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Old Aug 17, 2012, 12:06 AM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
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Boogie_ Thanks, I had forgotten totaly about the Character Map
I remember seeing years ago, but never gave it much thought. I did enjoy your phrase " us old farts ". And I am! Well at least older than most here I think.

I was reading the thread here--"position of EDF in ducting"--. My ducting is pretty straight forward, and not much I can change about it. Remembering what Rainer had said regarding intake and exhaust ducting, thought I would see how my intake stacks up to the rotor size wise. Should be OK.

Also, I think I can up with a simple way to rotate gear as it retracts. Will see how it works under air pressure!
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Old Aug 17, 2012, 10:31 AM
DELTAS RULE
corsair nut's Avatar
tehachapi, CA
Joined Jan 2006
21,471 Posts
your still about 110% fsa. dont feel bad, my jhh F-86 only had 75% fsa with the scale nose cone. the fat lip really makes a huge differance. my sabre ripped and had awesome vertical.
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Old Aug 17, 2012, 05:55 PM
Registered User
United Kingdom, Northern Ireland, Belfast
Joined Jun 2011
292 Posts
Mark this build is brilliant and inspiring. Between yourself and Mr. Morgan on here I will be getting more than enough info for building my own 7' long 60" wing span F4. And the confidence that it will be done right. Thanks.
I've book marked this thread and will be following closely. The fact that you are listing the materials used is extremely helpful as well. I knew I was gonna build the F4 some day but didn't appreciate the amount of work to get a plug ready. You must have some sanding arm on you sir.

Cheers
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Old Aug 18, 2012, 12:07 AM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
4,945 Posts
Shane, I don't know about brilliant and inspiring, but thanks. This kind of build isn't for everyone, but for those who want a challenge, this is it! There are many great builders here at RCG, in just about every forum. Just look at the guys and their projects here on the EDF Scratch Build forum. I have needed some help here and there, and you can't find a more helpfull bunch of guys, here at RCG.

When you decide to do your build, a great set of plans is a good start, unless you are falcon 5 or John Morgan all you need is an outline.

Do plenty of research, look over builds others have done, and plan way ahead. If you don't something is bound to come back and bite you. Good Luck
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Old Aug 26, 2012, 11:20 PM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
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Weekend Update. Finally got around to installing pivot point, for 90 rotation. Finding just the right angles took a bit, and it works well. Still will need some tweaking when full air system is installed. That little thin strip in the radius of the pivot is teflon. I don't know how many of you have had the pleasure of trying to cut teflon, but it takes some time. I have what they call a "Vintage" Dremal Motoshop. That little strip took well over an hour to cut. Just figured it would make the torque link slide smoother. Nest project is framing the hatch. That has to be easier!

I have spent some time working on the wing set-up. I had first thought foam, but strongly considering a built up wing. Because the size of mine is just slightly bigger than a BVM Saber, there are lots of parts I can use from BVM. Although my main gear are Robarts, they are very similar the the BVM Air Blues, and maybe there flex plates will fit my retracts.

My most perplexing issue has been finding a motor. Sure there are lots of them out there, but I want just the right one. Not so sure on the Het 700-68-1200KV, If you have seen the videos in the Jetfan thread of the F-86"s, both Rainer and Stuart have used the Het 700-83-1445Kv motor. Right from the HET website--
"Specially designed for 100/120mm fan unit", it is much stronger than the 1200Kv. The 1250Kv Leopard was another I had looked at, it is only rated at (40V)some sites to run 8s others 10s. Rainer was cranking it on 12s to get the 6.5Kg of thrust. So whats left? I have seen 3 likely candidates from NEU.
How ever nothing is set in stone yet!
Till next time.
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Old Aug 27, 2012, 12:04 AM
deltas are cool
AIR SALLY's Avatar
Tehachapi ,CA.
Joined Apr 2006
20,409 Posts
seems to work ,the JHH way was just to have the NG steering arm to hit the 1/4" ng retract mount.
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Old Sep 01, 2012, 06:24 PM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
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Well no pictures today. Will see what happens by Mon. First to AS. regarding the 90 rotation. Just could not make it work the way you and C/N had done yours. I think one reason, is just the fact in the difference in size of retract unit. I have a set of Rhoms, that I could get to do it, but they are way too small for this plane. I spent a fair amount of time to make sure gear doors were as close to scale as possible. So after a little surgery on the strut it all fit nice, but in keeping the right length on strut the torque link would have hit the cylinder before it rotated. Any way, it works.

Spent way too much time this week looking at the pros and cons on the few motors that I think will work. There's that fuzzy area where, what will work good enough, or this is the ONE I really want! Good thing I don't have to choose today, because the WANT part of the brain would win. Neu 1524/2D

Kind of Pi$$ed today away, but might get something started. Nose gear is squared away enough, till full air sytem install. Just a few tweeks. Hatch cover is on deck. Maybe some work on the stab mounts. This is where the mold I made of the tail fairing will come into play. With scale sized exhaust, there is no room to work.

One last thing. Though some PM's, I was offered the chance to borrow the full set of the BVM F-86 plans and manual. Guess what came in the mail today! SWEET
I have only had a brief glimps so far, but what a wealth of info. What did surprise me was, how incredibly close I got to matching the nose and intake.
Lots to study.
And thanks to all who have stopped by. Still amazed by the view count.
Mark
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Old Sep 02, 2012, 04:04 PM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
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Corrected Scale.

Some where along the way, I messed up. Having compared various sized F-86's with fellow members, to get proper dimensions, I guess to many scale conversions=Confussion.

F-86F "SABRE"
North American F-86F-30-NA "Sabre"
S/N 52-4978

Crew: One
Engine: One General Electric J47-GE-27 turbojet; 5,910 lbs thrust
Wingspan: 39 ft 1 1/2 in
Length: 37 ft 6 1/2 in
Height: 14 ft 9 in
Weight: 11,125 lbs. empty; 15,198 lbs loaded
Empty T/W 1:0.53 Loaded T/W 1:0.388
Speed: max: 678 mph
Range: 926 miles
Service Ceiling: 48,000 ft
Armament: Six .50 caliber machine guns; 2,000 lbs of assorted underwing ordnance

Not getting correct fuse measurement was the issue.
Corrected Scale and Size.
Scale=1. 7.151
Length=63"
WS =65.65"
Wing Area=967.9 sqin. AUW TBD, but@14lb=33.33oz sqft, 15lb=35.7oz sqft.
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Old Sep 15, 2012, 04:58 PM
Claus at Area 52
clausxpf's Avatar
copenhagen Denmark
Joined May 2002
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I would go for something like this
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Old Sep 15, 2012, 07:57 PM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
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thanks, clausxpf. I will get back to you on this.
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Old Sep 15, 2012, 08:01 PM
deltas are cool
AIR SALLY's Avatar
Tehachapi ,CA.
Joined Apr 2006
20,409 Posts
yep i agree that is just about like the full scale jets inlet duct ....it allows for a just about full scale cockpit or a place to put the batts so you dont need the special packs the bvm furys/F-86 need to use.Good one Claus ...you are a master designer
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Old Sep 15, 2012, 08:40 PM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
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Room for the batteries will not be a problem. The paper tube is 3.5" dia, and the "batteries" boxes, are the same size as Tunigy Nano-tech 5000mah 35/70C's. The lines drawn at the end of boxes, indicate where the nanos would end.

My intake should be closer to 3" dia, so that's another 1/2" in width I gain.
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Old Sep 15, 2012, 11:41 PM
deltas are cool
AIR SALLY's Avatar
Tehachapi ,CA.
Joined Apr 2006
20,409 Posts
well then you might get by with a straight duct unless you want to do a full cockpit.
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Old Sep 16, 2012, 12:08 PM
Claus at Area 52
clausxpf's Avatar
copenhagen Denmark
Joined May 2002
2,528 Posts
I was not totally satisfied by the first nose..

when you get to understand the lines hidden in things it works better.
and by coincident I had a Klaus Scharnhorst wm 600 but 75 mm diameter and the new drawing I did today it happened to be 72 mm dia. at the fan . I will make one for myself.
and just enlarge the drawings to your scale.
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Old Sep 16, 2012, 12:21 PM
Do it Right, the first time!
CoolerByTheLake's Avatar
United States, MN, Hermantown
Joined Dec 2008
4,945 Posts
Thanks, It's really looking good! It will be a most unique intake!

I guess mine turned out to be a little more oval.
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Last edited by CoolerByTheLake; Sep 16, 2012 at 12:31 PM.
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