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Old Sep 27, 2012, 08:43 PM
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Joined May 2006
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well basically the gyro is designed to cater many different fliers.. so it depends on how you like the gyro to be setup.. some like it to be soft.. some wants it fast for easy change in 3D. It depends on the flier. so basically the gyro is designed to be adjustable. This is the problem...since its programmable it becomes more harder for a newbie flier to setup. and if the setup is not good then the flying experience will be a disaster.

The small helis with the built in gyros were factory tuned.. and is most likely setup for new fliers. This will cater the hovering and Flyout stages.. but once you move in to harder flights (sport /3D) then you will have to upgrade it to the next level of 3D helicopters.

don't get me wrong.. FBL heli are really stable if its setup correctly. and the helis mechanicals are clean correct and within the parameters of the gyro. Once you get the setup at its best. FBL is far stable than FB in hovering as the gyro really works wonders.. but it is setup incorrectly then it will be a living nightmare..

to tell you frankly i too am having a really hard time making parameters work on these gyros.. its always a trial and error on every heli I have built. Although they are both the same model helis the parameters do have slight differences. SO it just shows that no 2 helis are a like,.

but once you get the parameters dialed in and have done fine tuning, most likely you will not do any changes anymore.. just fly fly and fly...

here is a sample i built last weekend.. I got hold of the CX250FBL heli and got it built over night. took me a hour or so of adjusting the gyro as it did not take the 450 parameters in it.. it really had to make changes on the PID settings were in its more of an internal programming change... and not a preset one.. but once it was dialed in.. the heli was stable and better than my FB one...

Copter X 250 FBL test hover (3 min 33 sec)



Quote:
Originally Posted by kidlat View Post
Thanks soneebee. How come pre setup FBL helis like mcpx fly so well? Why can't FBL gyros be set up as perfectly?
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Old Sep 30, 2012, 01:36 PM
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Salinas, CA
Joined Dec 2007
485 Posts
I'm dealing with a vibration issue on my v4 heli during hover.
Found the torque tube drive gear failed. I have no idea how this happen -- probably a bind somewhere. The heli was hovering great then a nasty vibration and safetly landed.
Also found the tail rotor holder very stiff. removed and the larger bearing is bad on one of the holders. tried to pop it out but it completely came apart and now I can't get the outer bearing ring out from the housing.
Then the tail rotor shaft gear when completely assembled has about a 1mm play. Add to it the torque tube bearing ring (the washer that holds the bearing in place) came loose. I did apply a small amount of CA but i guess it wasn't enough. The torque tube rod was also bent.
I thing I'm just going to buy a complete Align tail assembly and tail boom mount.
I should have gotten a drive belt version! Well a trip to the LHS this week is needed! Back to watching Fineless assembly videos.
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 06:52 AM
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United States, NE, North Platte
Joined May 2012
149 Posts
Black Angel

Hey everyone,

I finished the CX450 BA build last week. Since I have a Devo 10 I just got the 2702v-d rx. The 2702 is a rx and gyro for the Devo. I had no problems setting it up. It flies super stable. Sonnebee was correct the parts on the BA are superior. Here are a few pics.

https://plus.google.com/app/plus/mp/679/?source=mog&gl=us#~loopid=112698719433116130939& alid=5794089998874587409&phid=5794089998663060194& view=photo

https://plus.google.com/app/plus/mp/679/?source=mog&gl=us#~loopid=112698719433116130939& alid=5794090112635530817&phid=5794090113078558306& view=photo
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 11:09 PM
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Salinas, CA
Joined Dec 2007
485 Posts
Finally a successfull hover!!
The heli has a lot less vibration then my tune B400! Oh man the heli is very responsive compare to the B400. I think I'm going to enjoy this bird. She still need fine tuning before I take her out on the field this weekend. The tail holds pretty good - still needs some tuning.
I replaced all the gears to Align. Also the tail blade grips was replaced with Align along with the torque tube.
I'm glad this heli is compatible with Align parts. The LHS stocks everything for Align.
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 11:24 PM
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looks like your heli is almost align.. just a few more parts and it will be an align heli
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 11:43 PM
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Salinas, CA
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soneebee View Post
looks like your heli is almost align.. just a few more parts and it will be an align heli
LOL! yeah just about. I spent about $100 on all the parts (LHS gave me a 15% discount for all the parts). The good thing I have spares - majority of the parts came with 2 spares. So I'm still about $250 ahead on this compare buying an Align.
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 11:47 PM
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United States, NY, New York
Joined Nov 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl449 View Post
I'm dealing with a vibration issue on my v4 heli during hover.
Found the torque tube drive gear failed. I have no idea how this happen -- probably a bind somewhere. The heli was hovering great then a nasty vibration and safetly landed.
Also found the tail rotor holder very stiff. removed and the larger bearing is bad on one of the holders. tried to pop it out but it completely came apart and now I can't get the outer bearing ring out from the housing.
Then the tail rotor shaft gear when completely assembled has about a 1mm play. Add to it the torque tube bearing ring (the washer that holds the bearing in place) came loose. I did apply a small amount of CA but i guess it wasn't enough. The torque tube rod was also bent.
I thing I'm just going to buy a complete Align tail assembly and tail boom mount.
I should have gotten a drive belt version! Well a trip to the LHS this week is needed! Back to watching Fineless assembly videos.
Is that a bushing they used to support that front torque tube drive gear?? Most kits use two bearings
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 12:37 AM
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Salinas, CA
Joined Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ridge_racer View Post
Is that a bushing they used to support that front torque tube drive gear?? Most kits use two bearings
It has 2 bearings inside the bushing (long umbrella gear). When I took it apart the bearings came off and didn't put them back when taking the pic - for the torque tube drive.
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Last edited by jl449; Oct 03, 2012 at 12:44 AM.
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 02:07 AM
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Joined May 2006
1,237 Posts
yup there is 2 roller bearing inside the aluminum housing.. unlike what align did was to embed the bearing on the plastic boom support holder. CPX made a housing for the bearing to have a better hold on the plastic boom holder housing. This made the holder more robust...
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 05:28 AM
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United States, NY, New York
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Cool...thx for the info guys.
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 03:09 PM
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United States, CA, Los Angeles
Joined Aug 2011
120 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by soneebee View Post
well basically the gyro is designed to cater many different fliers.. so it depends on how you like the gyro to be setup.. some like it to be soft.. some wants it fast for easy change in 3D. It depends on the flier. so basically the gyro is designed to be adjustable. This is the problem...since its programmable it becomes more harder for a newbie flier to setup. and if the setup is not good then the flying experience will be a disaster.

The small helis with the built in gyros were factory tuned.. and is most likely setup for new fliers. This will cater the hovering and Flyout stages.. but once you move in to harder flights (sport /3D) then you will have to upgrade it to the next level of 3D helicopters.

don't get me wrong.. FBL heli are really stable if its setup correctly. and the helis mechanicals are clean correct and within the parameters of the gyro. Once you get the setup at its best. FBL is far stable than FB in hovering as the gyro really works wonders.. but it is setup incorrectly then it will be a living nightmare..

to tell you frankly i too am having a really hard time making parameters work on these gyros.. its always a trial and error on every heli I have built. Although they are both the same model helis the parameters do have slight differences. SO it just shows that no 2 helis are a like,.

but once you get the parameters dialed in and have done fine tuning, most likely you will not do any changes anymore.. just fly fly and fly...

here is a sample i built last weekend.. I got hold of the CX250FBL heli and got it built over night. took me a hour or so of adjusting the gyro as it did not take the 450 parameters in it.. it really had to make changes on the PID settings were in its more of an internal programming change... and not a preset one.. but once it was dialed in.. the heli was stable and better than my FB one...
Thanks a lot! I think the smaller the heli the harder it gets to tweak. I dialed in my 450 and got it perfect the first try. Never had to tweak it again. My 250 is an absolute pain! Can you give me your exact 3X1000 and tx settings?
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Last edited by kidlat; Oct 03, 2012 at 05:21 PM.
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Old Oct 06, 2012, 04:05 PM
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Salinas, CA
Joined Dec 2007
485 Posts
Got the copterx v4 up and running and took the bird out today. Flew 5 packs.
Still had a wobble issue on the first pack but change the P gains to 63 and decreased RC dead band. That worked!! Did some sport flying and I definitely like it better than my B400. Very happy with this bird.
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Last edited by jl449; Oct 07, 2012 at 05:03 PM.
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 03:38 AM
asp
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Spain, CN, Villaverde
Joined Apr 2012
334 Posts
Well I was able to test hover my cx450v4 belt.
Fusonic tail servo 9257 metal geared... Burnt after 4 hovers.... Luckily I was able to land safely with no damages.
Waiting for a new tail servo... No fusonic this time.
Noticed the tail boom has a tendency to rotate clockwise while flying... Just 1-2 mm, any idea why or how to fix it?
A note for anyone looking forward to use a devo7 and rx802: set the swash plate to be normal on the devo7... Otherwise you won't be able to get correct swashplate movements.
I'll be back when I'll get more fligths and stories to tell...

cx450v4 (0 min 26 sec)
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Last edited by asp; Nov 05, 2012 at 03:55 AM.
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Old Nov 09, 2012, 12:55 PM
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Portugal, Lisboa, Cascais
Joined Sep 2012
506 Posts
Hi all

Just received my CopterX 450Pro V4 Flybarless Belt drive tail, and I took the tail assembly apart without much care and out of nowhere 2 shims appeared the shims are 1.9mm inner diameter and as I don't have a proper manual for this assembly (it's different from Trex SEv2 and from CopterX BA and 450SEv2 - no belt roller is one difference) does anyone have a reference for this tail assembly?

Also on tightening the 3 long bolts that have the long tubes is there any special precaution to have. I've noticed that if one tightens them too much the belt shaft gets stucked and offers lots of resistance.

TIA

luis
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Last edited by lvale; Nov 09, 2012 at 01:05 PM. Reason: sorry for the pic quality-phone camera
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 08:54 PM
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Joined May 2006
1,237 Posts
that sounds really bad... good thing i have not encountered this with the fusonics i got on my helis.. so far its holding OK.. i have 4 on a CX500 and it seems to be running fine so far..


Quote:
Originally Posted by asp View Post
Well I was able to test hover my cx450v4 belt.
Fusonic tail servo 9257 metal geared... Burnt after 4 hovers.... Luckily I was able to land safely with no damages.
Waiting for a new tail servo... No fusonic this time.
Noticed the tail boom has a tendency to rotate clockwise while flying... Just 1-2 mm, any idea why or how to fix it?
A note for anyone looking forward to use a devo7 and rx802: set the swash plate to be normal on the devo7... Otherwise you won't be able to get correct swashplate movements.
I'll be back when I'll get more fligths and stories to tell...
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