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Old Oct 29, 2003, 08:38 PM
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United States, CA, Tustin
Joined Jun 2003
499 Posts
Typhoon-Micro-6 brushless motor

wondering if anyone has had any experience with this new motor from edogfight.com?
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 07:33 AM
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Holland
Joined Sep 2001
140 Posts
Read this report from Nigel Hawes He's a RCM&E columnist

Hi Frits,
Below is my report on the Short (6mm stator) motor, now called Typhoon "MICRO 6".

Physical Examination.
I weighed the motor and found it to be 43g as stated. This is approx. 28g lighter than a typical 400 can motor without flux-ring. It is also only 60% as long as the 400 can motor at 22mm, making it considerably more compact. The same CNC - cut ply mounting plates I have had specially made in 1.5mm and 3mm ply are an identical fit on this motor AND the MICRO 15.
In the same fashion as the larger motor, quality appears to be first class, with chromium plated flux ring, hardened steel shaft, and nicely anodised aluminium front and rear plates.
I found that this motor could also be dismantled i.e. the rotating can could be withdrawn without having to undo anything, which would impede use in pusher applications. The shaft collet you plan to offer as an extra will serve to rectify this.
This motor is also very versatile in that its shaft can be reversed allowing it to be externally mounted for use in tractor applications. In both cases pusher configuration will also be practical using the planned collet.
Magnet positioning and coil winding all appear uniform and in the case of the coils, resin bonding appears to be well penetrated.

Bench Running.
Using 7 to 10 cells and a variety of props ranging from 6x4 to 8x6 this motor was as willing as its larger counterpart. It also appears to have a fairly low Kv (RPM per volt) and as a result I felt it was happier "loaded up" with a large prop than on 10 cells with a smaller prop.
I attach my chart of my static results below..
Using a Jeti 18A 3P ESC, start-up was fairly smooth after the initial "kick" and throttling throughout the entire range appears to be effortless. It is particularly impressive at extremely low throttle settings and appears to be extremely efficient at approx. half power.
Motor running temperature also appears to be very low.
I used 15 Amps static as my bench-test limit and concluded that my favourite set-up was using 8 x 4 APC "E" prop on 8 x 1800 KAN cells. The motor was then transferred to an airframe for flight tests.

Flight test.
The first airframe used was a 30" Tucano designed by myself for RCME as a free plan. Flight weight was exactly 550g with 9 x 1050 KAN cells and an APC "E" 6x4 prop.
The model performed better than it previous std. 400 motor, but at approx 70% of the current draw, giving a much extended flight time.
In the same model a 7 x 5 Kyosho prop on 8 x 1200 ma/h 4/5AA cells proved to be another very good set-up for top speed.
The motor was then transferred into a 50" sport glider converted to 400 power. The model is a "RIDGE RUNT" but has more recently appeared on the market as the Kyosho "COYOTE". It weighed ezactly 680g (1.5 lbs) with an 8 x 4 APC "E" prop and 8 x 1800 KAN cells.
Climb rate with this set-up was excellent, but more impressive was its ability to cruise at extremely LOW power settings. For the benefit of data, I flew at cruise setting for almost the entire flight, which lasted 18 minutes! This proving that the Typhoon MICRO 6 using an 8 x 4 prop can fly a 680g model on 6 Amps (i.e. just over 50 Watts) which is outstanding.
On full power the motor appears to handle bursts of 150 Watts without any signs of strain.

Conclusion.
If anything this motor is even more impressive than the MICRO 15 for its intended application. It is very small and light yet has the ability to outperform a 400 or long-can 480 in direct drive with a small prop and 10 cells, whilst at the same time being able to swing larger props WITHOUT a gearbox with extremely efficient results.
Whilst it is not my area of Electric Flight, I imagine the MICRO 6 would be oustanding in Slow-fly and Park-fly applications using even larger props on 6 or 7 cells, as it appears to be extremely flexible and efficient at low power settings. Certainly allied to appropriate Lithium Polymer cells flight durations in excess of 30 mins will be possible.
In the same way as the MICRO 15, only time will tell whether this motor can stand up to long-term use at its operating limit; but as it seems to run very cool, and withstand bursts of 150 watts without any problems, I see no reason why this should be an issue, given the quality of the bearings.
Below is a table of my STATIC running tests:

No. of cells prop. RPM Current

7 8 x 6 APC 7,000 13 A
8 8 x 4 APC 9,600 15 A*
8 7 x 5 Kyosho 11,000 13 A
9 6 x 4 APC 14,000 8.6 A
10 6 x 4 APC 14,700 10.8 A

*My favourite set-up for this motor.
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 12:16 PM
high-speed freak
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San Jose, CA
Joined Sep 2001
3,863 Posts
looking at the numbers I have seen so far, it doesn't seem very efficient... we need some more numbers, the direct compatison would be to a hacker b20 12/15 PG I eould think... dimilar weight, power band, and intended propsize/cellcount...
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 12:31 PM
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Holland
Joined Sep 2001
140 Posts
test report Typhoon-micro 15

These are the test reports as they will apear in RCM&E comming December and January .

Hi Frits,
Below is my report on the Long (15mm stator) motor.

Physical Examination.
I weighed the motor and found it to be 74g as stated. This is fractionally (i.e. 3g) heavier than a typical 400 can motor without flux-ring so it can definitely be considered to be physically a direct replacement for any 400 or 480 "long can" motor.
It is also only 80% as long as the 400 can motor, making it more compact. I have had CNC - cut ply mounting plates specially made in 1.5mm and 3mm ply, examples of which are on their way to you.
The quality appears to be first class, with chromium plated flux ring, hardened steel shaft, nicely anodised aluminium front and rear plates.
I found that the motor could be dismantled i.e. the rotating can could be withdrawn without having to undo anything, which would impede use in pusher applications. As we discussed a collet with grub screw on the output shaft would be an advantage. I'm glad to hear that this will be available as an extra.
The motor is also very versatile in that its shaft can be reversed allowing it to be externally mounted for use in tractor applications. In both cases pusher configuration will also be practical using the planned collet.
Magnet positioning and coil winding all appear uniform and in the case of the coils, resin bonding appears to be well penetrated.

Bench Running.
Using 7 to 10 cells and a variety of props ranging from 7x4 to 10x5 this motor was noticably wiling to swing almost any prop fitted with ease. It appears to have a fairly low Kv (RPM per volt) and as a result I felt it preferred to be "loaded up" with quite a pitchy prop.
I will at a later date compile a chart of my static results.
Using a Castle Creations Phoenix 35 ESC on default settings, start-up was fairly smooth after the initial "kick" and throttling throughout the entire range appears to be effortless.
Outrunners I have tested in the past all seem to have a "rough" patch but these don't appear to suffer in the same way - perhaps this is due to your deviation from the LRK winding method?
Certainly at low throttle settings the motor appears to be particularly efficient giving the impression that duration would be greatly enhanced. Motor running temperature also appears to be very low.
I used 20Amps static as my bench-test limit and concluded that my favourite set-up was using 9 x 1300CP cells and a 9 x 6 APC "E" prop. This was then transferred to an airframe for flight tests.

Flight test.
The airframe used was a 30" Tucano designed by myself for RCME as a free plan. Flight weight was exactly 700g in this configuration.
To say the model was "overpowered" was an understatement! In fact it had UNLIMITED vertical performance, suggesting that this set-up is giving in the region of 800 - 900g thrust.
I took this model to an event at the weekend and everyone was astonished with its performance. It is clear that a 1Kg + model would have excellent performance using the Long motor and 10 cells, as the in-flight current on 9 cells is probably only peaking at 15A, with cruise setting probably below 10A.
I have a 42" X-FIRE sport aerobatic model which I intend to fit the Long motor into next; I will report on that result of course. It will be approx 1200g flight ready.

Conclusion.
There is no doubt that this is an oustanding motor. Its power-to-weight ratio is amongst the highest I have encountered and its quality and operating manners are impeccable.
What cannot be predicted at such an early stage of course is its long-term reliability; but as the bearings are of model car racing origin, and as these are essentially the only moving parts, I cannot see them ever wearing out.
It is difficult to draw comparisons with other motors as I have never experienced such performance from such a small package! Even a direct drive Speed 480 or 600 can motor would struggle to swing a 9 x 6 prop at such low currents.
In this respect I imagine it is suitable for anything from such as my small 30" Tucano at 700g with fantastic performance, through 40" 1/12-scale models for scale performance, and up to larger slow-fly and powered glider applications using a larger prop and perhaps 7 or 8 cells.

I have not had the opportunity to fully test the Short motor yet, but all I can suggest is that if it is anywhere near as impressive as the Long version, then you are surely onto a winner with these motors, given your intended market pricing structure.

I hope this report confirms your findings and is of use to you.
Best wishes,

Nigel Hawes.
(RCME Electric Flight columnist).
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 12:42 PM
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northampton, England.
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when will these be available for sale in the u.k and at what price. i have a high end tech KI-61 which i was going to put a mega 16/15/5 in, but this looks like a very interesting alternative. the KI-61 i`m currently flying on a jamara 480 pro 7.2 on 10 1050 KAN`s swinging a 5.5X4.5 APC already goes like the clappers BUT I WANT MORE!!!!!!!!! ----martin
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 12:50 PM
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Holland
Joined Sep 2001
140 Posts
Hi ,

Motors will be available from Overlander next week. Give them a call, If you put the Typhoon-micro 6 in the kawasaki try to get a 6.5x6.5 Cam prop from Graupner.
To mount the motor in the Ki61 you have to make some room for
the can because it rotates.
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 12:52 PM
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Holland
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140 Posts
I forgot.
ask RBC kits in Holland for his experience with the small motor as
he has them in stock
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:00 PM
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Everett Snohomish, Washington, United States
Joined Jun 2002
238 Posts
Is the Io, KV, and resistance of these motors published anywhere? The look like nice motors, but I want to be able to run the numbers in motocalc and find out if they suit any of my applications.

Thanks,

Chris
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:02 PM
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northampton, England.
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many thanks i`ll call them tommorrow. can you comment on the performance compared to the 16/15 mega`s?---martin
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:08 PM
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Holland
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Which Mega 16/15/#

Messdaten Vorserienmotor 20Windungen 6mm Magnetlšnge neue mit future-9.12e:
U[V] I[A] n[U/min] ns[U/min/V]
10.0 0.7 16450 1645

Ri = 0.133Ohm

Messdaten Vorserienmotor 10Windungen 15mm Magnetlšnge neue mit
future-9.12e:
U[V] I[A] n[U/min] ns[U/min/V]
10.0 1.0 12600 1260

Ri = 0.067Ohm

you can use this data for Motocalc, I am not impressed with the output, these are outer runner motors search on motocalc on the forum and you know what I mean
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:11 PM
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i was thinking of running the 5 turn so i guess i`d be looking for a comparison with that.--martin
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:23 PM
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Holland
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Hi Martin,

I would go for the short motor specialy for the KI61. and if you use the Tsunami-10 ESC you'll save about 60 grams of weight.
so the model weight will be somewhere around 400 grams.
you get almost the same performance when usinga 16/15/5.

Overlander has a package deal I think should be around 70 pounds for the motor and speed controller.

Frits van Breemen
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:27 PM
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many thanks Fritz, i`ll ring them in the morning.----martin
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:30 PM
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what would be the difference between the short and long motors in this type of plane, and how many cells and what prop would you recciommend to get the MAXIMUM speed?----martin

i`ll be using 1050 KAN cells
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Old Nov 02, 2003, 01:49 PM
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Holland
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Hi Martin,

The KV on the motors is low So you must have a prop with a lot of pitch to get high speed. With the short motor you will get long
flying times with high speed and good vertical performance.
If you want unlimited vertical performance use the long motor on 9-10 KAN 1050's and a 9x6 APC.
There is a trade of between speed and thrust The more speed you get the less torque you have and visa versa.
These motors are designed to replace motors that need a gearbox. If you want speed you should for the Astro020 pylon
or mega 16/15/2-3 , but you'll never get the flight time as with
the typhoon motors.
I fly the Ki61 with the short motor and a Graupner semiscale 6.5x4 prop with 4 lipo's 2series 2 parallel ( 8.4v 2800 Mah)
flying weight 360 gram and fly faster than a BB480 and fly an average of 30 minutes.

I was wandering if you put a report on Ki61 on ezone as I am the designer
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