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Old Jan 26, 2013, 11:10 PM
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DYI Frame with KK2

Spider Quad KK2 4th flight (2 min 31 sec)
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Old Jan 26, 2013, 11:31 PM
iMultirotors
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Australia, NSW, Shellharbour
Joined Aug 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freakazoid View Post
Ive been trying to figure this out using the videos but I just cant get it right..
I just cant seem to see the difference between having P too high and having I too high.
Maybe its because of the size of this copter though..



What are good starter PI values for a small tricopter like this one?
I get P values around 15 where it barely becomes flyable, but that just seems too low.
I think I need to do something with I gains to get the wiggle out?
Could be the props your using??
I tried the same props on one of my quads and it was unflyable. They made it rock violently.
I put the SF props back on and it flies perfect.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 12:59 AM
Specializing in RC since 1972
Temple, GA, USA
Joined Jun 2009
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Originally Posted by Akcopter View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akcopter View Post
Thanks
I will try that cliff...
And It works Awesome .. .Thank you cliff.
...
It was the I term indeed which helped me stabilize the yaw.
Thanks for the update and compliment. Getting a thank you is a big part of why we do this. Glad it worked.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 01:14 AM
Specializing in RC since 1972
Temple, GA, USA
Joined Jun 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freakazoid View Post
Ive been trying to figure this out using the videos but I just cant get it right..
I just cant seem to see the difference between having P too high and having I too high.
Maybe its because of the size of this copter though..



What are good starter PI values for a small tricopter like this one?
I get P values around 15 where it barely becomes flyable, but that just seems too low.
I think I need to do something with I gains to get the wiggle out?
Is there a tilt servo on that bottom motor?

Self level is broken in v1.2, update to v1.5 if you intend to use self level.

The recommended way to tune is to turn self level off and set (roll and pitch) I gain to 0, then tune (roll and pitch) P gain up till oscillation then back off P (could try half as much), then tune (roll and pitch) "I" gain up till oscillation and back it off. Turn self level on and trim it for level flight with the self level menu ACC trims. Do not adjust transmitter trims with self level turned on because that will just mess up the trim with self level turned off. Adjust self level gain to suit your preferences. Self level gain does not have to be a high number.

Read the wikipedia PID controller article to gain insight into what, how, and why.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 04:12 AM
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http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post23894151

steveis said Roll is on Aux channel but i have SL switch on Aux...

is this doable on my one axis gimbal:

manual pitch on M6; stabilized pitch on M8; Aux channel to on and off self level

any help?
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 06:29 AM
Stop me before I build again!
United States, NY, Albany
Joined Sep 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freakazoid View Post
What are good starter PI values for a small tricopter like this one?
I get P values around 15 where it barely becomes flyable, but that just seems too low.
I think I need to do something with I gains to get the wiggle out?
The props might be something here. I was having nothing but trouble with my mini octo until I balanced the props ( now they have more tape than prop it appears ). Even just handholding the model and spooling up to hover would cause it to react weird and I noticed that the safe screen was showing bizarre angles. Balancing the props has made a huge difference.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 07:47 AM
Supersonic Engineering
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UK, Greater London, Uxbridge
Joined Mar 2001
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Brontide - Thanks - what you're working on sounds to be just what I'm looking for! I'll await a suitable announcement.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 09:46 AM
* fly fast - live slow *
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Seeboden in Austria
Joined Dec 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oyibox View Post
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post23894151

steveis said Roll is on Aux channel but i have SL switch on Aux...
...
AUX switch to control SL is disabled in new SW from Steveis.
SL is either always on or always off. While arming the Quad you hold the Roll-Stick to the right = SL will be on or off for the flight.


Quote:
Originally Posted by oyibox View Post
...
is this doable on my one axis gimbal:

manual pitch on M6; stabilized pitch on M8; Aux channel to on and off self level

any help?
I am afraid that is not possible, cause the new SW isnīt using the CamStab-Settings from the orig. Ver 1.5.
The old Ver 1.5 gave each axis a reference point from which it calculatetd the deflection when the gimbal was tilted. The offset was permanently dialed into the KK2 board.

In Steveis new Ver it is now possible to dial in your own offset via TX and make this the new reference point which will be stabilised further on until you change it again manually via TX.

So what you want to have accomplished can (perhaps) be done via TX programming if you play a little with the possibilities of your TX.

I made a little demo vid with new Steveis SW to show how (very good) it works.


You can find my settings in this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post23903473
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 10:20 AM
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Roosendaal, Netherlands
Joined Dec 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theothercliff View Post
Is there a tilt servo on that bottom motor?

Self level is broken in v1.2, update to v1.5 if you intend to use self level.

The recommended way to tune is to turn self level off and set (roll and pitch) I gain to 0, then tune (roll and pitch) P gain up till oscillation then back off P (could try half as much), then tune (roll and pitch) "I" gain up till oscillation and back it off. Turn self level on and trim it for level flight with the self level menu ACC trims. Do not adjust transmitter trims with self level turned on because that will just mess up the trim with self level turned off. Adjust self level gain to suit your preferences. Self level gain does not have to be a high number.

Read the wikipedia PID controller article to gain insight into what, how, and why.
Ive got 1.5 on it, first thing I did.

I did turn off I gains, but even at P 25 the tri already starts shaking violently.
Is this to be expected? The guy in the video was talking about 150...
Self level, thats the same as autolevel right? The one you toggle with an aux channel?
Saw something about height dampening but id rather not have that yet.
Id like it to fly like an old KKuk first.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 11:00 AM
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United States, MI, Traverse City
Joined Jan 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faccan View Post
DonnyV, excellent video.

Very kind of you in give us the PI settings.

It would be great if you could tell us the the KV of the motors, the propellers size, the distances between motors and the AUW....

Thank you very much in advance.
Faccan! No problem bud.. The motors are kda 20-50s 1088kv and the props are 8045, and the distances from motor to motor is 15 inches! I didn't weigh it yet,but its fairly light! I hope that helps!
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 12:28 PM
Specializing in RC since 1972
Temple, GA, USA
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Originally Posted by Freakazoid View Post
Ive got 1.5 on it, first thing I did.

I did turn off I gains, but even at P 25 the tri already starts shaking violently.
Is this to be expected? The guy in the video was talking about 150...
Self level, thats the same as autolevel right? The one you toggle with an aux channel?
Saw something about height dampening but id rather not have that yet.
Id like it to fly like an old KKuk first.
I presume auto-level == self-level. It is called self-level in the KK2 menu (at least in the v1.2 firmware where it is broken). Self-level is where the copter levels back out when you let go of the stick. With self-level on you directly control the bank angle and when you let go of the sticks, it levels out because the stick is centered. WIth self-level off, you directly control the roll rate and it stops rolling and stays at whatever angle it had when you let go of the sticks.

You are probably running stock ESC's?

Neither of these P gain numbers sound out of the park if that is the difference.

I understand that a big copter can stand higher gains too, so a big copter with flashed ESC's vs a small copter with stock ESC's...
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 12:52 PM
HeliHarry
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United States, OK, Tulsa
Joined Dec 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akcopter View Post
......so I decreased the yaw P gain and increased the Yaw I gain gradually...
I'm also having trouble getting my Yaw where I want it.
Would you post your before & after settings for your Yaw.
I know they probly won't be the same in my application,
but it will give me some food for thought.

TNX!
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 12:55 PM
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Roosendaal, Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theothercliff View Post
I presume auto-level == self-level. It is called self-level in the KK2 menu (at least in the v1.2 firmware where it is broken). Self-level is where the copter levels back out when you let go of the stick. With self-level on you directly control the bank angle and when you let go of the sticks, it levels out because the stick is centered. WIth self-level off, you directly control the roll rate and it stops rolling and stays at whatever angle it had when you let go of the sticks.

You are probably running stock ESC's?

Neither of these P gain numbers sound out of the park if that is the difference.

I understand that a big copter can stand higher gains too, so a big copter with flashed ESC's vs a small copter with stock ESC's...
Heheh im used to calling it ACC mode. KK got into the whole accelerometer game only recently.

And yeah, stock firmware on the escs, they're too small for me to flash.
What I did was turn I gain and P gain to zero, then raise P gain until it gets manageable.
That's pretty much where I stranded. It either flies lazy and drunk, or spastic and nervous.
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 01:14 PM
Flying Wood For Fun
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Canada, ON, Sydenham
Joined Jan 2012
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does anyone have one on a HT-FPV frame running this code?
Just wondering what to expect when my KK comes in
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Old Jan 27, 2013, 05:02 PM
AVR Dude
United Kingdom, England, Cnwll
Joined Jul 2011
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Originally Posted by GordonTarling View Post
Jorg - thanks for taking the time to explain that - helps a lot. If you're using the Steveis firmware, it seems to only support a quad - I'm flying a hexa, so I don't think it will work.
Are you using CPPM?
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