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Old Sep 02, 2012, 04:57 PM
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Hi guys,

Jan, yep they are 700 size spinblades. Any 600mm blades look far too small on the blackhawk.

don, thanks alot, i hope so too!

Didier, Yeah i know how to set up my tail on my beast x, as i said, it was flying absolutely fine in pod and boom and tail was locked. im wondering if lifting nearly 6kgs is slowing my head down too much so next fine day i will try increasing my throttle curve to see if the faster tail speed and head speed sorts it out.

the thing is, i cannot hear my motor straining to lift the heli at any stage, its got more than enough torque and grunt, but the 700 size blades have a wider chord and longer length and there for more lift, so i should require LESS headspeed.

if that doesnt work, i will order 700 size blackhawk tail blades and see if that makes the difference.
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Old Sep 02, 2012, 08:40 PM
Love my scale Whirlybirds
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Mississauga, Ont., Can.
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The extra torque of 700 vs 600 blades in a scale bodied heli will create a lot of additional torque that the standard 95mm blades will not be able to correct. You can try a set of 105's that you can get fairly cheaply from KBDD. I have those on my AS350 but cut to 100mm and they seem to be correcting the torque of my three blade 600mm head. It's worth the few dollars to try them out (or any other 700 sized blades) to see if it corrects the torque. Take care.

Don
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Old Sep 03, 2012, 02:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Keyrigger View Post
The extra torque of 700 vs 600 blades in a scale bodied heli will create a lot of additional torque that the standard 95mm blades will not be able to correct. You can try a set of 105's that you can get fairly cheaply from KBDD. I have those on my AS350 but cut to 100mm and they seem to be correcting the torque of my three blade 600mm head. It's worth the few dollars to try them out (or any other 700 sized blades) to see if it corrects the torque. Take care.

Don
Hi don,

My tail blades are 100.86mm from hole to tip, i have just changed my 4 blade tail rotor system over to one that i know for a fact works, as ive been using it for 6 months in my apache, and now all it wants to do in rate mode is spin around on the ground. crazy. my geometry must be out of what i will pull the mechanics out again and see whats up now. endless..
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Old Sep 03, 2012, 08:52 AM
Love my scale Whirlybirds
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Before you do that, check your gyro settings to make sure that the tail rotor is turning the right direction when it is moved. Another pilot had the same issue and all it was about was the gyro direction was reversed, not the tail pitch. Also, check your blade direction to match the rotation direction. All small stuff but it will make a heli un-flyable. Take care.

Don

PS: As a reminder, as the tail moves to the left, the leading edge of the tail blades should move in the opposite direction to the right.
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Old Sep 03, 2012, 10:04 AM
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The Netherlands, FR
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Originally Posted by Keyrigger View Post
Before you do that, check your gyro settings to make sure that the tail rotor is turning the right direction when it is moved. Another pilot had the same issue and all it was about was the gyro direction was reversed, not the tail pitch. Also, check your blade direction to match the rotation direction. All small stuff but it will make a heli un-flyable. Take care.

Don

PS: As a reminder, as the tail moves to the left, the leading edge of the tail blades should move in the opposite direction to the right.
Hi,

When I set up the first time my Helicommand I got the same problem with a tail going left to right with no reason (that was my thought) however after some words I discovered that I did not set my HeliCommand to the correct main rotor direction and that was the problem, it was set to left hand direction instead of right hand direction and thats it

You can overlook sometimes the solution easily.

Jan,
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Old Sep 03, 2012, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyrigger View Post
Before you do that, check your gyro settings to make sure that the tail rotor is turning the right direction when it is moved. Another pilot had the same issue and all it was about was the gyro direction was reversed, not the tail pitch. Also, check your blade direction to match the rotation direction. All small stuff but it will make a heli un-flyable. Take care.

Don

PS: As a reminder, as the tail moves to the left, the leading edge of the tail blades should move in the opposite direction to the right.
Hi don, yeah, all that is sorted, as i mentioned i know how to set up my tail in the beast x no worries, and yes when i changed my raised tail drive from the RCA version to the SM version, i had to reverse my gyro sensor direction and also my rudder direction on my dx8. this bird was flying fine in pod and boom, now its a mess so its time to pull it out and find the problem once and for all.

The raised tail pushrod system i think isnt working correctly, i can see flex in the pushrod, which wont help at all, so im thinking of convertin the gaui x7 carbon pushrod system to remove any flex. i also think the postioning of the pushrod guides on the tail boom, their angle and the smoothness of the pushrods travel through the guide hole plays a major part in smooth turning on these raised tail systems.

it cant be a torque thing because as i mentioned it was flying perfectly in pod and boom with 700 size blades and 100mm tail blades.

one lost kiwi.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 06:09 PM
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Hi guys,

heres some footage of my UH 60 and the tail issues i am experiencing. ive swapped the tail rotor out for one that i know works, and will try again this weekend. the mechanics flew fine in pod and boom, so im stumped.
UH-60 tail issues (1 min 3 sec)
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 06:24 PM
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United States, WA, Steilacoom
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Originally Posted by JayNZ View Post
Hi guys,

heres some footage of my UH 60 and the tail issues i am experiencing. ive swapped the tail rotor out for one that i know works, and will try again this weekend. the mechanics flew fine in pod and boom, so im stumped.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWEja...ReXNv1RUCsLNAQ
I had a same issue with my HH-60 Jayhawk 500 size. It turned out to be too high of tail gain... not saying that's what it is but it does look like the gain is way to high...

In pod and boon will work fine because is less weight, once the extra weight of the fuse is there it behaves that way. Not sure if you already try lowering the tail gyro gain a little.. In my case I lowered about 5 points and the swinging side to side stopped... hope this helps...

Also, noticing that your CG is off... I know mine is off too.... that's why I use two lipos as far as possible to the front and run them in parallel...
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by josereyes View Post
I had a same issue with my HH-60 Jayhawk 500 size. It turned out to be too high of tail gain... not saying that's what it is but it does look like the gain is way to high...

In pod and boon will work fine because is less weight, once the extra weight of the fuse is there it behaves that way. Not sure if you already try lowering the tail gyro gain a little.. In my case I lowered about 5 points and the swinging side to side stopped... hope this helps...

Also, noticing that your CG is off... I know mine is off too.... that's why I use two lipos as far as possible to the front and run them in parallel...
Hi jose, yeah the swing just gets wider and longer if i lower the gain, it flies fine in rate mode, but when you cross over into heading hold it swings l&r.

as for my COG. i installed the mechanics as per the instructions but yeah, it looks a little tail heavy. ive got 2 x 6 cell lips in front of the mechanics in a little battery bay, but i cant get them any further forward because i have a scale cockpit.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by JayNZ View Post
Hi jose, yeah the swing just gets wider and longer if i lower the gain, it flies fine in rate mode, but when you cross over into heading hold it swings l&r.

as for my COG. i installed the mechanics as per the instructions but yeah, it looks a little tail heavy. ive got 2 x 6 cell lips in front of the mechanics in a little battery bay, but i cant get them any further forward because i have a scale cockpit.
Can't remember what your're using for flyblarless.. but how's the gain on the flybarless unit setup... I have tail heading lock set to medium on the AR7200BX flybarless...

How low have you gone in trying to remove the swinging? I kow you say it works fine in rate mode, so is definetly a heading lock gain issue...

I had a TRex 550 that I had the gain so close to the threshold between normal and heading lock but that's where it like to fly at...


BTW that blackhawk sure looks awesome
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Old Sep 07, 2012, 06:39 AM
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Hi Jay,

Indeed it look likes your gain is to high but do you have any play in your linkage to the tail? because if thats the case then your Giro are always to late.
In rate mode is the giro relative standing still but in HH very active.

Check your linkage maybe its bending somewhere.

Jan,
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Old Sep 07, 2012, 03:22 PM
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Hi Jay,

Indeed it look likes your gain is to high but do you have any play in your linkage to the tail? because if thats the case then your Giro are always to late.
In rate mode is the giro relative standing still but in HH very active.

Check your linkage maybe its bending somewhere.

Jan,
Hi jan, no more play than in any of my 3d helis or other scale helis. i had to drill out a little of the plastic guide that the ball link sits in on the tail rotor shaft so0 i could get a smooth movement but the play is minimal. i think carbon pushrods are a must. the ones that came with the kit are quite flimsy and i can see flex before movement takes place. im wondering if this has anything to do with it.
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Old Sep 07, 2012, 04:58 PM
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Hi Jay,

You say

i can see flex before movement takes place. im wondering if this has anything to do with it

Try to get rid off this play and I expect that you have solved the problem.

Jan,
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Old Sep 11, 2012, 09:44 PM
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Hi guys,

Well i swapped out the 4 blade tail rotor to one of a better quality that had been proven to work well on my apache. i had to reverse my gyro sensor direction and then rudder direction in my dx8, and then set up the tail again in rate mode. she now flys perfectly, no tail wag at all, and once i get a chance to test FF flight hopefully this saturday morning weather permitting, i will be able to tell if she holds well.

Very happy with the way she behaved in an inclosed car park and then my back yard in my wind. solid as a rock cyclic and tail will be super solid by the time im finished.

ive also decided to drop down from 12 to 10cell to reduce weight, which means ive also had to increase my throttle curve, now running 55/68/74/84, which gives me plenty of power there if i need it, and well within the recommended 1700rpm headspeed for 700mm blades.

i cant wait to open her up in some clear air. she looks so menacing in hover.

calm skies guys!

happy kiwi!
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Last edited by JayNZ; Sep 11, 2012 at 10:01 PM.
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Old Sep 12, 2012, 02:51 AM
Ado
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Whats the brand of the tail rotor you put in?
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