavshop.co.uk/catalog/pro...roducts_id=248)


I use SLR for my photography, and would like to have a system that when I'm good enough to fly it, could carry the gear.

It also looks pretty vibration free..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqfweIsm_n0

The dji 550 I was thinking could be a good learning platform, and use my gopro hero hd2, but then I have to get a bigger one later...

So what do you think? Could the Vulcan be a good chose? Could I still use dji electronics and gps, or not?

As you understand, I'm a total newbie on this, but I'm above average good builder, so I'm pretty sure I can make this with some help choosing the right components!

I have been searching a lot, but can't seem to find any info on the forum about the Vulcan..

So please come with your inputs,and help me decide what to do, and if you have more time then that, all help om witch motors, electronics and props I should use would be great!

Best regards
Tormod
Norway

PS. Sorry for any misspelling, English is NOT my first language
Hi Tormod

The concept behind the MultiFrame Series is one of strength, simplicity and flexibility of design. So you can start with a quad and as your requirements change and using the same components and adding a few arms and/or Motor mounts, get a Hexa, Y6, X8 or an Octo.

The materials used minimise vibration and the weights compared to other Heavy Lift frames are very similar.

Have a look here at the various design advantages http://www.vulcanuav.com/vulcan-multiframe.html

I started my multirotor flying on a quad 650 when I realised that it would not carry the equipment I then decided to move to a Hexa 650 trying to use as many components as possible, and what a problem it was. I tried to use the same plates. Impossible, so I had to get plates made, and they flexed, because I used the wrong material. Just remember, most of the cheap frames coming out have major flexing problems

The Vulcan centre plates have holes pre-drilled and are ready for whatever configuration you may need later. So you will have the base for a much larger system when you need it.

But I agree, don't start with a Hexa or anything larger. Start with a quad.

Buy the centre plates and buy 2# 500mm arm, cut them in 2 sections and you have a 650 quad. You won't get a better frame for the cost. Get yourself some decent motors too. Ones that don't vibrate after a few flights. You will find if you buy rubbish your flying experience will be diminished. I suggest something like the RC Tiger MT2216-10.

Learn to use eCalc. It is a good bit of online software that will teach you a lot about the multirotor system and how each bit of equipment impacts on the other.

Rob
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Old Sep 14, 2012, 05:34 AM
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No harm is building your own from scratch to start with, you learn a lot that way, but it's important to understand that not all frames are the same even if they look similar.

The Vulcan uses ali arms, but you won't buy any ali section like that in your hardware store!

They are custom moulded from highest grade alloy with very thin wall thickness (just under 1mm) with dimension ratios aimed at maximising stiffness and vibration reduction. They also use 2mm carbon fibre centre plates without large cutouts keeping the centre section incredibly rigid......and as a result they really are low iin vibration!!

Here's a video from a customer in Sweden. He has a 900 Hexa and has simply bolted his GoPro to the bottom frame plate, no vibration damping at all, all he's done is balance the props as you should anyway:

Vulcan Multiframe 900 (5 min 0 sec)


The other great thing about the Vulcan, apart from it's modular design, is the amount of space inside the frame centre plates. Lots of space for everything and there is enough height to mount your ESCs on their sides on the side of the arm giving excellent cooling, and allowing you to fold the frame without trashing the wiring inside.

For anyone thinking of flying a Vulcan with a Naza, my 1200 Hexa flies like a dream with the Naza, but you need to ramp up the pitch and roll gains to 290%. Everything else at default....

Check this out:

Vulcan MultiFrame 1200mm Hexa - Flying Weather at Last! (6 min 16 sec)


Alex
UAVshop.co.uk
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Old Sep 14, 2012, 05:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TS00 View Post
More weight does definitely bring more wind stability. But there are other factors, and if you need a very wind-stable machine, you need to consider them.

Total disk area, and relationship between total disk area and frame size are big factors.

Coaxial designs (Y6 and X8) are more wind stable than having the motors in one plane, because effective disk area is reduced while thrust only drops slightly. But they are also less efficient.
Hi TS00,

Your right of course, the downside to a Y6 or X8 is the extra load on the lower motors having to work in the dirty air of the props above, and you can feel the temp difference in the lower motors after a flight (or monitor the extra current use as you fly if you have that facility).

One thing you can do with a Hexa or Octo is turn upside down alternate motors, which gives you some of the dual plane benefit without the inefficiency.

I should also a say that large machines do not mean sluggish machines, see the second video in my previous post of the 1200 Hexa.....not the greatest flight video I know, (no stunt flying!) but hardly sluggish!! You can really throw that machine around...

I have also just built a 1200 Y6 Vulcan, with WKM, AV130 etc.....now that is what you'd call sluggish. Solid as a rock, even in wind, and as slow gentle flying is the key to AP, it's perfect for that. Ideal for pro work, but not what you'd call a fun fly though....

Best!
Alex
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Old Oct 06, 2012, 07:21 AM
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Chalfont St Giles, Bucks, UK
Joined Jan 2007
3,198 Posts
Hi tormodnt.
I have just placed an order for the 1200. I will post what I think when it arrives. Unless you have one already.
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