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Old Sep 18, 2012, 06:46 AM
Aka: Tom Jenkins
ApexAero's Avatar
Palm Beach County, Fl.
Joined Aug 2008
4,389 Posts
The 7x8 was cavitating the whole time. The 7x7 cavitates only the first 50 meters, unloads, bites the air and goes like stink. My last ice never produced correct numbers,got me sceptical toward CC's data logging. 5.5mm connectors,all limits dissabled, 10ga wire, zero timing. The batt potential is 288amps and i only do full throt for speed pass .The airframe drag is way down, don't know what else to ad.from my phone, comp is still down.
Tom
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 12:03 PM
Why the dirt on the wings?
moparmyway's Avatar
New York
Joined Jan 2009
4,975 Posts
Hi Tom,
I am just wondering how you arrive at your numbers.
It might be that some of them arent correct.
Did you use Eagletree, Oracle, CC ICE, or some other form of data logging ?
The 7x8 prop could have been breaking your motors back ......... it would be best if you could answer some of the details in the last few posts.

I am not raggin on you, just trying to get to the bottom of your and my questions.
I still dont understand what you mean by loaded amps ............
CC ICE timing is best left at default ..............
The APC 7x8 sounds much different than the 7x7 or even 7x6.

Post #310, all you need is a DMM and air is drawn out through the rotating can. The custom pictures you have seen have probably machined out the fan thats cut into the outrunner, allowing ram air to rule.
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 05:31 PM
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United States, CA, SF
Joined Mar 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexAero View Post
Thanks arctic
Mopar, kast I checked it got 2100 watts at 113 amps and 32.5 k rpm static. Arc 36-65-1 2080kv, cc125, genace 4800 60c5s aeronaut 7x7. Apc 7x7 does work better.
Hi Apex,

There is a very huge discrepancy between those static Watts and RPM for a 7X7 prop.
When your computer is back up, please double check your numbers.



Gryphon
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 05:51 PM
2012 NZ Speedcup - 231 MPH
DownUnderPilot's Avatar
New Zealand, Tasman, Richmond
Joined Mar 2006
1,938 Posts
Be interesting to know the in-flight RPM as well - it must unload quite a bit since 32.5k rpm and 200MPH is ~93% of pitch speed - better than the speedcup planes.
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 07:09 PM
Aka: Tom Jenkins
ApexAero's Avatar
Palm Beach County, Fl.
Joined Aug 2008
4,389 Posts
I used a eflight watt meter and my old TnC tach. I have an adapter deans to 5.5mm connectors that may have some resistance. Im not one to tell tails, I launch, back off power, climb up to a speck then dive, gradually shoving power and lining up for a speed run center deck at 25'. It starts ripping the last third of the dive before the pull to level. Its a one turn edf motor. Id like to use one of the recorder data things I read about.
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 11:22 PM
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Canada, SK, Prince Albert
Joined Jan 2006
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Ready to Rip!

The Big Mega (22/60/1E) is installed along with a huge heat sink from MPI(heavier motor and heat sink)...this caused the RX Lipo to be moved to the rear under the elevator servo and the RX BEC to be moved under the RX behind the wing.

Marcus' 7.6x12.5 fixed will be tested to start. I originally wanted to test his 7.5x13 folders BUT the folding spinner that arrived today was a piece of junk 50mm Xpower Z (Dist by Top Model). I did not order this thing it is what was sent....Do not get this spinner for high performance apps. The quality is poor the screws were to short, the holes in the front are too small to allow much air intake. AND it can only take 8,500RPM's (Pic attached)

I just need some 6S batts from my heli buddies...then will start punching some holes in the sky.... and hopefully get you guys some good 200+ video
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 02:14 AM
"The Judge"
sebbe's Avatar
Sweden
Joined Feb 2006
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artic, she looks HOT !!! good luck...

What is the kv for that big MEGA ?
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 03:47 AM
Why the dirt on the wings?
moparmyway's Avatar
New York
Joined Jan 2009
4,975 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by arcticflyer View Post
The Big Mega (22/60/1E) is installed along with a huge heat sink from MPI(heavier motor and heat sink)...this caused the RX Lipo to be moved to the rear under the elevator servo and the RX BEC to be moved under the RX behind the wing.

Marcus' 7.6x12.5 fixed will be tested to start. I originally wanted to test his 7.5x13 folders BUT the folding spinner that arrived today was a piece of junk 50mm Xpower Z (Dist by Top Model). I did not order this thing it is what was sent....Do not get this spinner for high performance apps. The quality is poor the screws were to short, the holes in the front are too small to allow much air intake. AND it can only take 8,500RPM's (Pic attached)

I just need some 6S batts from my heli buddies...then will start punching some holes in the sky.... and hopefully get you guys some good 200+ video
YEEHAA !!!!!!!!
I cant wait to see that puppy in action !!!!
Looks awesome !!!!
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 04:31 AM
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Peter M's Avatar
Newcastle, New South Wales, Australia
Joined Sep 2007
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Good luck Arctic,it should be fast!


Sebbe,
kV of 1401rpm
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 05:57 AM
Why the dirt on the wings?
moparmyway's Avatar
New York
Joined Jan 2009
4,975 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexAero View Post
I used a eflight watt meter and my old TnC tach. I have an adapter deans to 5.5mm connectors that may have some resistance. Im not one to tell tails, I launch, back off power, climb up to a speck then dive, gradually shoving power and lining up for a speed run center deck at 25'. It starts ripping the last third of the dive before the pull to level. Its a one turn edf motor. Id like to use one of the recorder data things I read about.
Hi Tom,
I wasnt going into the "telling tales" scenario.
More asking the method of testing so we can see where the descrepancy might be. I am sure you have given every test an unbiased outlook, please do not feel like I am picking apart your numbers due to an "imbellishment". More like its just not in-flight data, and there is room for mistakes with the instruments you have used for your static tests. I wouldnt want to hold a tach close to any 7x7 spinning 32.5k !! I give you the award for balls of the month on that one !!!
OK, that dive makes the 200 mph at your power level sound more reasonable.
ICE and ICE HV have gotten much better at being accurate, most of my ICE controllers are dead nutz right on the money. I have oscilliscopes, multimeters, inductive clamps (all top of the line FLUKE models) as well as EagleTree and Oracle in flight data recorders which confirms the ICE controllers are very accurate these days.

Easiest way to get inflight info ................. ICE
Second easiest .......................................... Eagletree

Also, the Aeronutz props pull GOBS of power compared to Graupner and are closer to the APC E props as far as power draw is concerned. If it takes a Graupner 2000 watts to turn 7x7 @ 25k, and APC Sport is at best 2150 watts, the Aeronutz will be higher, unless you hit its rpm point where it deforms and unloads substantially due to deformation, or catastrophic failure.

If you really do not trust the ICE enough to purchase one, please PM me and we will see about loaning you one to fly with so you can get a feel if you like it or not. I could also loan out my Eagletree if youre more comfy with it, but its not the easiest to wedge into a tight fuse ............... if you got the room, its easy as eating pie.

We are all here to help each other, and especially on this thread, there are quite a few very experienced Dudes here who dont mind going out of their way to help and just want the rest of us to have fun and post up accurate info so others can have the same fun without worrying about unrealistic goals, or failed components. If the testing methods can be more efficient, it would also be much easier for you to see whats actually happening in flight as well. I would also be willing to bet you that the 7x8 unloads in flight, no matter what your ears might be telling you !!!!!
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 12:13 PM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
United States, CA, Lodi
Joined Feb 2001
4,183 Posts
I think it's the watt meter that's messing things up. For the high power stuff, you really need a clamp meter so there's nothing different than when you're flying.

I like RFM yoke/spinners. For stuff that's easy for me to get, there really isn't much better out there.
If you want a nice offset one for flat folding, these Hyperflight spinners are nice too- http://www.kennedycomposites.com/spinners.htm#
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Last edited by Steve C; Sep 19, 2012 at 12:20 PM.
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 12:48 PM
Livin it UP when Im goin DOWN
Arcteryxxx's Avatar
Norway, Telemark, Skien
Joined Feb 2010
4,255 Posts
There's a big, unanswered question about how much power those offset Vladimir (Hyper) spinners can take. I have a couple of them, but since no one, not even the vendors, can tell the ballpark number about the limitations, I just don't dare to run them.
Anyone?
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 01:06 PM
Why the dirt on the wings?
moparmyway's Avatar
New York
Joined Jan 2009
4,975 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve C View Post
I think it's the watt meter that's messing things up. For the high power stuff, you really need a clamp meter so there's nothing different than when you're flying.
+1 !!

The E-Flite meter's limit is 100 amps, and mine isnt accurate @ 80 amps, and its pitiful at 90 amps.

I think the newer one is 120 amps, but I aint wasting any more $$ on that !!

I also wonder about that RPM .....................
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 02:21 PM
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Canada, SK, Prince Albert
Joined Jan 2006
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MOPAR -
Here are some inflight numbers from a Neu 1515/1Y (2200kv) from my Ice Lite 200 on 5S:

Static at launch: Amps 248
RPM's 29,334
In Flight (4) WOT passes then quickly got it on the ground.
AMPS 241.3 max
AMPS 223 avg
Watts 3884 max
Watts 3566 avg
RPM's 29,936 max
RPM's 25,933 avg

That was with an APC 7x8...hope that helps some with the current discussion.

ARCTERRY,
Oh Yeah, Just for kicks and at a safe distance I put that spinner through 20,000 RPMS yesterday but just for 2 seconds and will never do it again! Trust Me!
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 02:24 PM
"The Judge"
sebbe's Avatar
Sweden
Joined Feb 2006
5,757 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcteryxxx View Post
There's a big, unanswered question about how much power those offset Vladimir (Hyper) spinners can take. I have a couple of them, but since no one, not even the vendors, can tell the ballpark number about the limitations, I just don't dare to run them.
Anyone?
I also would like to know that, have some of them laying around here.....

Who makes them ? I mean there must be a producer who constructed them and maybee can say more...
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