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Old Oct 17, 2012, 12:33 PM
2 seconds from crashing
indoorheli's Avatar
United States, WA, Seattle
Joined Sep 2007
7,349 Posts
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Originally Posted by heritageflyer View Post
Sold my mCPX, want this Lil guy next!

Will also want a solid CF boom and do a BL Conversion when they are available Plug N Play, based on the early demo vids I have seen in this thread already. Sounds like Dylan is on it....
Dylan will not have a plug and play...at least not for a long while out. You will still have to solder the motor to the esc, solder the signal to the rx and esc and solder the power to the esc then to the board or vice versa. You might also have to flash the esc if he doesn't do it (but he for sure can for a small fee just don't know if it will be included in the base kit)
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 12:33 PM
Experienced but not an Expert
seahawk1984's Avatar
United States, WA, Enumclaw
Joined May 2011
394 Posts
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Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
Electricity and pure water mix just fine - water is an insulator actually. Where it becomes a problem is when your water contains ions - then it can be a conductor. It can also do physical damage to components because it is an insulator/resistor, it can cause a local current spike, melting components.

That is why you use distilled water for breaking in motors! "De-ionized" water is fine too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propert...l_conductivity

Wow, that brought back some memories from when I was in electrical school!

As I was reading your post I was thinking to myself 'Dugh! I know that now.' LOL.

Thanks.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 12:49 PM
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Teckos's Avatar
Joined Jan 2009
484 Posts
Seahawk and Jasmine: I would have never thought about that. Thanks for sharing the information. That being said, there's a mind block, such as the one that prevents you from flying nose in when you're still a newbie, that tells me not to do it ^^ Just finished the 4th battery so the motor should soon break in.
Would that help the motor to be more durable?
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 12:56 PM
Rocket Programmer
jasmine2501's Avatar
United States, AZ, Mesa
Joined Jul 2007
25,393 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teckos View Post
Seahawk and Jasmine: I would have never thought about that. Thanks for sharing the information. That being said, there's a mind block, such as the one that prevents you from flying nose in when you're still a newbie, that tells me not to do it ^^ Just finished the 4th battery so the motor should soon break in.
Would that help the motor to be more durable?
It is something that we have done for many years on brushed motors. Car guys swear by it...

That's why the article is really old... http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_5628228/tm.htm
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 12:59 PM
Go small or go home
ruzam's Avatar
Canada, SK, Regina
Joined Mar 2008
1,457 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by seahawk1984 View Post
He also said that by placing the motor in distilled water it gives the motor a load, and helps keep it cool. I should also mention to run the motor at full speed for a full battery.
That's all true for 'larger' motors.

But for these small motors, you won't get any water in the can, and if you do, you won't get it out again. The open holes in the can are smaller than surface tension will allow, so even if you dunk it in water, nothing will go in or out with out some kind of pressure to force it. You'd have to use a very specialized micro-tube water pump apparatus to get a clean flow of water through the can in the first place, and then a micro source of compressed air to clear it all out again.

The tail motors have no holes at all. Check the micro submarine and boat forums. Those guys use these same motors as propulsion pods as is, directly in water with no protection what so ever. They're just too small for water to get in (or out).

These motors either work well and live long, or suck and die early. So far I haven't seen anything that will help a sucky motor. The msrx bad motors thread has lots of ideas and suggestions. But in the end I think a brushless conversion is the only long term solution.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 01:15 PM
MCX2..120SR..NCPX..MQX..D X7s
23DM's Avatar
United States, OR, Salem
Joined May 2012
45 Posts
Yep, copy that SeaHawk ! I shall never darken their door again. Now let's see if HH will do the right thing, and ship me a new Nano.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 04:49 PM
Registered User
Tegucigalpa, Honduras
Joined Feb 2007
105 Posts
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Originally Posted by rcflyair View Post
Both of mine did. Somewhere around 5 or 10 flights the power picks up, and a few more flights and it gets really good...

I put my third motor in late last night and on this one I'll run the motor at quarter or half throttle for a few batteries to see if I get any more life out of it, and based on the longevity of the first two motors it won't take long to find out

I'm not anxious to go brushless (although its a very cool project). I'd rather find a souce for a $6 replacement coreless brushed motor that'll last over 200 flights with as good or better power than stock - I'm looking......
+1 let me know too, im trying to find the same thing
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 06:25 PM
Time To Fly The Best!
heritageflyer's Avatar
Hills of Eastern Ohio
Joined Nov 2008
13,868 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by indoorheli View Post
Dylan will not have a plug and play...at least not for a long while out. You will still have to solder the motor to the esc, solder the signal to the rx and esc and solder the power to the esc then to the board or vice versa. You might also have to flash the esc if he doesn't do it (but he for sure can for a small fee just don't know if it will be included in the base kit)
Bummer, I would probably need a Luxo Magnifier lamp to do that work. Definitely a new Iron...
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 06:43 PM
Fighting Gravity
elgecko's Avatar
USA, PA, Red Lion
Joined Sep 2005
188 Posts
I'm starting to like this little heli more each time I fly it as I'm getting use to the quick controls.

Tonight I tried my first ever flips and recorded it.
Did a total of 5, only caught about 3 and realized a few that where going over so slow was because I did not have it on 100% rates.
First flip on the video is with reduced rates, the second with 100%.
Watch carefully....
Sorry for the crappy video and flying, these are my first ever flips and very new to flying a CP heli.

First Blade Nano Flips (0 min 15 sec)
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 06:51 PM
Registered User
i812's Avatar
Joined Aug 2009
5,023 Posts
If a new "square"-shaped Carbon brush(es) is to be installed inside an electric Motor, then it makes electrical sense to "mate" a square-shaped Carbon Brush to a round Commutator.

New square-shaped Carbon Brush = []
Round Commutator = O

Assembled new square-type Carbon Brush + Commutator = []O

Notice in the above diagram showing the square-type Carbon Brush making contact with the round Commutator, only a very thin "line" on the Carbon Brush is making electrical contact with the round Commutator. A very thin line on Carbon Brush making contact with the round Commutator results with very large resistance between Carbon Brush and Commutator. A large resistance equates to a large Voltage drop and high heat at the "line" contact between Brush and Commutator. The large Voltage drop and high heat means wasted electrical power being used to make heat, and which won't be available for turning the Motor. The high heat is not only waisted power, but it will also cause Commutator and Brush(es) to prematurely wear.

Assembled Ground/mated Carbon Brush + Round Commutator = [(O

Notice in above diagram, that slowly grinding a new square-type Carbon Brush to it's mating round Commutator, will increase the Brushes contact from a "line" to full round contact surface area. The greater the contact surface area, the less the resistance between the Carbon Brush and the round Commutator. Less resistance, equates to less Voltage drop, and less heat, which implies greater electrical power available to Motor and cooler Carbon Brushes and Commutator. The de-ionized water can be used to "wash" away the Carbon dust during the grinding process. The grinding process is complete when the Carbon Brush and Commutator are perfectly mated to each other allowing greatest amount of surface contact between them, and can be electrically measured when Voltage drop between Carbon Brush and Commutator reaches a minimum, and any further grinding doesn't further decrease the Voltage drop.

Now, having said all that. It was almost a waist of time to explain the above, because the Nano probably has metal wire "whisker" type of brushes, which don't need "grinding" in to make better surface contact with the Commutator. IMO, grinding of metal wire "whisker" type Brushes won't make them fit better, it will only wear the metal whisker "Brushes" faster (the tiny metal whisker wires can only withstand a certain amount of Commutator rotations before they become worn away). I posted the below post in this thread last week, and in the video starting at time 1:35, you can see what I call metal wire "whisker"-type brushes look like:

Quote:
Originally Posted by i812 View Post
...
I believe the Mini's Tail Motor has internal metal wire Brushes which are bent and assembled at an angle in such a way that they work best only when the Motor is spinning in a particular direction. Although swapping wires to reverse the polarity of the Voltage going into the Motor will make the Motor spin backwards, I think spinning the Motor backwards will cause the wire brushes wear out faster. Perhaps this crude diagram may help explain why:

/O/

Both wire Brushes (both "/") are bent and angled so their tips apply pressure and have electrical contact with the Commutator (the "O"). In the above diagram, if the Commutator is rotated CW, the springiness of the wire Brushes allow them to automatically maintain slight electrical contact pressure as they "slide" along the Commutator; however, if the Commutator is rotated CCW, the Commutator will "push" on the wire Brushes causing them to become hotter, wear faster, and fail prematurely.

As an example, think how a cat or dog's hair behaves depending on which way it is brushed: in one direction stroking downward from the top of their head towards the legs, the hair lays flat, and the stroke is smooth; whereas, in the opposite direction stroking upward from the legs towards the top of the head, the hair wants to stand up and the stroke is rough. With all the wire brushed Motors I've seen, the wire brushes behave the same way, and have a preferred direction of being "stroked" (i.e. rotating around) the Commutator.

Although the below EatAtJoes video is of a different Tail Motor, starting at 1:35 it shows what wire Brushes look like, how they are angled and bent to make spring contact with the Commutator:
E Flite Blade MSR Tail Motor End Cap Repair (9 min 6 sec)

Quote:
Originally Posted by i812 View Post
I think if a different Motor designed to spin in the opposite direction was used, or a Tail Rotor that has oppositely angled pitch, then it might be a better mod, because it would probably last longer.
Probably the most economical way to get the most life out of the metal wire whisker Brushes is not un-neccessarily grind them, and more importantly use Throttle Hold to turn off the electrical Motor so it never gets stalled (i,e. avoid applying Voltage to Motor while something is preventing it from spinning). Applying Voltage to the Motor while something is preventing it form spinning causes extreme current, which causes extreme heat, which may melt the metal wire whiskers, as shown in the above video starting at time 1:35.
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Last edited by i812; Oct 17, 2012 at 10:56 PM.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 07:07 PM
2 seconds from crashing
indoorheli's Avatar
United States, WA, Seattle
Joined Sep 2007
7,349 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by heritageflyer View Post
Bummer, I would probably need a Luxo Magnifier lamp to do that work. Definitely a new Iron...
It really isn't too bad. But for those not wanting to do the work themselves I'm willing to solder a a few kits and flash the esc If people send me their boards..for a fee of course.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 09:11 PM
Registered User
United States, SC, Irmo
Joined Sep 2011
4,659 Posts
Just got mine! It's not that small! I expected a bit smaller. It seems similar size to my solo pro. Still can't believe this thing cost $150, there's not much there. I got it on ebay from a big seller and got three extra "Lectron Pro" 25C batteries. I will try it out this weekend. Don't want to fly it in the house until I try it outside first.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 09:43 PM
Registered User
China, Guangdong, Shenzhen
Joined Jan 2010
17 Posts
Sorry to bring up the OT flying with battery thing again, but I wanted to post the actual rules for the FAA:

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/..._batteries.pdf

Summary: Spare Lipo's in carry on only, and in protective enclosure. You can only check Lipo's if they are installed in something. Larger lipos are limited to 2 spares.


Back on topic...I am sold...I will be picking up a nano once back in the U.S. in a few weeks. I ignored all the people stating the mcpX is too much for indoors, but they were correct for my situation. Other than hovering and slow circuits, It is no good for my indoor space at my skill level. I feel too much potential damage to the room coming from the mcpX, so I do not find it enjoyable to fly indoors. I am hoping the nano will take place of my msrX for indoor flight as I am not a huge fan of the msrX's funky movements when using rudder at slow speeds.
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Old Oct 18, 2012, 01:14 AM
Registered User
Joined Sep 2012
17 Posts
Gyro gain

I love my new nano but i am having trouble with the tail twitching as if the gain is too high
I have checked the main bearings and they are fine and used both set of tail blades
But still no luck
Anyone have any ideas?
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Old Oct 18, 2012, 01:56 AM
Team WarpSquad
Daryoon's Avatar
San Diego, CA
Joined Dec 2010
6,368 Posts
Have you checked the feathering shaft and the feathering shaft nut?
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