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Old May 04, 2012, 09:00 PM
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kenh3497's Avatar
United States, IA, Rockwell
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looking for a compariable engine to a Laser 150

As stated, I looking for an engine that would compare power wise to a Laser 150 from back in the mid to late 90's. I'm building a 20% scale Zlin 526 AS from plans, well I do have a short kit but you get the idea. Anyway I'm sure there are engines today that will equal or surpass power wise the Laser. Smaller displacement is not a requirement but would be welcome in an effort to reduce weight. This is a scale airframe so it will see acrobatics in the theme of the time (mid 70's).

I guess I would prefer a 4C glow at this point as I like the sound and think it would fit the airframe well. Gas MIGHT be considered. The cowl of this plane is very narrow as the full scale version used an inverted in-line six cylinder. I noticed the Saito 150 has a "rear" exhaust which would help in hiding everything.

Thanks for the help!!

Ken

PS. The prototype model had the Laser in it, hence the question.
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Old May 04, 2012, 10:09 PM
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DLE-20 with a wrap around pitts. Vess 18x6 14lb. 3oz thrust. It would hang out the bottom of the cowl and would need to be painted the same color.

4 stoke? I would go with the Saito 150 or a YS 140. YS's are stump pulling mo-fo's!

http://www.amainhobbies.com/product_...gine-w-Muffler
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Old May 05, 2012, 06:21 AM
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The Saito180 is actually lighter than the 150 as it's in the same casting just more metal removed to make a bigger displacement. The 150 is 890g vs the 180's 880g not sure if this includes exhaust but the Laser 150 is 914g with exhaust. There's not much in it but the Saito180 will have all the power you need.

A.
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Old May 05, 2012, 10:49 AM
The Prez....... again
kenh3497's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyOne View Post
The Saito180 is actually lighter than the 150


A.
That's interesting and it make perfect sense!

I know the Saitos are a good engine but I have a "little" problem with the head and cylinder being one piece. With that said, I'm still leaning to the Saito, unless there is something out there that compares power wise to the Laser. I know of one Zlin flying on a .90 2C just fine but I want a 4C. I'm told it's a 12 to 14 pound plane, depending on how you build. I can't think for the life of me now what the wing area is.

Ken
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Old May 05, 2012, 01:14 PM
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The head and the cylinder being a unit is a non issue, it is a plus though eliminating four or five bolts and a potentially leaky head gasket.
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Old May 05, 2012, 05:59 PM
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Laser Engines are still available...

http://www.laserengines.com/index.htm

A.
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Old May 05, 2012, 07:04 PM
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I'd go for a Saito engine too. But you can still find good Enya R155 engines too. I have both a Saito 1.50 and a Enya R1.55, but I think their performance is much better than the Laser 1.50 though.
The latest Saito engines weigh quite a bit less, so much so that they tend to weigh a little less than a same displacement 2 stroke engine even. The one piece head and cylinder is really not a problem and you don't have to worry any about the head leaking at the cylinder/head joint either.
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Old May 05, 2012, 07:10 PM
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In my estimation the Saito 1.25 would be the closest match to the LASER 150. Having owned a LASER .70 I can vouch for their high quality being in league with the Saitos.
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Old May 06, 2012, 10:28 AM
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That model of Zlin had a CLOCKWISE rotating prop, just like a Tiger Moth does!

Dear Kenh3497:

The PIPE Here...and as I suspected when I Googled for "images" of your model of Zlin aircraft that you're building an RC scale model of, that aircraft in full scale actually had a CLOCKWISE rotating prop on it, when seen from "nose-on"...

...have you ever considered giving it a clockwise-spinning model engine to match, as I would definitely be doing if I was in your situation???

If you give a good read at the recent response I wrote up to "splinterz25" concerning the left side engine on his P-38 Lightning WW II RC Scale model, he's somewhat in agreement with me on the issue...he's intending to check out getting a pair of the Laser 100 single-jug four stroke mills for his P-38, to be able to reverse its rotation for the left-side model engine, just like the full-scale one did.

Luckily, both the engine you've got for your Zlin - the Laser 150, and the Saito 150 you were thinking of using in its place, can BOTH be reversed for clockwise running, but in differing ways. The Laser series of single-jug four stroke mills has one feature that is EXACTLY like Enya's line of single-jugger four strokers, and that's the fact that each valve is operated with a separate camshaft, allowing the mill's twin camshafts to simply be RETIMED with respect to the crankshaft drive gear that spins them to do the reversing. The link to spinterz25's response here actually HAS an old, and enlargeable HTML-origin graphic attached to it, showing how some of the Enyas get retimed for reversed rotation, just like the Zlin would use in full-scale...even the venerable deHavilland Tiger Moth used a clockwise-running engine in full-scale, and if I can ever get one of the Flair quarter scale Tiger Moth kits someday, either a Laser OR Saito mill can be used and converted to clockwise running for the Tiggie's needs, too.

Unlike reversing the Laser, though, reversing the Saito 150 single-jug mill WILL need a new camshaft, and it's the camshaft from the left cylinder of the base model Saito FA-300T opposed twin mill that's needed to do the reversing with, in replacing the stock Saito 150 camshaft with the linked part.

Zinger has plenty of clockwise rotation props available to suit that need, so you've already got that taken care of as well, after the engine gets its reversing work.

I'm just not certain if you've even thought of it before...it's certainly something I'd do, and perhaps splinterz25 seems to be considering it as well for his P-38's left side engine.

Hope it's something that appeals to you, even a small bit...

Yours Sincerely,

The PIPE....!!
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Old May 06, 2012, 10:49 AM
Whatever works well .
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The venerable Enya big blocks are superstars in the scale arena . Good , solid engineering and design executed with quality and precision . Not so readily available in the US but worth looking in to .Since they are whittled from bar stock , the Lasers are quite heavy for the amount of power they produce . Castings have certain advantages from the perspevtive of weight anyhow.

As mentioned , the integral head / cylinder design that some makers use is actually an advantage . The YS small blocks have used that form as well. Actually , a YS from the .91 to 1.10 size could be a fine choice too . Very easy engines to learn and real steady performers .

The ENYA does lend to simple re-phasing of the intake/exhaust cams for CW rotation . It would be a bit more involved for the Saito IMHO .
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Old May 07, 2012, 12:46 PM
The Prez....... again
kenh3497's Avatar
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all good advise. i was thinking of a slightly smaller displacement engine for the zlin. my thinking a newer design would make as much hp/torque as an older model. save some weight in the process.

excuse my typing..... stuck my hand in a prop yesterday
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Old May 07, 2012, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenh3497 View Post
all good advise. i was thinking of a slightly smaller displacement engine for the zlin. my thinking a newer design would make as much hp/torque as an older model. save some weight in the process.

excuse my typing..... stuck my hand in a prop yesterday
In that case, I say a YS115. Really good engine.

9900RPM 14.2lb thrust with a 14X12 apc!

YS FZ115S Engine Test (2 min 47 sec)
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:49 AM
Whatever works well .
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Yep, I should have included the 1.15 in that range . Thanks ! Real powerhose and an incredibly fine running all around engine . Unmatched transition and you have a great deal of added flexibility in fuel tank layout. The pressurized fuel delivery makes fuel tank placement very easy, this is a HUGE plus in scale planes . In fact , you could probably use a single, central tank for both engines . Have not tried this personally but it should work well . I would first bench test for proof of concept however .
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Old May 08, 2012, 12:36 PM
The Prez....... again
kenh3497's Avatar
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i'm not going to mess with cw rotation. while i've looked at the ys brand, i've never considered one. maybe now is the time??? is the exhaust port on the ys 1.15 on the side or rear? i want to get all the exhaust inside the cowl. thinking rear or even at 45 degrees off would be better than out the side.

ken
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Old May 09, 2012, 06:37 AM
Whatever works well .
Gary Cee's Avatar
United States, MI, Marysville
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The YS is an absolute gem of an engine . Some good photos are shown in these independent reports:

http://www.centralhobbies.com/Engine...YS%20FZ70S.pdf

http://www.centralhobbies.com/Engine...ine%20Test.pdf

(My comments RE: CW rotation and a single tank were in response to the P-38 comment from The Pipe . Should have made that more clear at the time )
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Last edited by Gary Cee; May 09, 2012 at 10:33 AM. Reason: spell
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