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Old Jan 17, 2013, 08:36 PM
Finding Creative Ways To Crash
RCCrashTestDummy's Avatar
Joined Jun 2012
448 Posts
QR Ladybird

Man, I don't know guys... Maybe I don't have the Tx set-up correctly...

I just got my new QR Ladybird up in the air before dark and tried her out on my little pylon race course (2 sticks shoved in the ground 20 meters apart ) and was really disappointed. This thing was sliding really badly through turns compared to my X4 and V202. It's like the aileron won't tilt enough to the inside of the turn to keep it from wanting to, just keep sliding when you have any speed going. It won't "dive-in" until you just about have it stopped and you've backed-out of the rudder.

With the X4 and V202 this task is almost seamless. You just haul-ass towards the turn, bank into the inside of the turn using aileron, then follow it around using rudder to execute a sweet, smooth, banked turn; the Ladybird, not so much. I think I have the aileron rate cranked-up to 125% and expo at -10 on the Devo 7 in an attempt to get this thing to hold in hard corners, and Iím really not having much luck.

I did switch to 3 axis just to see whatís up with the last bit of daylight and promptly plowed it into the ground on the first hard turn. This thing is like a piece of ice, sliding on another piece of ice. Is this just how this thing is, or am I doing something wrong?

Thanks,

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 08:38 PM
Registered User
United States, CA, San Jose
Joined Jul 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bulesz View Post
Mate, just realized, that the FlySky stock TX has this A7105 module....so regarding to that we (9X owners) "only" need a good programmer to make the Hubsan X4 binding?
As least one guy is working on it. I agree it would be great to wire up an A7105 to an Arduino Nano, load firmware for Hubsan,WLToys, etc, and plug it into any radio's trainer port. That would also make for a popular module someone could sell.

I'm working on upgrading the internal stock Hubsan and WLToys Tx's with an A7105 to boost range. And then possibly boosting that with an external amp to get 1/2 to 1 mile range for my micro FPV setup. So far, I initially had great success but then after resoldering the A7105 it somehow mysteriously stopped working, so 2 more are on the way from China to try again. Will post a thread on it if successful.
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 08:44 PM
Tri-Quad-Hexa-Octo-copters!!
United States, TX, San Antonio
Joined Feb 2007
14,588 Posts
Hi RC,
What Tx are you using with the QR Ladybird V1? You had it in the 3d mode with the green LED?
Cheers,
Jim
Quadrocopter and Tricopter Info Mega Link Index
Quote:
Originally Posted by RCCrashTestDummy View Post
Man, I don't know guys... Maybe I don't have the Tx set-up correctly...

I just got my new QR Ladybird up in the air before dark and tried her out on my little pylon race course (2 sticks shoved in the ground 20 meters apart ) and was really disappointed. This thing was sliding really badly through turns compared to my X4 and V202. It's like the aileron won't tilt enough to the inside of the turn to keep it from wanting to, just keep sliding when you have any speed going. It won't "dive-in" until you just about have it stopped and you've backed-out of the rudder.

With the X4 and V202 this task is almost seamless. You just haul-ass towards the turn, bank into the inside of the turn using aileron, then follow it around using rudder to execute a sweet, smooth, banked turn; the Ladybird, not so much. I think I have the aileron rate cranked-up to 125% and expo at -10 on the Devo 7 in an attempt to get this thing to hold in hard corners, and Iím really not having much luck.

I did switch to 3 axis just to see whatís up with the last bit of daylight and promptly plowed it into the ground on the first hard turn. This thing is like a piece of ice, sliding on another piece of ice. Is this just how this thing is, or am I doing something wrong?

Thanks,

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 08:48 PM
Finding Creative Ways To Crash
RCCrashTestDummy's Avatar
Joined Jun 2012
448 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
Hi RC,
What Tx are you using with the QR Ladybird V1? You had it in the 3d mode with the green LED?
Cheers,
Jim
Quadrocopter and Tricopter Info Mega Link Index
Hey Jim,

I'm using the Devo 7. I only had it in 3D mode (Green light) right at the end of the day just to test and see if it would hold in the turn, but it went 3D on me like it was supposed to... then plowed into the ground. I just picked it up and walked inside. Whoops; yes its a V1.

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 08:52 PM
Tri-Quad-Hexa-Octo-copters!!
United States, TX, San Antonio
Joined Feb 2007
14,588 Posts
Hi Patrick,
This A7105 puts out 100mw: http://www.ebay.com/itm/CC2500-PA-LN...item19d726245b

However I suspect that A standard 2.4Ghz amp should do better by itself. 2.4Ghz Wifi Booster List

Cheers,
Jim
Quadrocopter and Tricopter Info Mega Link Index
Quote:
Originally Posted by patricklupo View Post
As least one guy is working on it. I agree it would be great to wire up an A7105 to an Arduino Nano, load firmware for Hubsan,WLToys, etc, and plug it into any radio's trainer port. That would also make for a popular module someone could sell.

I'm working on upgrading the internal stock Hubsan and WLToys Tx's with an A7105 to boost range. And then possibly boosting that with an external amp to get 1/2 to 1 mile range for my micro FPV setup. So far, I initially had great success but then after resoldering the A7105 it somehow mysteriously stopped working, so 2 more are on the way from China to try again. Will post a thread on it if successful.
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 09:03 PM
Tri-Quad-Hexa-Octo-copters!!
United States, TX, San Antonio
Joined Feb 2007
14,588 Posts
RC,
Try to let up on the yaw before you input the aileron for tighter turns. The ladybird tends to lock the roll response with any yaw input. Also increase the rate and maybe also the expo for your particular for your particular control feel the roll and pitch on the DEVO 7E. You will have to be in the 3d mode so the accelerometer does not fight for level if you want to do aerobatics. The accelerometer mode is for stability and precision control. With an accelerometer you must counter the "slide". In other words set the angle and release, .et it slide, then counter as necessary. It is a different control method than a non-accelerometer fitted helicopter. It is a matter of learning the different control feel to get it to perform the way you desire. The use of a DEVO 7E should be able to adapt to your performance desires with the LB. Experiment
Cheers,
Jim
Quote:
Originally Posted by RCCrashTestDummy View Post
Hey Jim,

I'm using the Devo 7. I only had it in 3D mode (Green light) right at the end of the day just to test and see if it would hold in the turn, but it went 3D on me like it was supposed to... then plowed into the ground. I just picked it up and walked inside. Whoops; yes its a V1.

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 09:20 PM
Finding Creative Ways To Crash
RCCrashTestDummy's Avatar
Joined Jun 2012
448 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
RC,
Try to let up on the yaw before you input the aileron for tighter turns. The ladybird tends to lock the roll response with any yaw input.
This is the exact thing I tought I was noticing. If I backed-out of the rudder it seemed to want to work a little better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
Also increase the rate and maybe also the expo for your particular for your particular control feel the roll and pitch on the DEVO 7E.
I'm already maxed-out at 125% but I still have plenty of expo room...Maybe that might help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
With an accelerometer you must counter the "slide". In other words set the angle and release, .et it slide, then counter as necessary. It is a different control method than a non-accelerometer fitted helicopter. It is a matter of learning the different control feel to get it to perform the way you desire. The use of a DEVO 7E should be able to adapt to your performance desires with the LB. Experiment
Cheers,
Jim
That’s just it; it simply doesn’t seem to want to "hang in there" as I give it full/100% aileron. It's like it just can't handle a bunch of aileron and rudder at the same time. I'll be sure to give it more of a chance and mess with it, but for now; it doesn't even compare to my V202 or X4. If I can't get this thing to fly any better, I'll sell it and the new BNF on it's way. I'm really let down so far.

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 09:29 PM
Finding Creative Ways To Crash
RCCrashTestDummy's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
RC,
Try to let up on the yaw before you input the aileron for tighter turns.
I forgot to mention that I use the aileron first then follow through/ bring the backend around using the rudder, and I'm still having this problem. Oh, and I'm using the DEVO 7 not the 7E although I don't think that would make any difference.

It really doen't do much of a self level...well kind of. I can let go of the right stick and it will kind of level out, but it will keep hauling butt in whatever direction it was going. It won't almost stop itself like the V202 and X4. It just keeps sliding.

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 09:32 PM
Tri-Quad-Hexa-Octo-copters!!
United States, TX, San Antonio
Joined Feb 2007
14,588 Posts
RC,
Yep. I believe the QR Ladybird V1 and V2, with its virtual accelerometer coding, was set up with stability over aggressive tight turn kind of flying. It will manually do repeated flips in a foot in the 3d mode in any direction almost as good as the auto-flip mode of the V202, but the yaw input seems to lock out aggressive aileron. The work around to that is to input yaw then let off the yaw and input aileron. Just a little more to do on the learning curve. The V1 has the ability to have firmware updates, but other than the increased throttle response in the latest release, the tight turn yaw issue has not been addressed. What you are seeing in the slide which must always be countered is a coding called rate control and the stop you notice is coding called angle control. It is a matter of the developers coding and flying style preference. Tx stick controlling the rate control coding is done by countering the input. That requires a bit of anticipation, but probably works better for those wanting to do AVP than for those who like to sport fly aggressively. Angle control coding is better suited for aggressive flying
Cheers,
Jim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RCCrashTestDummy View Post
This is the exact thing I tought I was noticing. If I backed-out of the rudder it seemed to want to work a little better.



I'm already maxed-out at 125% but I still have plenty of expo room...Maybe that might help.



That’s just it; it simply doesn’t seem to want to "hang in there" as I give it full/100% aileron. It's like it just can't handle a bunch of aileron and rudder at the same time. I'll be sure to give it more of a chance and mess with it, but for now; it doesn't even compare to my V202 or X4. If I can't get this thing to fly any better, I'll sell it and the new BNF on it's way. I'm really let down so far.

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 09:37 PM
Finding Creative Ways To Crash
RCCrashTestDummy's Avatar
Joined Jun 2012
448 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
RC,
Yep. I believe the QR Ladybird V1 and V2, with its virtual accelerometer coding, was set up with stability over aggressive tight turn kind of flying. It will manually do flips in a foot in the 3d mode almost as good as the auto-flip mode of theV202, but the yaw input seems to lock out aggressive aileron. The work around to that is to input yaw then let off the yaw and input aileron. Just a little more to do on the learning curve. The V1 has the ability to have firmware updates, but other than the increased throttle response in the latest release, the tight turn yaw issue has not been addressed.
Cheers,
Jim
Quadrocopter and Tricopter Info Mega Link Index
Very good Jim, thanks a bunch! This seems to be the exact case of what was happening to me. I'll give your suggestions a try and see if I can't get this one swinging around.

Thanks again Jim,

-Pat
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 10:23 PM
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United States, CA, San Jose
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Hey Jim,

I didn't see that one and wished I had ordered it instead of the 50mW one's I have on the way. I currently use a Sunhans booster on my regular radio so may try it, but then again the 100mW transceiver by itself might do 1/4 mi and that would be plenty. Thanks.

By the way, the Hubsan stock Tx has easy solder pads to the right of the LCD for SCIO, SCS, SCK, GND and 3.3v VCC. The built-in Hubsan vreg supplying 3.3v is rated only for 100mA, so may use an LM1117T depending on actual current draw of the A7105. In a proof of concept build I got way more range than the stock did but the A7105 somehow kicked the bucket when soldering everything together to mount it inside the TX, so I'm trying again in hopes that it'll work. As mentioned, will put together a build thread if I can get it all working reliably. WLToys use the same module so that's next on the list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins View Post
Hi Patrick,
This A7105 puts out 100mw: http://www.ebay.com/itm/CC2500-PA-LN...item19d726245b

However I suspect that A standard 2.4Ghz amp should do better by itself. 2.4Ghz Wifi Booster List

Cheers,
Jim
Quadrocopter and Tricopter Info Mega Link Index
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Last edited by patricklupo; Jan 17, 2013 at 10:35 PM.
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Old Jan 17, 2013, 11:23 PM
Ain't crashing often anymore
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Germany, Berlin
Joined Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bulesz View Post
Mate, just realized, that the FlySky stock TX has this A7105 module....so regarding to that we (9X owners) "only" need a good programmer to make the Hubsan X4 binding?
No, according to phracturedBlue - one of the deviation coders:
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhracturedBlue View Post
..... The 9x hardware does not expose enough control over the A7105 transceiver to support using the same module with multiple protocols
Quote:
Originally Posted by patricklupo View Post
As least one guy is working on it. I agree it would be great to wire up an A7105 to an Arduino Nano, load firmware for Hubsan,WLToys, etc, and plug it into any radio's trainer port. That would also make for a popular module someone could sell.
+1, seems to be the easiest way possible to get these different protocols in the 9x.
But unfortunately PhracturedBlue won't do that:
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhracturedBlue View Post
....The only way to do it would be something like the magic cube, or Hammer22's module that plugs into the trainer port. Not something I'm interested in doing
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulesz View Post
I hope my brother will get his 9X soon, due he is a good programmer.. oh and he has a Hubsan X4 as well... if you know what I meeaaaaaan...
If your brother would try it - I'll give you any support I can give. (It will not be much anyway - being a fireman, no electronics/programmer freak)

-mike-
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 06:08 AM
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Hungary EU
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikefromgermany View Post
No, according to phracturedBlue - one of the deviation coders:


+1, seems to be the easiest way possible to get these different protocols in the 9x.
But unfortunately PhracturedBlue won't do that:


If your brother would try it - I'll give you any support I can give. (It will not be much anyway - being a fireman, no electronics/programmer freak)

-mike-
Heyya, thanks mate, at starting I push him to the right direction...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonytester View Post
wiyh the 939 board in what position did you install the motor plugs, also which way is the front of the board. I have each motor rotating in the right direction but not in the right position . i have 4 plugs in one corner and 1plug off to the side, I do realize that the udi board does not mount square to the front one corner is the front,
tonytester
My parts still on the way, but due the + X layout difference between the UDI and V939 frame, I should order the V939 frame (you can choose H36 frame as well, or Mini Pet, etc..all with the X shape)
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by bulesz View Post
I should order the V939 frame (you can choose H36 frame as well, or Mini Pet, etc..all with the X shape)
Be careful, they are different according to their motorarms:

H36 : 3mm x 3mm
v939 : 4mm x 3mm
Mini Pet : 4.6mm x 4.6mm
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 06:42 AM
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Originally Posted by mystman View Post
Be careful, they are different according to their motorarms:

H36 : 3mm x 3mm
v939 : 4mm x 3mm
Mini Pet : 4.6mm x 4.6mm
Thanks for the hint, but due the H36 frame was out of stock (it was on stock when ordered....) I have chosen the V939 frame as replacing, and I hope the V939 frame + V939 FCB + UDI 816 motorarms would fit fine..
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