Originally Posted by Usta Bee

This story just made my day.


Wonder how many people will be throwing their yellow rubberbands in the garbage now ?.

Probably none. I don't think the wristband had anything to do with a friggin bicycle race. If it did, I'll throw mine away. I am pretty sure it is a cancer survivor thing.

Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492

There must be something to it or he would continue to fight it. My guess is they have confirmed it and gave him the chance to avoid his name being trashed by a drawn out public investigation.

According to his statement, he is just sick of the whole circus.

According to ESPN this morning the only thing they may have is "new witnesses, some being team mates that are now claiming they saw him doing something".

Again, no evidence, at best a "he said she said" based on "new witnessess" that really don't know what they may have seen.

They also said on ESPN that over the course of his winning years he was subjected to over 500 tests, NONE, showed he did anything. I could see someone beating a random test once or twice, but not showing up in 500 seperate testing events statistically weighs very very very very much in his favor.

He spent a lot of time and money avoiding going to court. When that failed he said he was tired of the fight and was walking away.
He's never walked away from anything except his wife and Sheryl Crow, so it sounds a bit dodgy to me.
And UCI have a few questions to answer.

The whole thing stinks.

Originally Posted by P-51C

According to his statement, he is just sick of the whole circus.

According to ESPN this morning the only thing they may have is "new witnesses, some being team mates that are now claiming they saw him doing something".

Again, no evidence, at best a "he said she said" based on "new witnessess" that really don't know what they may have seen.

They also said on ESPN that over the course of his winning years he was subjected to over 500 tests, NONE, showed he did anything. I could see someone beating a random test once or twice, but not showing up in 500 seperate testing events statistically weighs very very very very much in his favor.

This is from Yahoo. Pretty harsh.

By quitting, he let the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency say he was guilty, say his seven Tour de France championships were as fake as everything else in a dirty sport. Because if he was innocent, if there was some means to battle the organization with no legal power the way he had the U.S. Department of Justice, he would not be letting USADA try to yank the yellow jerseys from his closet.

No way if there’s even a hint of hope does Lance Armstrong let this happen to his name. He was always too proud, too defiant, too stubborn to give up. He beat cancer. He beat the federal government. He beat everything that came his way. He didn’t relent.

If there was a fight to still fight, he would have fought it.

Now we're burned by another fraud masquerading as a hero.

This whole thing really pisses me off.

Hundreds of drug tests were done on Lance during his career, and hundreds of them turned up "negative" with only a couple showing trace amounts, and one of those was attributed to a topical he used to control saddle sores (well, "Duhhhh").

He's been railroaded, not because he doped (which he was proven to have not done), but because his many wins just "didn't make sense", and therefore he HAD to have been doping and they were going to press on no matter what until they got what they wanted, which they finally did.

This rates right up there with other idiotic and nasty endeavors that started with slogans like:

"The nature of the evidence is irrelevant; it's the seriousness of the charge that matters."

... and:

“We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it”

Both are moronic statements that have propelled our culture, and changed the nature of our culture for the negative, in ways that have profound repercussions, including the railroadding of Lance Armstrong.

Originally Posted by Highflight

This whole thing really pisses me off.

Hundreds of drug tests were done on Lance during his career, and hundreds of them turned up "negative" with only a couple showing trace amounts, and one of those was attributed to a topical he used to control saddle sores (well, "Duhhhh").

He's been railroaded, not because he doped (which he was proven to have not done), but because his many wins just "didn't make sense", and therefore he HAD to have been doping and they were going to press on no matter what until they got what they wanted, which they finally did.

This rates right up there with other idiotic and nasty endeavors that started with slogans like:

"The nature of the evidence is irrelevant; it's the seriousness of the charge that matters."

... and:

“We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it”

Both are moronic statements that have propelled our culture, and changed the nature of our culture for the negative, in ways that have profound repercussions, including the railroadding of Lance Armstrong.

With you in lock-step on this one. Lance just pisses off the UCI.

Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492

This is from Yahoo. Pretty harsh.

They can have there opinion. And that is all you posted, someone's opinion.

I prefer to look at the facts as we know them at this point.

+1

You don't pass that many drug test by doing drugs.

People (including myself) just don't understand the emotional and physical toll being degraded and accused so much, for so long. He's got his money, he got the fame. He wants his quiet now I imagine.
It's amazing how people can look in the face of proof and argue.

Originally Posted by Highflight

This whole thing really pisses me off.

Hundreds of drug tests were done on Lance during his career, and hundreds of them turned up "negative" with only a couple showing trace amounts, and one of those was attributed to a topical he used to control saddle sores (well, "Duhhhh").

He's been railroaded, not because he doped (which he was proven to have not done), but because his many wins just "didn't make sense", and therefore he HAD to have been doping and they were going to press on no matter what until they got what they wanted, which they finally did.

This rates right up there with other idiotic and nasty endeavors that started with slogans like:

"The nature of the evidence is irrelevant; it's the seriousness of the charge that matters."

... and:

“We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it”

Both are moronic statements that have propelled our culture, and changed the nature of our culture for the negative, in ways that have profound repercussions, including the railroadding of Lance Armstrong.

I don't pretend to have a clue whether or not he doped. Frankly, I bet he did. I think the US team had some pretty high tech, and probably had techniques to get around the testing. I think they were ahead of the technology curve for testing at the time.

But, banning someone without conclusive physical proof is wrong. People can easily be coerced into lying. That is not proof of anything.

Originally Posted by saltyzoo

I don't pretend to have a clue whether or not he doped. Frankly, I bet he did. I think the US team had some pretty high tech, and probably had techniques to get around the testing. I think they were ahead of the technology curve for testing at the time.

But, banning someone without conclusive physical proof is wrong. People can easily be coerced into lying. That is not proof of anything.

Hundreds upon hundreds of drug tests during his career that all turned out negative, and only two that were postive by a "trace" with one being easily explained and allowed within the rules.

If you were truly a "betting" man, I think you might want to rethink your "bet" considering all the evidence to the contrary.
You fell into the same trap of "he's a big winner so he must have been doping" argument.

If multiple and continuous drug testing isn't good enough to prove he's innocent of doping, then why even do the drug tests in the first place?

The fact is he is willing to be stripped of his wins and his medals as well as permanantly trash his name. He wouldn't do that unless there was a reason and he was guilty.

It's a little too late to try to stip the man of medals, this has turned in to a witch hunt...

USADA is losing credibility, after this many years and this many wins.

Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492

The fact is he is willing to be stripped of his wins and his medals as well as permanantly trash his name. He wouldn't do that unless there was a reason and he was guilty.

That is just lazy thinking.

It has been going on for years and years. Anyone would get tired of it. Also, as I understand it, the rogue agency uses some sort of "arbitration" process where he is presumed guilty and must prove his innocence while not being allowed to cross examine any so called "witnesses" brought against him. (that from a discussion link on ESPN, not sure of the accuracy). If that is the case, who WOULD want to continue with the time, expense, and headaches of dealing with the people who have not shown any actual physical evidence?

If they have actual evidence, present it publicly so we can all see it and change our minds accordingly. Otherwise, leave Armstrong alone and quit trying to make names for themselves while appeasing the witch hunters.

Originally Posted by Highflight

If you were truly a "betting" man, I think you might want to rethink your "bet" considering all the evidence to the contrary.
You fell into the same trap of "he's a big winner so he must have been doping" argument.

Strawman. I didn't fall into any trap, I never said any such thing. I said I don't have the slightest clue whether or not he actually did it. I just think there's a decent chance he did, while still maintaining that my completely unproven belief shouldn't have any effect on how he is treated.

If multiple and continuous drug testing isn't good enough to prove he's innocent of doping, then why even do the drug tests in the first place?

I'm not sure you actually read my post completely and accurately. Perhaps, you are falling into the "He's a hero so can do no wrong" trap.

For the record, I think he's a hero even if he did. He's an amazing guy.

Originally Posted by RumRunner_1492

The fact is he is willing to be stripped of his wins and his medals as well as permanantly trash his name. He wouldn't do that unless there was a reason and he was guilty.

"He wouldn't do that unless there was a reason and he was guilty tired of the BS and wanting to get on with his life."

Fixed it.