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Old Dec 24, 2012, 08:00 AM
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Blade 130x

Hi CaptJac,
Do you have any recommendations for scale flight pitch and throttle curves for the Blade 130x
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jymorton View Post
Hi CaptJac,
Do you have any recommendations for scale flight pitch and throttle curves for the Blade 130x
Rewind back to post #223 - it discusses the Blade 130X settings.
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 09:45 AM
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thank you
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Old Dec 24, 2012, 03:13 PM
T-REX 250 -450-500-600-700G
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ITALY, PAVIA
Joined Mar 2009
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Originally Posted by Brutus1967 View Post
Well, at least I cannot help you there....

How is your gasser conversion going?

Brgds, Bert
HI Bert,
OT: the TT56 stopped after one run of 15' and dont would still start. No evidence of mechanical or Excel failure I think some dirt in carburetor.
--
pity there are not suggestions for aerobatics.
Merry Christmas to all
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 09:31 AM
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Pitch question

Hi Cap and happy holidays to all:

My question is about mechanicall pitch, i hace two option and i need to know what is the best of two:

1. set pitch mechanical to -11/+11 andset the TC to -2/0/8

2. set the pitch mecanical to some like -2 to +8 and set the TC 0/25/50/75/100

Thanks for the grat help people!!!
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 02:02 PM
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South London United Kingdom
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Hi FherPR

I have two 450's and a 500 running on slightly modified CapJac's settings. For what it's worth, here's how I would proceed.
First of all, -11,0,+11 is what you need. I assume, since you have this range, that you have set up the head to be at zero pitch at mid stick, with washout arms, and mixers parallel to each other or the head.
I know it sounds a bit like we are setting up a 3d heli, but, trust me we are not.
Now, you need to set up your initial pitch range using pitch curves on your transmitter.
I know CapJac recommends -2,+3,+8. TBH, my helis will not take off at +3. Maybe a difference in headspeed, but I always set up +5 for hover.
My complete pitch curve would be -2,+5,+10.
For initial throttle curve, I would use 0,35,70,75,100.
Now, I would fly the model a few times. This is only an initial checkout, to make sure nothing is going to fall off, or vibrate loose.
You will find it will fly quite happily, but it may be difficult to maintain a constant hover height.
This is where CapJac's ideas come in. Once you are sure you have a reliable model, time to get interesting.
Your settings so far are in normal mode.
Go back into this mode, and set your pitch to -2,+2,+2,+2,+2. This is so you can run the heli up without it taking off.
Throttle curve should be 0,50,70,70,70.
Now, you need to go into idle up 1.
Set the pitch curve to what you had initially, -2,+5,+10. The throttle curve should be 70% across all points.
I say 70% as a starting point. I run 80% flat, but 70% is on the safe side. You can always increase it to your taste.
Now, start your heli in normal mode. Open the throttle to about 1/4 stick. Once there, switch to Idle Up 1. You will notice the headspeed jump, but the model will not take off. No fear of it leaping into the air. Once there, open the throttle slowly. The headspeed will not change (70% flat, remember) but the pitch will increase and the heli will take off at about mid-stick.
You will now find it much easier to maintain constant hover height, and the whole machine will feel smoother and more under control.
When you want to land, just lower the throttle stick until the heli touches down, then either switch to normal mode, or hit throttle hold to stop the motor.
One thing that has been mentioned many times, but worth repeating. If you get into trouble, get out of the habit of shutting the throttle.
If you are in idle up, shutting the throttle will not slow down the rotors, but will apply -2 of pitch, and drive the heli into the ground.
Get into the habit of either hitting throttle hold (preferred) or switch back to normal mode if you can.
Please note these are only my ideas, backed up by a fair bit of experience. I am sure others will contribute as well, all these ideas yours to use or discard as you think fit.
Any questions, please ask.
Good luck

Borderlord
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 03:08 PM
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Hi again, FherPR

One thing I forgot to mention. Set up your throttle hold to zero throttle, but the same pitch curve as Idle up 1.
This is to prevent anything weird happening if the hit TH in an emergency.
Let us know how you get on.

BL
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 03:17 PM
like a rock!
gravityKills's Avatar
Finland
Joined Oct 2007
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>> Set up your throttle hold to zero throttle, but the same pitch curve as Idle up 1.
+1.

A little trick "from the trenches": Especially on bigger helis, throttle hold must become a reflex.
If sh*t hits f*n, the finger flicks the switch automatically, before you even try to figure out what has happened.
If you run it into the ground with power on, it will destroy itself quite thoroughly. If you happen to hit yourself, the heli will try to kill you. Two good reasons, why it's a good idea to turn off power once you're losing control.

If you recover from "brain fade" a split second later, it will usually come down on its feet with minimal damage. Or with enough altitude, just flick it back on.
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Last edited by gravityKills; Jan 04, 2013 at 03:23 PM.
Old Jan 15, 2013, 06:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gravityKills View Post
Especially on bigger helis, throttle hold must become a reflex. If sh*t hits f*n, the finger flicks the switch automatically, before you even try to figure out what has happened. If you run it into the ground with power on, it will destroy itself quite thoroughly. If you happen to hit yourself, the heli will try to kill you. Two good reasons, why it's a good idea to turn off power once you're losing control.
Before this thread slips into the black hole - the "throttle-hold reflex" deserves a thread of its own. Once the brain gets "programmed" to slam the left stick down (chop power) you might as well get out the plastic bag and start picking up the pieces. The question is how do you re-program it? I'm not sure you can. Once those synapses are hard-wired (programmed) - the time it takes to think about switching on throttle-hold is too late. Your heli is doing a death-dance on the ground and destroying itself. OK - so if you can't re-program the "slam-stick-down" reflex how do you minimize the crash & burn effect? MINIMIZE the negative pitch on the collective. Set the pitch curve in normal-mode and flight-mode so when you slam the stick down the negative pitch is -2 degrees instead of -13. It is not as good as switching on throttle-hold and maintaining positive pitch on your blades - but when you have one of those ooooh sh*t moments - slamming the left stick down will shut down the throttle and that can be the difference of being able to fly again or getting out the plastic bag and first-aid kit.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 07:17 AM
like a rock!
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Finland
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>> Once the brain gets "programmed" to slam the left stick down (chop power)

laughing out loud. Been there done that and my poor little EP 200 (first CP heli) had to suffer

But don't worry, you can get of the habit. How about starting with the simulator, for example? Anybody who wants to fly CP helis needs, one, unless you've got money to burn AND someone to do the repair work.

Remember:
Practice makes... permanent.
Perfect practice makes perfect
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 12:20 PM
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CapJac

+1 on throttle hold in an emergency. I think the reflex can be learnt, but it will be tough.
I wonder if anyone who has read your thread is still using -13? Certainly I am not, see my recommendations above.
Having said that, -2 will do damage if you slam the throttle, so well worth re-training your brain.

gravitykills

Tried a simulator many times, but never managed to get on with it. I suppose not everyone will find them useful.
Horses for courses.

Borderlord
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 04:44 PM
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I have to say, I am actually not so "throttle hold minded".
The reason being, that once you hit that throttle hold, it is a one-way-ticket downwards and all there is left is damage control, which can work, but also makes it a nasty habit of hitting the throttle hold in situations where it is absolutely not necessary or even unwanted. at any height over 3 feet it is better to try and regain control, and at any height over 10 feet, hitting the throttle hold without mastering an AR will make sure you have damage without any possibility to regain control.

It is my opinion that it is better to take it a bit slower, so you will learn to avoid situations where you might need throttle hold, and train yourself to keep steering the darn thing.

That is how I train my students, and reviewing the (very few) crashes that have happened in my flight school in the last year, there were not many where hitting throttle hold could have done much more than save a main gear or so.

Also, I am not really agreeing with setting up the helicopter mechanically for the full pitch range then adjusting over the transmitter.
Reason: you are leaving a lot of servo travel unused (approx 50%), and thus you are leaving that same 50% resolution (servo accuracy) and 50% availlable servo torque unused.
For most trainers not a big deal, but if you ever want to go to bigger heli's with more rotorblades, it is better to learn how to set it up properly, which is in my opinion "servo horns perpendicular to the pushrods at hoover pitch (being appr +5 deg)" and a horn length that gives you aprox -3 when the pitch stick is backed fully. The rest you can set with your transmitter.

If you have even a moderate good feel for it (and provided you know your helicopter well), you can literally feel the improved accuracy of steering compared to the -11 till +11 set-up.

Brgds, Bert
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Last edited by Brutus1967; Jan 15, 2013 at 04:53 PM.
Old Jan 16, 2013, 07:56 AM
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Finland
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>> -11 till +11 set-up.

that's at least how 3D helis are designed. Sure, you can set it up like a scale heli. But I take for granted that the servos are up to the job in the first place, here you won't notice any difference. And, worse, you lose speed (which matters for 3D flying, not hovering).

BTW, only last week the flybarless sensor went bonkers on my X7. Throttle hold saved the day. Of course, you keep flying the thing...
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gravityKills View Post
>> -11 till +11 set-up. that's at least how 3D helis are designed. Sure, you can set it up like a scale heli. But I take for granted that the servos are up to the job in the first place, here you won't notice any difference. And, worse, you lose speed (which matters for 3D flying, not hovering)..
It's NOT only gravity kills - so does negative pitch. The harder it hits the more pieces you'll be picking up.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 08:47 AM
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Finland
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but that's a problem with the pilot, not the heli.

BTW gravity is overrated
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