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Old Aug 07, 2012, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Aros View Post
It's a great scale-looking and performing foam glider for the price. Thermals should not be a problem.
Aros, when you overstressed that wing, what broke? I understand there is carbon in the wings and a metal joiner.... I think. What gave out?

And something else I wanted to ask, of anyone, what are those winglets? Are they just molded foam or are they plastic pieces added to the wing tips? They look like prime candidates for damage due to handling.

Thanks for all the info up front folks. I might go for one of these.

Gord
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Old Aug 07, 2012, 06:25 PM
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Both rods were bent pretty good...I believe the CF rod cracked and that was the loud sound I heard at the point of overstress. I still can't believe I was able to fly her down with the wings in a "V" shape.
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Old Aug 12, 2012, 08:06 AM
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Wing tips

The wing tips are foam with a molded plastic piece that slides into plastic pieces on the wing tips. I did add some clear tape on the inside and outside of my tips for some added strength. You could had some small carbon rod on the back side of these. You do have to watch them when you load and unload the wings but no problem with mine so far, just keep them in mind when handling the wings. They look great and may be adding to the great sound this glider has on a low passes. A nice wooshing sound like a moulded composite wing.
Some more flights yesterday and some good thermal flying. Now, this glider is not a built up super light slow flyer. It likes some speed but just flies great and has plenty of power.

Stringfly <>+++++
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Old Aug 21, 2012, 12:20 AM
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Hi guys;
I've got one of these ASW28's in my sights but needing a little help with the cost. Anyone know any coupon codes in effect at BH at present? Seems there's almost always one going on but dang if I can find anything!
Mucho thanks!
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Old Aug 21, 2012, 01:48 AM
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As long as I'm joining the forum & asking for assistance, I might as well give something back, eh?
Foam repairs w/hot water, ie the process known as Elapor Soup:
• First step is toss a few spoons (metal ones you eat with) in the freezer. You'll see why later.
• Near to but not quite boiling water is the first ingredient. Heat 'til the tiny bubbles start to rise & remove it - by time you get to application time it will have cooled slightly & you'll be good to go.
• The process on all the foams I've worked with (EPO & EPP; "Z-Foam" practically the same, & of course, Elapor which is reportedly just a brand adoption of EPO) tends to draw down the membrane that connects the foam's 'bead' cells, leaviing them raised & producing an effect I call 'gatoring'. Once you see it the name rings -- it looks like alligator skin.
• Immerse the damaged foam in the hot water if possible, until you see the damage starting to straighten itself a bit, else hold it over the hot water while you dip water with a measuring cup or such, & pour cup after cup over the damage for same effect. The goal is to soften the foam throughout its thickness - and the 'air' inside starts expanding.
• As soon as you stop pouring or dunking, grab one of the COLD spoons & use it rounded-side-down to iron down the raised beading. As the spoon warms, grab another cold one & keep going until the foam's looking decent again. It's somewhat amazing how effective the cold-spoon treatment is....and it's the part of the process most don't know to do.

Two final notes. One treatment might not get the foam fully restored, especially if the crash was severe & resulted in folding. Simple answer - repeat the treatment. And again if needed. And finally, realize you won't be able to get the finish completely restored to pristine condition - but you can come pretty darn close and for sure, make 'er fly again!

Hope that's helpful for some;
Enjoy the soup - and long live the foamy!

[Addendum]: The winglets (tips) for this ASW28 can be bought as spare parts for only $4 bux. http://www.pw-rc.com/product_info.ph...vir9ive0e0t830 & possibly other places but din't see 'em at Banana. Just so ya know!
So there, that's 2....Ya'll owe me one.
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Old Aug 22, 2012, 03:28 PM
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Jeez!...jeez jeez eez eez. Was it sump'n I said? said...said...said...aid...aid????

*crickets*
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Old Aug 22, 2012, 03:31 PM
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Sorry Star...That foam fix is fantastic! Thanks for that. Sorry, I don't know about any specific codes at BH right now...It's a great sailplane for the price point though for sure.
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 09:34 AM
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Well awrighty then!
Went to BH to order my 28 &....just like my luck, the August Coupon has expired (so they said). Really disappointed here....dunno what calendar they're on but, 1) it's still August here, & 2) they were still showing the code on their banner ad!

Kind've ticked at 'em at the moment.
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 11:22 AM
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That's a mighty large club membership you've joined.
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 12:55 PM
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Yeahhhh. It's still August for most everybody that I know. Non-members too.
'Cept Pete's gang.
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 01:09 PM
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I've been close to buying from BH a couple times and then get scared off by something or it goes out of stock; never to return. It sometimes seems like they are only in it for the free planes. Still, the FMS foamies are very tempting and, since I have a 2meter ASW-28, the ASK-23 is on my wish list. One would think that other vendors would carry them. A place with a good reputation for customer service should be able to sell a ton of them even if they price them a little higher.
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 01:54 PM
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Did I clue you before about you should read up on the short ASK23 thread & see what they have to say about it first? Good buddy of mine has one, & he ain't too thrilled.

Came to ask a quick question. I'm buying some material to make wing bags. Those upturned winglets on the 28? I know they're separate pieces but, are they easily detachable for transport? Methinks wouldn't last long in a bag so, need to plan accordingly.

Thanx!
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 02:37 PM
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Yep. I've read about the problems with the ASK. I might get one if I feel like a challenge. One of the mods I would make out of the box is stiffening up the control surfaces and, since it's applicable to any foamy, I'll give a brief run down.

On my 2 meter ASW the ailerons barely moved at the tip. Since the part that needs to move most quickly is the tip? Lousy lateral performance and vicious tip stalls. What happens is that inside portion of the aileron has to move so much that it will stall the wing no matter which way one is turning. It actually ended up easy to remedy and, luckily, the ST ASW-28 is light enough that it recovered well enough that I survived.

I used a product called Sky-Loft. It's a nylon fabric about the same weight as silk of comparable strength and works like very light fiberglass. Silk or fiberglass would work just fine but I had it on hand. I just sanded down the ailerons a tiny bit, mostly for good adhesion, and laid it on with epoxy. Just doing the bottom was good and adding it to the top makes it so that I can, barely, manage a very slow roll. I could get even better if it wasn't for their goofy internal control horns.

If I had not been able to make them stiff enough to fly I would have gone to 1/32" plywood sheeting or just cut off the old ones and build some up along with moving the servos out to the wing. I have yet to see a foamy that wouldn't benefit from stiffer control surfaces and I have a sneaky feeling that many cases of erratic control response and/or involuntary departures can be attributed to flexing ailerons or even an elevator.

The FMS ASW-28 gets a lot of good reviews but I bet "glass" ailerons would improve it and, should I go that route, I have a feeling it would make a difference on the ASK-23 as well. If not? I just "glass" the whole thing, add flaps, and fly it like a warmliner! It would be a winter project anyway.

Cheers!
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 09:45 PM
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Hey - small world! I'm having the exact same problems with a warmliner (ST Blaze). At higher speeds, it's like you lose radio contact with the plane. All you can do is slow it down then turn it. Several other owners are experiencing the problem too.

I'm one who thinks before you try to solve a problem, ya gotta know what the real problem is. For final proof I wound up mounting 3 keycams - one pointing at each aileron & the other back at the V-Tail - & sent 'em up for an 'FPV' test flight. They showed first, the servos were doing their job - dispeling one theory, but also that the Ails were just laying down in the wind. Effect & cause!

To remedy, I'm looking to stiffen them too. My first thought was to 'plank' them with thin balsa just as you mention, but that presented some problems as this wing is little more than a knife blade & the Ails of course even thinner so, I was having 2d thoughts about getting things too thick back there.

I presented the problem on the Builder's Board here in RCG, & a fellow who's been doing this many years suggested an alternative method - to 'skin' them with, of all things, newsprint. Just think of the same process as used with the silkspan (which I haven't got any of) and polycrylic. He says it'll stiffen the flaps up very well. The downside of this is it leaves a comparitively heavy end product. Another builder suggested a thinner newsprint equivalent - phone book paper. Long story short, that's how I'm going.

Suggestion - as was suggested to me - grab yourself some newsprint & try it on some scrap foam. To save some typing here, here's a link to his description of the process: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...2&postcount=21 along with my request -- you're of course able to read the surrounding posts also - including the follow-ups if you like.

I posted up private videos of the test flight - I'll provide links if you'd like to view 'em. Come to think of it, IIRC I posted them in that thread. ........Just checked - yep....post #22. I'll also tack on a cap view of one aileron in 'fail' mode. Note the inboard aileron tip well above the air dam, & the outboard tip that's barely over mid-point....also the bulged-up TE where the servo's pulling up on it.

It def needs a shot of Viagra!


I'm also weighing going one step farther, & extending the surfaces a bit. My main concern there is, how durable the overhang will be -- it'll be only paper & 'crylic & I don't know how well that'll hold up in the long term. I can always trim it off, at least, but I'm thinking about 'things' before I commit. There's one other element in the works also - that new stuff called "New Stuff" (weren't ready for that one, was ya? *LOL*) I've got some in the 5-mil, pondering its application also. *sigh* Never enough hours in the day!

283517
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Old Aug 23, 2012, 09:59 PM
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Just about anything that can soak up some glue should help. You might want to look into some Skyloft for future projects. I bought mine many years ago and use it for all sorts of stuff. I saw it advertised somewhere and it's still only around $5.00 for 3 square meters. I still have a lifetime supply. It takes some learning to get the trick for large surfaces but it's better over open structures and it's awesome for little jobs like ailerons or even adding just a little insurance to a firewall or landing gear mount. I even use little chunks with CA to stick rubber bands to the fuse for holding batteries. I haven't been looking for it but here's the link to the Dave Brown site.

Cheers!


http://www.dbproducts.com/store/skyl.htm
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