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Old Feb 06, 2013, 05:33 AM
Ready to fly MRs
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Swanton, OH
Joined Jul 2007
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FYI - Jeff at CNC Helicopter has the Tarot Octo in stock now. He ships damn near same hour and his support is awesome. Now you no longer have to wait for shipping from GLB or other overseas vendors if you are in the USA in interested in that frame.

http://www.cnchelicopter.com/servlet...AN-1000/Detail
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 08:56 AM
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Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLomas View Post
Oh, come on...
Do you really believe, that someone in China is making something different for some motors?
Those "Multistar ESC" in fact are rebranded KEDA ESC's, with crappy HW inside. Compared to, for example, F30A they're total <censored>.
Those "Multistar" motors - just rebranded Heng-Li motors (the same did foxtech with their motors line). Nothing really good - low magnets count, not so smooth, etc.

Wanna read more?
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1744742
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1744924
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1513678

And yes, i did tested many of those ESC's, motors by myself. So please, do not spread misinformation...
I have read through the post, they are full of people trolling (nothing new there) and people wanting to use the BEC off a ESC to power systems (anyone doing this is not worth listening too). Complaining about connecting SBECS in parallel etc is just ridiculous and just carrying on that F-30A’s are better (which I love the F-30A’s personally) without even owning one of the Multistars is again ridiculous.

None of the people making comments have actually hooked them up to any sort of testing equipment so they are all guessing, further to this it appears no-one put them into anything to get a proper comparison, I sorry but if you have to flash a ESC then technically it is crap (again love my flashed F-30A’s). The only [people that have appeared to have bought them are really happy.

In most of the threads TC has his posts remove as they were total and utter made up crap (he has never owner or used one). Everyone else making negative comments has not open one up and hooked it up to testing equipment or have a background in electrical engineering to make anything other than a dogmatic statement/post.

I’m not here to promote the Multistar ESC’s, I have not used them myself but I do know a few people using them and they are very happy with their performance, these were un-flashed non-BEC version and used them with Multistar motors and believe they are as good as flashed Simonk’s. I don’t think there is any evidence at all that these are not decent 400+hz ESC’s, rather than point me to post full of rubbish post from people who have no testing equipment (no offence intended towards you), is there a post that shows actual results from testing equipment or at least some footage of one placed next to another ESC with the same motors and run???

I don’t understand where the “low magnet count” comment comes from, they have as many or more than any other motor I am using for multirotors (have to have one for each pole)……have not seen anything suggesting these motors are crappy either. They seem nice and smooth the 4822’s I’ve seen running and really low current draw for the amount of thrust they were generating. I will admit they will never be as good as a $150 motor but at the same time most companies are selling them for double the cost of HK. Again I ask is there a “decent” post showing problems with the motors??

I’m an engineer so I want evidence not verbatim (please)
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 10:53 AM
g0t rabb1t?
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Lietuva, Vilnius
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redemptioner View Post
In most of the threads TC has his posts remove as they were total and utter made up crap (he has never owner or used one).
You're asking for numbers, but write something without any actual knowledge anyway as "fact".
How do you think some ppl have original FW from those ESC for example (incl. TC)?
And you do not need expensive testing equipment or waste your time just to say that ESC's aren't good, when you know what electronics components and basic schematics are used on ESC's. P/N (mixed) FET's sucks, except those cases when you really believe that they're created (OMG, magic here) specially for multistar motors with some incredible (NOT THE SAME) basic schematics, used on other ESC's...
Even more, if you believe that firmware on them has something special for multistar motors... Hey, why those ESC's are 1:1 (electronics/firmware, different only sticker and heatshrink color) with old selling KEDA ESC's (and they do not say anything about multistar).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Redemptioner View Post
have not seen anything suggesting these motors are crappy either. They seem nice and smooth the 4822’s I’ve seen running
Seems you used only few motors then...
Let's take example:
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo...1&productname=
- cheaper (incl shipping)
- more mag/poles
- simply better (smoother, etc - the same argument as you used)

And as i told before - yes, i have both. Those HL and rebranded HK motors aren't great (btw, sometimes they sucks even more - they have differences starting due to uneven magnet distribution) - they're NOT BAD, but not great.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redemptioner View Post
I’m an engineer so I want evidence not verbatim (please)
Sure, i didn't saw any technical argument, WHY those ESC's are good, WHY those motors are good, compared to others in the same price range. Only "i used them, they work OK". I didn't expect that from engineer, are you only trolling here?
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLomas View Post

Let's take example:
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo...1&productname=
- cheaper (incl shipping)
- more mag/poles
- simply better (smoother, etc - the same argument as you used)

And as i told before - yes, i have both. Those HL and rebranded HK motors aren't great (btw, sometimes they sucks even more - they have differences starting due to uneven magnet distribution) - they're NOT BAD, but not great.
I don't think those motors are a good substitute for the 420kv multistars. Show me a good low KV motor with quality components for less than 40 bucks. That clip really doesn't tell me much either; It's not even the same motor and how do you know that the start-up issue was due to the motors and not the ESC?
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 12:11 PM
g0t rabb1t?
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Lietuva, Vilnius
Joined Jul 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
I don't think those motors are a good substitute for the 420kv multistars. Show me a good low KV motor with quality components for less than 40 bucks.
Do you know what word "example" means?
How about checking other motors around in the same website (or in other websites), for example:
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo...8&productname=
Yes, it's NOT 420kV, it's 460kV. Did you tried to measure real kV rating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
That clip really doesn't tell me much either; It's not even the same motor and how do you know that the start-up issue was due to the motors and not the ESC?
Because ESC's are OK. If i change timing (recompile FW and reflash) this one will be OK, others will start badly...
Point is not to show that motors are bad - i did that video just to show how different motors are (you can fix that in many ways - remove sense filtering caps, change timing in FW, etc - but motors still different).
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 12:34 PM
Ready to fly MRs
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Swanton, OH
Joined Jul 2007
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I thought this thread was about clone frames?
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 12:53 PM
g0t rabb1t?
ABLomas's Avatar
Lietuva, Vilnius
Joined Jul 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid3ways View Post
I thought this thread was about clone frames?
Sorry, i should not reply to clear trolling (it's clear that those ppl have no technical background, got some items and they're BEST just because they bought them; and they will ignore all facts, other threads and opinions, just because they "cannot buy bad items").
So, won't reply to offtopic posts anymore ;-)
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Old Feb 06, 2013, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLomas View Post
Do you know what word "example" means?
How about checking other motors around in the same website (or in other websites), for example:
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo...8&productname=
Yes, it's NOT 420kV, it's 460kV. Did you tried to measure real kV rating?


Because ESC's are OK. If i change timing (recompile FW and reflash) this one will be OK, others will start badly...
Point is not to show that motors are bad - i did that video just to show how different motors are (you can fix that in many ways - remove sense filtering caps, change timing in FW, etc - but motors still different).
Thanks for the laugh. You come in here spouting some bull about the motors we supposedly bought. I haven't bought these motors and I never claimed they were the best. Very few have tried these because they have been out of stock till today. Your example? You post a link to completely different motors and then complain that I didn't search the rest of the site?? Then, after a series of ridiculous statements and slanders, you call us trolls?? What kind of world must you live in.

Thanks again for the comedy, immature little pricks make my day.

If you can't handle it when people don't take your irrationally formulated opinion as fact then it might be a good idea to stay off the internet.

Now how about those frames
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 03:27 AM
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Australia
Joined Dec 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLomas View Post
You're asking for numbers, but write something without any actual knowledge anyway as "fact".
How do you think some ppl have original FW from those ESC for example (incl. TC)?
And you do not need expensive testing equipment or waste your time just to say that ESC's aren't good, when you know what electronics components and basic schematics are used on ESC's. P/N (mixed) FET's sucks, except those cases when you really believe that they're created (OMG, magic here) specially for multistar motors with some incredible (NOT THE SAME) basic schematics, used on other ESC's...
Even more, if you believe that firmware on them has something special for multistar motors... Hey, why those ESC's are 1:1 (electronics/firmware, different only sticker and heatshrink color) with old selling KEDA ESC's (and they do not say anything about multistar).


Seems you used only few motors then...
Let's take example:
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo...1&productname=
- cheaper (incl shipping)
- more mag/poles
- simply better (smoother, etc - the same argument as you used)

And as i told before - yes, i have both. Those HL and rebranded HK motors aren't great (btw, sometimes they sucks even more - they have differences starting due to uneven magnet distribution) - they're NOT BAD, but not great.

Sure, i didn't saw any technical argument, WHY those ESC's are good, WHY those motors are good, compared to others in the same price range. Only "i used them, they work OK". I didn't expect that from engineer, are you only trolling here?
I don't own them but are considering buying some, I have only seen them in action on other peoples multicopters and they "seem" fine. I am just calling out the fact that you (and others) are saying they are not any good based on hearsay...

You can't go an say a ESC's is not running at a certain speed without some sort of facture information such as actual readings from testing equipment. TC's posts were removed due to him posting misleading information about a product he never owner or tested, he simply assumed and then made multiple posts and made it to sound like he tested them and the information he provide was fact when it was not. TC has helped a lot of people on the forum so I am not saying anything against him generally but he does occasionally add a post based on his "vibe" of the product and propagate it as fact.

The reason for talking about these motors as they are recommended by most of the frames retailers in this postings to be used with their frames (one of the HengLi repackaged variants ). The second I mention them the "haters" came out unfortunately and there just seems to be no real evidence to show that there is anything wrong with these motors especially considering the companies selling these frames are all using them and recommending them. The same way people came out can called these frames crap because they were not over $3k, which again was based on nothing as they never bought, never seen, never used one. They based the information they provided against the products on some pictures and other manufactures going "ours is the best so these can't be as good", “they are made in china so them must be poor quality” etc….

These, let’s call them “alternative”, frames seem to have a great wrap (talking about the carbon fibre ones) to date, I wonder if Frank from RCTimer could give us some more detailed pictures and info (actual weight etc) on their SM100 frame (http://rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goo...0&productname=). I am really keen on getting one and matching it with the CM301 gimbal but I am concerned over the listed 3KG weight. I love the idea of it being a solid clamp frame that is still easily broken down for transport (with a couple of extra plugs the arms could simply be removed without an alignment issue and put back on I would say in less than 10 mins), this is very appealing as they can be packed down into aluminium cases for transport in the car/plane when moving between job sites. I also could not seem to find any extra parts for them (really only chasing batteries and equipment trays).
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 03:29 AM
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Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid3ways View Post
FYI - Jeff at CNC Helicopter has the Tarot Octo in stock now. He ships damn near same hour and his support is awesome. Now you no longer have to wait for shipping from GLB or other overseas vendors if you are in the USA in interested in that frame.

http://www.cnchelicopter.com/servlet...AN-1000/Detail
Thanks Sid3ways, were not aware of these guys
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Old Feb 07, 2013, 04:55 AM
jab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLomas View Post
Oh, come on...
Do you really believe, that someone in China is making something different for some motors?
Those "Multistar ESC" in fact are rebranded KEDA ESC's, with crappy HW inside. Compared to, for example, F30A they're total <censored>.
Those "Multistar" motors - just rebranded Heng-Li motors (the same did foxtech with their motors line). Nothing really good - low magnets count, not so smooth, etc.

Wanna read more?
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1744742
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1744924
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1513678

And yes, i did tested many of those ESC's, motors by myself. So please, do not spread misinformation...
I agree about the ESC's just being copies of copies.
But have you actually used Heng-Li motors? I have and now I swear by them. Their pancake motor models, are just great. No slop what so ever and right up there with AXI when it comes to "smoothness". And as close to perfectly balanced from the factory that I have ever seen. You can see that they have actually balanced each and every motor individually by the epoxy spots they have added. Perhaps the re-branded HobbyKing, FoxTech etc. ones did not have the same quality assurance during manufacturing?
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Old Feb 15, 2013, 08:31 AM
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I'm using HL4822 490K + 15x5.5 + 4S 5000mah x 2 and 40A ESC simonk flashed, I have some 5S batteries 5000mah here, can I use these batteries with a 40A Blue Series ESC and 15x5.5 propellers?

Thanks
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Old Mar 03, 2013, 08:17 AM
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Another one to add to the list, it lists it as fitting 15inch props too with the motor center to motor center being 1050mm...
http://www.infinity-hobby.com/main/p...oducts_id=9465

I really like the idea of the motor mounts...
http://www.infinity-hobby.com/main/p...oducts_id=9418
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Old Mar 04, 2013, 01:11 AM
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Originally Posted by jab View Post
Did some more work today, very close to lift-off now. Just need to CNC some new battery trays, one for each side so that I can mount two batteries.
Jab, I take it from these images that you were able to fit a set of 15inch props on a Octo that has a wheel base of 950mm?
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Old Mar 04, 2013, 04:16 AM
jab
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Originally Posted by Redemptioner View Post
Jab, I take it from these images that you were able to fit a set of 15inch props on a Octo that has a wheel base of 950mm?
950mm? The Blackstar8 is about 1005mm with the arms fully extended.
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