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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:20 PM
It's 5 O'clock Somewhere
RumRunner_1492's Avatar
Dayton, OH
Joined Feb 2006
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Originally Posted by Usta Bee View Post
This guy beat a Frenchie at his own game, and won the Tour 3 times, and I never heard of any doping scandals about him from the French.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ayvwt...layer_embedded
That guy is now the only American to have won the tour de france.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:21 PM
Reserved Parking
P-51C's Avatar
Joined Jun 2004
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Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492 View Post
If people testify they saw him cheat that counts as evidence. 10 ex-teammates were prepared to testify to that.
A lot of people claim to have seen bigfoot. Doesn't mean it exists.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:24 PM
Холодная война все еще здесь.
RCWorks's Avatar
Joined Aug 2003
1,674 Posts
So now do you believe 10 ex teammates with axes to grind or the science of testing for the forbidden items?

One is tangible, the other is not...

I saw Barak Obama and Mitt Romney do unspeakable acts with sheep... Did they?

Think about it.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:25 PM
Alarm Bells Continuing!
Big Foot 48's Avatar
Arizona
Joined Oct 2001
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Originally Posted by P-51C View Post
A lot of people claim to have seen bigfoot. Doesn't mean it exists.
Hey watch it!
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:26 PM
Reserved Parking
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Originally Posted by Big Foot 48 View Post
Hey watch it!
Dang, I new I should have used UFO's or Obama's birth certificate as an example!
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:28 PM
It's 5 O'clock Somewhere
RumRunner_1492's Avatar
Dayton, OH
Joined Feb 2006
418 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by P-51C View Post
A lot of people claim to have seen bigfoot. Doesn't mean it exists.
If there is a court case and the people are reliable and would be people who would have knowledge on the subject it would count as evidence. These aren't other teams charging him. It is his own team coming out against him.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:29 PM
It's 5 O'clock Somewhere
RumRunner_1492's Avatar
Dayton, OH
Joined Feb 2006
418 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by RCWorks View Post
So now do you believe 10 ex teammates with axes to grind or the science of testing for the forbidden items?

One is tangible, the other is not...

I saw Barak Obama and Mitt Romney do unspeakable acts with sheep... Did they?

Think about it.
How do you know they have axes to gind?
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492 View Post
If there is a court case and the people are reliable and would be people who would have knowledge on the subject it would count as evidence. These aren't other teams charging him. It is his own team coming out against him.
Actually, as I recall it was started by the French years ago.

Like I said before, if there is actual evidence he did it fine, I'll jump on the badwagon against him. Until then, it is nothing more than a "reality TV generation induced witch-hunt".
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:34 PM
Холодная война все еще здесь.
RCWorks's Avatar
Joined Aug 2003
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Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492 View Post
How do you know they have axes to gind?
Because they deny years of blood and urine tests... People can say anything, that's how B.O. got in to office IIRC.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:35 PM
In Development Now
Indiana_Geoff's Avatar
Joined May 2005
448 Posts
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Originally Posted by MaddSkillz View Post
You do realize 4 ex-teammates testified to a Grand Jury about the US Postal teams doping practices don't you (it should also be noted that eye-witness testimony under oath constitutes as evidence). Do you also know that there currently exists no test to prove blood transfusions? Just tests that indicate it? For example Lance's test of the 2009 tour indicate blood doping as his hemoglobin levels actually rose during the race. This is unnatural blood activity and indicates blood transfusions. Are you also aware of the many ex professional riders who also never failed a single drug test but later admitted to doping?

Saying you never failed a test doesn't mean you never doped.
How would you know this since Grand Jury testimony is sealed. We also have not seen an indictment.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:50 PM
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United States, OK, Tulsa
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Originally Posted by P-51C View Post
Did any teammates of Lance provide any physical evidence, or was everything hearsay like your neighbor's cousin's grandma's dog's uncle's brother hearing it over the fence?
Yes, it's a big, sport-wide conspiracy, also involving Lance's friends who have been paid off to bring him down.

Or, they just told the truth.

Let's see, such a hard choice on which is more likely. I mean, combined with all the other things that just don't add up. I'm sure the conspiracy option is the more reasonable one.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:52 PM
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United States, OK, Tulsa
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Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492 View Post
10 ex-teammates were prepared to testify against him if this went to the next step which was arbitration. That is why I think he gave up. He knew his goose was cooked.
Precisely. Having big names in cycling - someone like George Hincapie who just retired with great respect and admiration among the fans, testify in court against him would be devastating to the Lance Armstrong legacy. Lance wants everything to just fade away out of the spot light with the hopes of keeping the Lance fans duped.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:54 PM
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United States, OK, Tulsa
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Originally Posted by P-51C View Post
A lot of people claim to have seen bigfoot. Doesn't mean it exists.

And this is where the Lance fans will stay... Grasping at straws and failing to admit to the truth... Lance is a cheat and he had them fooled.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 03:58 PM
Intergalctic Coffee Enthusiast
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United States, OK, Tulsa
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Originally Posted by RCWorks View Post
So now do you believe 10 ex teammates with axes to grind or the science of testing for the forbidden items?

One is tangible, the other is not...

I saw Barak Obama and Mitt Romney do unspeakable acts with sheep... Did they?

Think about it.
Like I stated, it's not that simple... There is no test that proves you transfused your own blood. The tests only indicate this. This is rather significant. Tyler Hamilton said the UCI and Lance had a special relationship that enabled possible positive test results to just "disappear." The kicker to this story is that Lance gave the UCI money - the same organization in place to police the riders was taking funds from their biggest star. Add to that, that both the UCI and Lance report different numbers as to how much he gave them and also to that fact that this exchange of money was not public until the information was "leaked" to the public. In other words, it was kept on the down-low until it absolutely had to be known.

No, that's not suspicious at all.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by RCWorks View Post
Because they deny years of blood and urine tests... People can say anything, that's how B.O. got in to office IIRC.
Okay, since you don't accept that Lance was doping... Then tell us your theory. The names of the riders, and why they would want to spend money in possible defense costs by falsely accusing Armstrong and also managing to somehow convince the USADA (who are not idiots) that their testimony would be good enough. And you think a governing body is just going to strip one of the biggest icons in sports of their titles based on "someone's ax to grind?" Do you think they're that stupid or driven by some revenge? What revenge would the USADA have against Lance to allow themselves to get sucked into this?

I'd also like for you to explain how Lance's hemoglobin levels went up during the 2009 Tour de France.

Thanks.
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