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Old Jul 12, 2012, 04:02 PM
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United States, TX, Richmond
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Originally Posted by rizky_p View Post
Could anyone help to elaborate what is he mean by that? Something wrong with DJI Nylon arms?
Because the arms are nylon and not rigid, the arms can twist which therefore makes the motors tilt which then throws stability out the window. Now, if you are flying around agressively and are really good with flying, like warthog, you may not care because the quad is always moving and skills can compensate for the instability. BUT, if you are like me who wants to keep the quad very stable and steady for fpv, the stability will be hard to achieve. Yaw control is a known issue as well. This is why TC (timecop) will not support the frame for his Naze32 controller board. There are a few other users that have expressed the same opinion.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by rcjose View Post
Because the arms are nylon and not rigid, the arms can twist which therefore makes the motors tilt which then throws stability out the window. Now, if you are flying around agressively and are really good with flying, like warthog, you may not care because the quad is always moving and skills can compensate for the instability. BUT, if you are like me who wants to keep the quad very stable and steady for fpv, the stability will be hard to achieve. Yaw control is a known issue as well. This is why TC (timecop) will not support the frame for his Naze32 controller board. There are a few other users that have expressed the same opinion.


LOL.. This is pretty much BS. The DJI frame is actually very rigid and plenty strong enough for almost everybody. The propellers er alot softer than the frame unless you are using carbon props. You can have a really good frame for a solid hover with this frame.

If you want you can turn the DJI550 frame into a Y6 and have a good frame for that setup also. I am more happy with the DJI frames than with the MK Okto XL frame!
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 05:19 PM
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Carmichael, CA
Joined Feb 2007
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Originally Posted by Trulsen View Post
LOL.. This is pretty much BS. The DJI frame is actually very rigid and plenty strong enough for almost everybody. The propellers er alot softer than the frame unless you are using carbon props. You can have a really good frame for a solid hover with this frame.

If you want you can turn the DJI550 frame into a Y6 and have a good frame for that setup also. I am more happy with the DJI frames than with the MK Okto XL frame!
+1... I've setup DJI-FW450's with an ArduPilotMega2 and a Gaui FC. Both are solid flyers that are more than capable of a spot on hover (the Gaui FC requires a better pilot of course). The one with the Gaui brain has also taken several very hard crashes... no damage and still flies like new.

All this is with genuine DJI arms. I haven't been able to compare them to the knock offs HK is selling.

Cheers,
Kev
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 05:21 PM
DJI SUPPORT / TESTING
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United States, CA, Big Bear
Joined Jan 2006
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Originally Posted by rcjose View Post
Because the arms are nylon and not rigid, the arms can twist which therefore makes the motors tilt which then throws stability out the window. Now, if you are flying around agressively and are really good with flying, like warthog, you may not care because the quad is always moving and skills can compensate for the instability. BUT, if you are like me who wants to keep the quad very stable and steady for fpv, the stability will be hard to achieve. Yaw control is a known issue as well. This is why TC (timecop) will not support the frame for his Naze32 controller board. There are a few other users that have expressed the same opinion.
1 word "bull"

I guess all the stable videos taken on f450 and f550 frames are faked TC is anti DJI, that is why he puts that on for his NAZE32 page. If his board does have issues with DJI frames then it's a design flaw in the board since I have tried other Wii boards on DJI frames and they work just fine!
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 05:42 PM
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Australia, ACT, Canberra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcjose View Post
Because the arms are nylon and not rigid, the arms can twist which therefore makes the motors tilt which then throws stability out the window. Now, if you are flying around agressively and are really good with flying, like warthog, you may not care because the quad is always moving and skills can compensate for the instability. BUT, if you are like me who wants to keep the quad very stable and steady for fpv, the stability will be hard to achieve. Yaw control is a known issue as well. This is why TC (timecop) will not support the frame for his Naze32 controller board. There are a few other users that have expressed the same opinion.
Someone forgot to tell these guys as well....Discovery quadcopter!

http://team-blacksheep.com/shop
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by rizky_p View Post
I already tried lowering P-gain as low as 10 and the wobble persist and at the same time it is hard to control
Any success?
Have you seen my video? Does it look like your problem with the wobbles?
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Trulsen View Post
LOL.. This is pretty much BS. The DJI frame is actually very rigid and plenty strong enough for almost everybody. The propellers er alot softer than the frame unless you are using carbon props. You can have a really good frame for a solid hover with this frame.

If you want you can turn the DJI550 frame into a Y6 and have a good frame for that setup also. I am more happy with the DJI frames than with the MK Okto XL frame!
Why would it twist? There are a lot softer frames than that. The only time you are going to have a force in a direction that might cause a twist, is when you are not trying to be stable! I think that's a silly argument. That said, I also think DJI are a rip-off compared to what else is out there, especially when you can get clones of their frames for a fraction of the price from many places on the Internet.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 06:30 PM
DJI SUPPORT / TESTING
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United States, CA, Big Bear
Joined Jan 2006
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$45 for a DJI f550 and $34 for a FS450, imho that's not very much! Why would you want a clone at those prices?
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 06:59 PM
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Your thoughts please...

I'm new to this KK stuff but not new to MR, I have a HK Integrated PCB Plug and Play Micro Quad on it's way and also a KK2 LCD FC for mainly indoor nights etc. So the question is should I rip out the original board on the micro and install the KK2 because it's that much better? if so does anyone have some good start off gains for the HK micro.

Thanks
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by blade strike View Post
$45 for a DJI f550 and $34 for a FS450, imho that's not very much! Why would you want a clone at those prices?
Because an FS450 clone is only $11.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yammysho View Post
I'm new to this KK stuff but not new to MR, I have a HK Integrated PCB Plug and Play Micro Quad on it's way and also a KK2 LCD FC for mainly indoor nights etc. So the question is should I rip out the original board on the micro and install the KK2 because it's that much better? if so does anyone have some good start off gains for the HK micro.
Yeah, the KK2 board is better than the one on the Plug and Play Micro Quad, it's should be a really easy swap out. The starting P gain I use is 30 on roll and pitch for that frame.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 08:03 PM
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Yeah, the KK2 board is better than the one on the Plug and Play Micro Quad, it's should be a really easy swap out. The starting P gain I use is 30 on roll and pitch for that frame.[/QUOTE]

OK thanks, will do.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 08:39 PM
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United States, IN, Kokomo
Joined May 2008
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There ARE differences in controllers. A KK1 board is very different in sensitivity than a multiwii. So maybe there is a difference in TC's Afro32 and a Naza or DJI stuff.I guess it's all speculation until one of you DJI lovers try a Naze 32 on their DJI 450.
I saw a video of a 9 year old kid twisting a DJI frame with his bare hands, so don't ell me that DJI frames are stiff.
My 450 clone is very stiff. Made out of different stuff I guess.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 08:59 PM
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I have owned both the knock off and original DJI. The build quality doesn't compare. The original DJI is far more rugged. Worth every penny.

Best,
Chris
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 09:12 PM
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Australia, QLD, Brisbane
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Originally Posted by Phalanx-0 View Post
There ARE differences in controllers. A KK1 board is very different in sensitivity than a multiwii. So maybe there is a difference in TC's Afro32 and a Naza or DJI stuff.I guess it's all speculation until one of you DJI lovers try a Naze 32 on their DJI 450.
I saw a video of a 9 year old kid twisting a DJI frame with his bare hands, so don't ell me that DJI frames are stiff.
My 450 clone is very stiff. Made out of different stuff I guess.
As I mentioned above, although a frame arm can twist, it doesn't mean it's going to be exposed to a force in a direction to make it twist. The Bambucopter frame flies great with MultiWii, yet they are made of polycabonate which is easy to twist. A frame arm that bends is more likely to cause a problem than one that can twist, because bending force is common on a quad, twist is not. Faster controllers like the KK2 will notice micro oscillations cause by up and down bending movement of a frame arm, but they are going to be pretty low frequency and easy to handle compared to say motor and prop vibrations.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Erknie View Post
As I mentioned above, although a frame arm can twist, it doesn't mean it's going to be exposed to a force in a direction to make it twist. The Bambucopter frame flies great with MultiWii, yet they are made of polycabonate which is easy to twist. A frame arm that bends is more likely to cause a problem than one that can twist, because bending force is common on a quad, twist is not. Faster controllers like the KK2 will notice micro oscillations cause by up and down bending movement of a frame arm, but they are going to be pretty low frequency and easy to handle compared to say motor and prop vibrations.
Flexing is an obvious one, as the pull of the motors induce bending of the arms in some frames. Flexing alone does not seem to cause too many issues, as "smooth"twisting. Twisting and flexing causes problems more so in the way it is NOT smooth, and generates/results in, vibrations. The twisting effect would come about from translation of motor torque and or balance issues in motor and or propeller (perfect balance being near impossible). It seems to be true that some frames have poor torsion rigidity.
(cringe in the corner and wait to be shot down ....)
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