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Old Oct 14, 2012, 07:46 PM
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United States, AZ, Lake Havasu City
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Update

Tail wheel rudder and elevator installed. AUW is 46.5 oz which is way over the prototype. Not too concerned with the power I have. With a 6x5.5 I am getting 300W settling down to 280+ which is 96.58 watts/lb which is good sport flying. I will prop it up until I get to the motors rated 350W which will then give it 120 watts/lb.

The wing area of the Pat is 458 sq in and my Super Pacer has a wing area of 400 and weighs over 3.3lbs and it flies really fast (not super sonic) and landing speeds are very reasonable. It is running about 400W.

Need to get a little hardware, install the ailerons, larger prop and it will be ready for its maiden flight.

SpadCat
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
Tail wheel rudder and elevator installed. AUW is 46.5 oz which is way over the prototype. Not too concerned with the power I have. With a 6x5.5 I am getting 300W settling down to 280+ which is 96.58 watts/lb which is good sport flying. I will prop it up until I get to the motors rated 350W which will then give it 120 watts/lb.

The wing area of the Pat is 458 sq in and my Super Pacer has a wing area of 400 and weighs over 3.3lbs and it flies really fast (not super sonic) and landing speeds are very reasonable. It is running about 400W.

Need to get a little hardware, install the ailerons, larger prop and it will be ready for its maiden flight.


SpadCat
Thanks for the numbers Lon, looking forward to the maiden flight!

Did you guys see the man jump for 128,000 ft! That was cool!
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by jetcaptain View Post
Thanks for the numbers Lon, looking forward to the maiden flight!

Did you guys see the man jump for 128,000 ft! That was cool!
No, I missed that...but will catch it on YouTube.

SpadCat
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 04:15 PM
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Ready to Fly!

Hey Jetcaptain,

To balance, the 2200 3s is now all the way forward to the #2 bulkhead , due to the addition of the tail wheel structure weight and slightly longer fuse at the tail end. I am thinking of installing a switch, this way I can preload the battery at home for at least the first flight, but that of course adds more weight. Depends on how well the Pat flies with it's present AUW.

What are your control throws? I am not concerned about the ailerons, but I am always concerned about the elevator, especially with a swept wing aircraft. I am using 75% expo to start out, this way I don't have to fiddle with dual rate switches.

It is back in the mid 90's here, so too warm to fly after work. Hopefully this Friday AM.

Wish me luck!

SpadCat
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
Hey Jetcaptain,

To balance, the 2200 3s is now all the way forward to the #2 bulkhead , due to the addition of the tail wheel structure weight and slightly longer fuse at the tail end. I am thinking of installing a switch, this way I can preload the battery at home for at least the first flight, but that of course adds more weight. Depends on how well the Pat flies with it's present AUW.

What are your control throws? I am not concerned about the ailerons, but I am always concerned about the elevator, especially with a swept wing aircraft. I am using 75% expo to start out, this way I don't have to fiddle with dual rate switches.

It is back in the mid 90's here, so too warm to fly after work. Hopefully this Friday AM.

Wish me luck!

SpadCat

I would make sure to set the ailerons to max throw. How many mm's of throw are you getting right now on the ailerons and elevator? I will measure my elevator throw when I get home from work and let you know. It was pitch sensitive with my current settings, but 75% expo should tame it down nicely.

I know it will fly well for you, can't wait to hear the flight report!
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 08:02 PM
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Aileron + - 20mm

Elevator + - 10mm
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
Aileron + - 20mm

Elevator + - 10mm
Just measured the elevator throw and it was 10mm as well. Should be good for a first flight! Mine is still in one piece.
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 06:54 PM
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Had two attempted flights with the Pat this morning. After a looong run, she finally struggled into the air. I reduced power and set her down, taxied back, changed battery packs (forgot my battery checker and wattage meter). Better power and after a not quite as long ground run she lifted off, but after a short distance in the air I decide to set her back down. Just did not feel comfortable making the crosswind turn. If I had the larger prop and the wattage meter, I would have checked it and if it had more wattage, would have tried again.

Not too disappointed, she was rock stable and did everything I wanted her to do in the two "Wright Bros." style of flights. Plus, she was absolutely beautiful on the ground and in the air. Taxiing was a delight, takeoff runs were straight and true with little rudder input...she makes a fine tail dragger ship.

So, tonight I will do some research and look for a larger motor. I wished I had another Skyshark Lightning .25 as it really launches the 3 1/3 lb balsa e-Super Pacer into the air. I have two of these motors, but the 2nd is buried in the nose of a vintage Tweety Birdy that is almost ready to fly.

SpadCat
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 10:24 PM
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United States, TX, Austin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
Had two attempted flights with the Pat this morning. After a looong run, she finally struggled into the air. I reduced power and set her down, taxied back, changed battery packs (forgot my battery checker and wattage meter). Better power and after a not quite as long ground run she lifted off, but after a short distance in the air I decide to set her back down. Just did not feel comfortable making the crosswind turn. If I had the larger prop and the wattage meter, I would have checked it and if it had more wattage, would have tried again.

Not too disappointed, she was rock stable and did everything I wanted her to do in the two "Wright Bros." style of flights. Plus, she was absolutely beautiful on the ground and in the air. Taxiing was a delight, takeoff runs were straight and true with little rudder input...she makes a fine tail dragger ship.

So, tonight I will do some research and look for a larger motor. I wished I had another Skyshark Lightning .25 as it really launches the 3 1/3 lb balsa e-Super Pacer into the air. I have two of these motors, but the 2nd is buried in the nose of a vintage Tweety Birdy that is almost ready to fly.

SpadCat
Way to go SpadCat! Even though it was WB style, still count's in my book. I am looking for a better motor as well. I am thinking something like the rimfire 35-30-1450 out-runner. With 3S and 9x6 prop, it should do the trick. What is the biggest prop you can put on with the gear?
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 10:50 PM
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With my set up, up to a 10 inch prop would have safe clearance and I made the gear legs fairly short.

I ordered another motor tonight. Is is rated for up to 420W with a 3s and up to 560W with a 4s. I do have one 4s 2200 that I can use that is very close to the overall dimensions of the 3s, just a little heavier.

SpadCat
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
With my set up, up to a 10 inch prop would have safe clearance and I made the gear legs fairly short.

I ordered another motor tonight. Is is rated for up to 420W with a 3s and up to 560W with a 4s. I do have one 4s 2200 that I can use that is very close to the overall dimensions of the 3s, just a little heavier.

SpadCat
Lon,

What is the motor you ordered? I found a motor at HK that I can use 4S with and a 7x6 prop. This would give 459 watts at 30 amps with a 99mph pitch speed. At least that's what the video review said.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=16234
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 11:54 PM
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That is funny!.....that is the motor I ordered! I checked out the Rimfire, and while it looks really good, it is rather pricey. I did pay around 60 bucks with motor mount for the first LIghtning. the 2nd one I got for only $20 because it was a closeout.


Edit: it is amazing they put so much time in for testing and yet it was only about $20 shipped!

SpadCat
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 05:01 PM
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Found The Power Problem

I took the e-Super Pacer and Regal Bipe out this morning to fly, and started the SPs take off run. The take off power seemed to be really sluggish, so I aborted, taxied back and tested the battery. All cell voltages were over 4.0, but I replaced it with another pack, and the take off power was normal. Flew both planes a couple of times then went home.

Afterwards, I was working on getting two of the Polaris 120s ready to fly off water with my son tomorrow morning, and put a pack in and and power tested it. All packs were slow charged overnight. I normally get 280 watts, but got only 180, so I took that pack out and put another one of the same brand in. These two packs were my newest ones and both are 30C, not the normal 20C I usually buy. Come to think of it, both these packs came from e-Bay recently and have never been flown. So guess what? Even after a full charge, both packs would only produce around 180Ws. I put one of my older packs in and power was 280Ws.

I knew I had calculated the required power correctly for the Pat, so yesterday, instead of getting 350Ws, I was probably getting only 250W which would be only about 90W lbs instead of the 130 I thought I was getting. And it was just bad luck that after my first aborted flight, I replaced the new bad pack with another new bad pack that was in amongst the good older packs. Kinda pisses me off I didn't check the new pacs operational wattage (I did check voltage). Oh well, live and learn. I usually get my Lipos from Hobby Partz or HK,, but both were out of stock, so I ordered from e-Bay. These are "Bear Power" packs and they are actually 35C, but in realty are just crap.

Now should I just reattach the Pat nose with the old motor and fly next weekend or just wait for the bigger more powerful motor that will be here in a few weeks? Probably just wait. ....She sure looks beautiful there on the bench...all dressed up but no where to go....

SpadCat
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 05:44 PM
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United States, TX, Austin
Joined Jul 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
I took the e-Super Pacer and Regal Bipe out this morning to fly, and started the SPs take off run. The take off power seemed to be really sluggish, so I aborted, taxied back and tested the battery. All cell voltages were over 4.0, but I replaced it with another pack, and the take off power was normal. Flew both planes a couple of times then went home.

Afterwards, I was working on getting two of the Polaris 120s ready to fly off water with my son tomorrow morning, and put a pack in and and power tested it. All packs were slow charged overnight. I normally get 280 watts, but got only 180, so I took that pack out and put another one of the same brand in. These two packs were my newest ones and both are 30C, not the normal 20C I usually buy. Come to think of it, both these packs came from e-Bay recently and have never been flown. So guess what? Even after a full charge, both packs would only produce around 180Ws. I put one of my older packs in and power was 280Ws.

I knew I had calculated the required power correctly for the Pat, so yesterday, instead of getting 350Ws, I was probably getting only 250W which would be only about 90W lbs instead of the 130 I thought I was getting. And it was just bad luck that after my first aborted flight, I replaced the new bad pack with another new bad pack that was in amongst the good older packs. Kinda pisses me off I didn't check the new pacs operational wattage (I did check voltage). Oh well, live and learn. I usually get my Lipos from Hobby Partz or HK,, but both were out of stock, so I ordered from e-Bay. These are "Bear Power" packs and they are actually 35C, but in realty are just crap.

Now should I just reattach the Pat nose with the old motor and fly next weekend or just wait for the bigger more powerful motor that will be here in a few weeks? Probably just wait. ....She sure looks beautiful there on the bench...all dressed up but no where to go....

SpadCat
Throw that motor back on and give it another try. Can't hurt since the new motor won't be in for awhile.
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 07:57 PM
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Unfortunately, after tomorrow I will not be able to fly for 2 - 3 weeks, so will have to wait anyway.

Have you ordered yours yet?

SpadCat
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