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Old Feb 08, 2013, 05:19 PM
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ak79's Avatar
United States, CA, Torrance
Joined Apr 2006
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Comparing the brand new parts of my x2 3.5 and x2 3.8 there was a big difference in weight.

The center panels are the same on both but the 3.5 was 1 oz lighter. If it makes any difference the 3.5 is white, and the 3.8 is red with bare carbon bottoms with clear coat.

I suspect that the white paint coats better and is lighter, I also think the "naked" carbon with clear is heavier than just painting the bottoms red or white, etc....

So order a while one, it may be the lightest.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 08:25 PM
Registered User
USA, CA, Visalia
Joined May 2007
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I have a red fuse and a white fuse in my shop, weights are identical.
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Old Feb 08, 2013, 09:43 PM
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webbsolution's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galenreed View Post
I have a red fuse and a white fuse in my shop, weights are identical.
Variation in production can cause a little more or less weight...
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 12:35 AM
In F3J size does matter!
roydor's Avatar
Israel
Joined Nov 2006
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Clear coat is usually lighter than paint assuming you put the required amount of each. Its more likely that variation in the cleanliness of the build have more to do with the weight assuming there are no internal differences in construction
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 10:43 AM
Detail Freak
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Harbor City, CA
Joined Oct 2003
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Tighter fitting parts = less splooge, Roydor?
And/Or less splooge = lighter parts...
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 02:24 PM
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Aug 2005
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My 3.8 X2 came in at 62 to 63oz using 10g aileron and rudder servos. Awesome flying plane and my 2nd X2 just showed up! Love seeing that big brown box. Need to get building, Arizona is just around the corner!

Aaron
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 02:39 PM
Detail Freak
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Harbor City, CA
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And help out your team mate and my flying partner, WD sub-40!

R,
Target
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 03:36 PM
In F3J size does matter!
roydor's Avatar
Israel
Joined Nov 2006
841 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by target View Post
Tighter fitting parts = less splooge, Roydor?
And/Or less splooge = lighter parts...
The glue is usually heavier then the web for the spar so yes, tighter fit means less glue is required for a bond between the web and spar caps but it is also a question of excess epoxy inside the wing because it gets left inside the wing after closing without the possibility of removal.
Controlling the amount of glue for gluing both parts of the wing is difficult and requires "faith". Faith in that the miniscule amount of glue you want to use to glue everything will be enough. Sometimes we don't have enough faith so we use more than is needed, sometimes it's a question of how much microballoons was added to the mixture (more microballons equals lighter glue for the same volume but more brittle glue as well...) and sometimes it's just a question of a bigger\smaller hole in the bag\syringe used to apply the glue.
In the end, 2 oz (weight) is just 1-1.5 oz (volume) of more epoxy for a 3.5-4 meter wing. Thatís NOTHING! and is in the manufacturing tolerances. In fact, I'm surprised it's not more than that.

Roy
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 03:47 PM
Daryl Perkins's Avatar
United States, VA, Falls Church
Joined Mar 2007
1,362 Posts
Roydor,

Thanks for sharing some manufacturing truths and helping to dis spell very common misunderstandings. Placing the tiniest of beads of "splooey" to bond the spar to the cap is always scary. How much is enough? How much is too much? Once it's done, it's in there. Tight fit or not... There are also items in our models that the manufacturer has little to no control over the weights. Most manufacturers use balsa for spars. Go to the hobby store and weigh each piece of 1/2" balsa. What are the variations?

The weight tolerances held by manufacturers today are pretty amazing in my book. You're not going to miss your time because of an extra ounce or 4 in your airframe...

dp
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Old Feb 09, 2013, 04:14 PM
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Aug 2005
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WD it's in good hands! Guess I should post a teaser picture of what came in the big brown box....

Can't wait to fly this one! More to come.

Aaron
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Old Feb 10, 2013, 03:18 AM
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Jyvaskyla, Finland
Joined Aug 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roydor View Post
The glue is usually heavier then the web for the spar so yes, tighter fit means less glue is required for a bond between the web and spar caps but it is also a question of excess epoxy inside the wing because it gets left inside the wing after closing without the possibility of removal.
Controlling the amount of glue for gluing both parts of the wing is difficult and requires "faith". Faith in that the miniscule amount of glue you want to use to glue everything will be enough. Sometimes we don't have enough faith so we use more than is needed, sometimes it's a question of how much microballoons was added to the mixture (more microballons equals lighter glue for the same volume but more brittle glue as well...) and sometimes it's just a question of a bigger\smaller hole in the bag\syringe used to apply the glue.
In the end, 2 oz (weight) is just 1-1.5 oz (volume) of more epoxy for a 3.5-4 meter wing. Thatís NOTHING! and is in the manufacturing tolerances. In fact, I'm surprised it's not more than that.

Roy
I have 3 Xplorers and while the weights seem to be in tight tolerances there are clear differences in manufacturing. For an example, microballoons are much more liberally used in the spar/core bond of my 4m Xp2 compared to the 3.8m. Both are still ok and quite acceptable, but it looks like some NAN workers like the white stuff more than others... Or maybe the the 4m Xp2 spar was just slightly undersized?? This plane is one of the from pre-production prototypes.
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Old Feb 10, 2013, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P-51flyer View Post
WD it's in good hands! Guess I should post a teaser picture of what came in the big brown box....

Can't wait to fly this one! More to come.

Aaron
I am hoping mine arrives Wednesday which gives me a day to put it together - and a few days to trim it out before the Phoenix event Weather permitting - I am also finishing abuild on my Fosa Lift which I dont expect to be near as ready for contest flying but who knows!
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Old Feb 10, 2013, 05:06 PM
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USA, CA, San Jose
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Currently working on mine. Fly next weekend then pack it for AZ! Beautiful plane.

Aaron
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Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:22 PM
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Belgium, Vlaams Gewest, Aalst
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When installing my new X 2 I have noticed that there is play between the wingjoiners and the wings, there is still someone who has this problem??
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Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xplorer F3J View Post
When installing my new X 2 I have noticed that there is play between the wingjoiners and the wings, there is still someone who has this problem??

You may find that certain joiner positions offer a better fit that others - you have 4 variations by swapping the joiner from left to right and then each joiner can be reversed - Thats what I do to consider which fit is tight but not too tight. If all 4 are loose then you can always wax the joiner to tune the fit.

I had a tragi 801 I sold and a more accomplished pilot and builder did that to get the tips fitting perfectly.
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