HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Jan 27, 2013, 07:03 PM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
I went out for another quad test. I had to bring the motor setting to 10. I forget what it's called, but it's the one that keeps the motors running at that amount after you give it throttle. I also changed to slow fly props which I'm liking and I also added LED's under it straight to the power. Now the problem I noticed which I had not gotten before was that in flight, it seemed that either two of the motors or all of them sort of lost power for a second or two which kept the quad sinking for a moment so I had to keep giving it throttle. Even during a hover I noticed this. Would adding the LED's which are 12 volts take that much juice out of the battery or is there something else I need to check? My settings are pretty much stock as they seem to be working fine on this 450. I'm using version 1.4. In any case it managed to flip itself on one of those right into the ground. Nothing broken and it was fairly low but I just had to clean up all the dirt and a bit of mud from the connectors as the ground is wet from the rain. So this one of the next tasks I need to solve to protect things a bit more. I just remembered I also used the parallel cable adapter on this test. I don't think this one should matter though as it's fairly short too. Here's the video of what happened...from the quads view.
Quad test with LED's and SF props (4 min 14 sec)
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by efx; Jan 27, 2013 at 08:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Jan 27, 2013, 09:31 PM
Registered User
Joined Sep 2011
40 Posts
home bru

Pix's of my FVP Quad setup, test flights. DIY Inverted Vee Antenna for FPV - 900MHz. Name: IMG_9161s.jpg
Views: 79
Size: 97.3 KB
Description:

Name: IMG_9162s.jpg
Views: 68
Size: 67.2 KB
Description: Waiting on my video glasses.
Trauma50 is offline Find More Posts by Trauma50
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 27, 2013, 10:46 PM
Specializing in RC since 1972
Temple, GA, USA
Joined Jun 2009
3,135 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by efx View Post
I went out for another quad test. I had to bring the motor setting to 10. I forget what it's called, but it's the one that keeps the motors running at that amount after you give it throttle. I also changed to slow fly props which I'm liking and I also added LED's under it straight to the power. Now the problem I noticed which I had not gotten before was that in flight, it seemed that either two of the motors or all of them sort of lost power for a second or two which kept the quad sinking for a moment so I had to keep giving it throttle. Even during a hover I noticed this. Would adding the LED's which are 12 volts take that much juice out of the battery or is there something else I need to check? My settings are pretty much stock as they seem to be working fine on this 450. I'm using version 1.4. In any case it managed to flip itself on one of those right into the ground. Nothing broken and it was fairly low but I just had to clean up all the dirt and a bit of mud from the connectors as the ground is wet from the rain. So this one of the next tasks I need to solve to protect things a bit more. I just remembered I also used the parallel cable adapter on this test. I don't think this one should matter though as it's fairly short too. Here's the video of what happened...from the quads view.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxCZZ9IoFiM
LED's take almost zero power.

A wet board might cause it. Has it happened when you know the board was dry?

Do you hear any oscillation in the motors? Like from too high a gain somewhere?

Too high of "I" gain might cause it. Increase it a little more and see if it is worse. Decrease it a little and see if you an get rid of it.

I can imagine a high yaw gain might do it.

Extending the length of the wires from battery to ESC can cause transmission line effects (power noise) that is generally fixed by adding high current capacitors to the extension. Try running a single battery without the Y to see if it makes the problem go away.

I generally find that making a problem happen more is easier to see than making it happen less (short of crashing a copter of course).
theothercliff is offline Find More Posts by theothercliff
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 27, 2013, 10:57 PM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
I should correct myself the floor was damp. Only the wires got some dirt, the board was dry before and after so not a water problem yet. The motors seem to be fine, just instant loss for a moment and then it would be fine again. My yaw is actually pretty slow, well I lowered it again to make the videos smoother. I have been running only one battery, haven't had a chance to try to, but I will try it without the adapter and see if that helps. On the video I was the one moving fast from side to side and front to back, but once I slow down to stop it, that's when it just flipped over on me. Should I need to worry about the built in bec? Just wondering as the manual mentioned that, but it was working fine as you saw on the first videos. I may have to try the other I settings as you mentioned. I just didn't want to start messing with those until I can at least get a feeling for how it "normally" is supposed to work. I hope it's just the adapter as that's the only thing I can think of that I actually added into the mix.

Quote:
Originally Posted by theothercliff View Post
LED's take almost zero power.

A wet board might cause it. Has it happened when you know the board was dry?

Do you hear any oscillation in the motors? Like from too high a gain somewhere?

Too high of "I" gain might cause it. Increase it a little more and see if it is worse. Decrease it a little and see if you an get rid of it.

I can imagine a high yaw gain might do it.

Extending the length of the wires from battery to ESC can cause transmission line effects (power noise) that is generally fixed by adding high current capacitors to the extension. Try running a single battery without the Y to see if it makes the problem go away.

I generally find that making a problem happen more is easier to see than making it happen less (short of crashing a copter of course).
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Malware?
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 12:53 AM
Registered User
Son, Norway
Joined Sep 2004
3,290 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by efx View Post
Now the problem I noticed which I had not gotten before was that in flight, it seemed that either two of the motors or all of them sort of lost power for a second or two which kept the quad sinking for a moment so I had to keep giving it throttle.
Which ESCs do you have? Could the problems be related to the black sheep?
Did you measure current with the slowly props?

Fred
flarssen is offline Find More Posts by flarssen
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 12:56 AM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
I'm using these esc's. No haven't measure anything with them. Since I tried with the others last time and you know what happened, I don't want to add the wattmeter with them on. Well at least not yet until I test without the adapter just to see what happens. As long as the board is not starting up on it's own I'm fine. I have another question now that this was brought up with the length of wires. How long do you guys make your power wires to these boards and would it really matter if I go a tad longer just to reach around like you see on the pictures. I think I went to 5 or 6 inches otherwise I can't really move them around. Just looked at the specs and found they use a linear bec so I don't need to cut any wires on these esc's.
http://www.targethobby.com/hobbywing...p-4162002.html

I just took the props off and tried esc throttle calibration. I read some of these need this, I don't know if this works with the board on, but I did that and also recalibrated the esc's just to be sure. Duh, it looks like esc calibration is the same thing...either way I did that again and only get the throttle pass-through so I'm assuming it works after the beeps as all motors start at the same time on low and high. I get about 4amps at mid stick and about 50 watts. 4.52 or something like this on high and just under 60 amps, with the adapter on it so it doesn't look like that's affecting it at the moment without the props of course. Well I just thought I do that again just to make sure the board is working correctly.

Each esc setting is...brake - off, batt type -li-xx, cut off - soft cut, cut off voltage - med, start mode - very soft, timing - middle, music - none, gov - off.
Quote:
Originally Posted by flarssen View Post
Which ESCs do you have? Could the problems be related to the black sheep?
Did you measure current with the slowly props?

Fred
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by efx; Jan 28, 2013 at 02:04 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 01:07 AM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
I got some parts for another quad donated. I just finished putting this together now and it just needs some motors and board to go with it which obviously I don't have. Okay I got a little board which is just some funky name. I don't know what some of these companies use to solder but man, sometimes you just can't get that stuff melted no matter what. Either way this one took a little less to put together, it may have gone a bit faster had I've been able to solder the esc's. Wondering what kv motors to use with this on the 40amp escs...
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by efx; Jan 28, 2013 at 01:35 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:05 AM
Registered User
Son, Norway
Joined Sep 2004
3,290 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by efx View Post
The black one, also?

Quote:
Originally Posted by efx View Post
How long do you guys make your power wires to these boards and would it really matter if I go a tad longer just to reach around like you see on the pictures. I think I went to 5 or 6 inches otherwise I can't really move them around.
Hard to say. It depends on the capability of the capacitors used in the ESC. But if you add the battery wire, powerboard tracks, ESC wire, Y-harness and power meter, you might be stretching the limit.

Fred
flarssen is offline Find More Posts by flarssen
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:11 AM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
Sorry, the black esc's are also hobbywing skywalkers, but haven't tested those yet, I only made one change on those and that is the timing is low. I want to test that on them once I get motors. The yellow esc's are on the currently running quad. Not sure what kv I should use on the second quad yet.

Okay, that makes sense even though it seems like a small quad, but I'll take that off and try again now that I also reset the esc's too. Thanks, will update once I get that tested so hopefully no one else runs into the same problem.

I should mention that the slow fly props do give me better video, less shaking and I also put a piece of double sided tape behind the camera to aim it down a bit so it doesn't pick up the props. So it's looking pretty good for the simple set up. Or maybe it was just the little piece of tape that separated the camera from the bottom plate a bit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by flarssen View Post
The black one, also?


Hard to say. It depends on the capability of the capacitors used in the ESC. But if you add the battery wire, powerboard tracks, ESC wire, Y-harness and power meter, you might be stretching the limit.

Fred
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Malware?
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:17 AM
Registered User
New Zealand, Canterbury, Christchurch
Joined Dec 2012
1,419 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by efx View Post
I got some parts for another quad donated. I just finished putting this together now and it just needs some motors and board to go with it which obviously I don't have. Okay I got a little board which is just some funky name. I don't know what some of these companies use to solder but man, sometimes you just can't get that stuff melted no matter what. Either way this one took a little less to put together, it may have gone a bit faster had I've been able to solder the esc's. Wondering what kv motors to use with this on the 40amp escs...
Wow, 40A are huge on that frame, anything in the 1000kv range will work fine on that, 9x4.5 props. 20A ESC's would probably be fine to run the motors you'd usually put on that frame
WendoNZ is offline Find More Posts by WendoNZ
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:27 AM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
Thanks. They were a donation and yes they are a bit longer than the 30amps but not too bad actually so this is the reason I'm using them since I don't have anything else. I really don't want to go with larger props. The 8x4 seem long enough to catch me so I was thinking of staying the same or going with smaller props and higher kv. I rather give myself more room where I put my hands. I just don't like having props that close to me now that I had my mishap. But maybe just stay with the 8x4 as they seem to be working okay. The lower kv may give me longer runs though, so it's my dilemma now. No rush as I have one running now.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WendoNZ View Post
Wow, 40A are huge on that frame, anything in the 1000kv range will work fine on that, 9x4.5 props. 20A ESC's would probably be fine to run the motors you'd usually put on that frame
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by efx; Jan 28, 2013 at 03:02 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:36 AM
Registered User
Joined Jun 2011
365 Posts
thank you Seebodener.

i sold my (3rd) KK2 quad yesterday and i think i'll be moving back to multiwii because it is cheaper than KK2 and it comes with an external LCD and one can upgrade it with $26 GPS.

On all my KK2 boards i had some LCD quality check issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seebodener View Post
AUX switch to control SL is disabled in new SW from Steveis.
SL is either always on or always off. While arming the Quad you hold the Roll-Stick to the right = SL will be on or off for the flight.




I am afraid that is not possible, cause the new SW isnīt using the CamStab-Settings from the orig. Ver 1.5.
The old Ver 1.5 gave each axis a reference point from which it calculatetd the deflection when the gimbal was tilted. The offset was permanently dialed into the KK2 board.

In Steveis new Ver it is now possible to dial in your own offset via TX and make this the new reference point which will be stabilised further on until you change it again manually via TX.

So what you want to have accomplished can (perhaps) be done via TX programming if you play a little with the possibilities of your TX.

I made a little demo vid with new Steveis SW to show how (very good) it works.


You can find my settings in this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post23903473
oyibox is offline Find More Posts by oyibox
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:44 AM
efx
Rookie in training, heads up
efx's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Mar 2010
3,208 Posts
oyibox, what board are you referring to? I got a tiny board that's supposed to be multiwii, but they seem to need a bunch of code to run them from the user.
efx is offline Find More Posts by efx
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Malware?
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 02:58 AM
safer on the ground
teccer1234's Avatar
wilts, United Kingdom
Joined Jul 2006
717 Posts
flash to 1v4

I'm going to update my KK2 1v2 to 1v4 as soon as my programmer arrives, my question is, I've got two laptops one is 32 bit system the other is 64 bit system, will it make any difference which laptop I use to flash with?

I hope to use Ron Lampman's info to flash with.

meanwhile this is my first flight in almost darkness showing how helpful the leds are.

night/evening flight on a beach in Spain (5 min 40 sec)


ray
teccer1234 is offline Find More Posts by teccer1234
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 28, 2013, 03:24 AM
Registered User
Joined May 2010
141 Posts
Is it possible to arm the KK2.0 card with V1.5 software, without any receiver connected? I would like to test this as a standalone gimbal controller..

Thanks!
Trulsen is offline Find More Posts by Trulsen
Reply With Quote