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Old Mar 18, 2012, 03:06 PM
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Setuping my new Hybrid-DL 1.5M - first flight was a success!

Hi guys,

I purchased the Hybrid-DL 1.5M from Arthobby, it should arrive in the next 3 days.
Here is the setup:
HS-55 for rudder and elev.
HS-45HB for Aileron.
reciever:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...Receiver_.html
Battery: I ordered from cheapbatterypacks.com - a MiMH 400 mah double stick shape.

My total weight acording to this setup is 280~grams or 10oz~ .

Anything else you think I should get?


Daniel.
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Old Mar 29, 2012, 12:29 PM
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Bunch of guys recommended me to use pull-pull setup or carbon posh rods for the elevator and rudder, instead of the steel one's that come with this kit, to save weight and the need for extra balancing weight at the nose.

I have never used pull-pull setup before or carbon rods.

Your opinion?
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 09:33 AM
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somebody has any suggestion?
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 09:54 AM
I have a DLG problem...
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Joined Aug 2011
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I don't know about a pull-pull setup, they can be a little finicky to tune from my understanding.
For weight saving I would suggest either carbon push-rods as you mention, or the pull/spring method. (a torsion spring slipped into the hinge-line of the rudder and elevator, a single string for each hooked to servos pulling against the spring tension for control).
I don't know anything abou the hybrid DL, but it appears to have balsa tails which should work fine with any of the above methods.

Of course, you can always weight the steel pushrods and see how much weight you could hope to save - and/or how much nose weight would be gained/lost for correct CG. It may not make a big difference.
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 12:25 PM
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I built one of these for a friend last year.

Firstly, the kit is pretty heavy by modern standards so really try to add as little as possible with glue and what not. The stock rods are heavy, but with a NIMH battery in the nose it should balance fine if you keep things as forward as you can fit them. Yes the rods are heavy and I would not blame anyone for replacing them. The balsa tails are where the real weight is though.

Wing wise, The wood skin is durable, but the throwing wing tip needs a lot of help. We built it "by the book" and ripped the blade/tip off by the fifth launch. You need to link the blade to the wing skin to spread the load. We ended up using a 1 inch strip of kevlar 7 inches long wrapped around the wingtip and installed the blade through that. Not too pretty, but has been holding so far. Three ounce glass might work too if you make the strip wider and add a second layer right around the blade.

I also substituted Minwax polycrilic for the Dreft spray coating that's suggested. I did that because I could control the coverage better and also thin the polycrilic with water to keep the weight down. A LOT less sanding is needed too.

Ailerons on this kit are also a point of contention for me. They have to be cut free when you get the kit and it's really easy to make things ugly because of the force needed to cut through the wood. If I were to have a do-over on the kit I would build it as a two channel plane.
My reasoning is that it's too heavy to be a comp plane any way and adding the two wing servos only makes it heavier. The plane launches like a pig too....so in my opinion the two channel will be better for over-all performance. Launch will be about the same either way, but saving the weight of the wing servos, wiring, and hinge tape will make a huge difference in the glide performance. The wing will also be more efficient without the hinge gap sucking air.

You can always go back and add the ailerons too if you want to.

SO that's my 50 cents on the subject.....don't spend it all in one place
Nate
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 12:56 PM
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Hi Nathan,


it sound that you really covered all the big issues of this kit, thank you for that I will keep in mind the thing you said.

How about that:
In my workplace we have got a 61cm by 50cm CNC laser machine which we use to make art works with wood and other stuff.

What do you think about cutting the ailerons in the CNC laser ?
I think it could be a lot easier and accurate.

Another thought using the CNC laser,
maybe I can make some rounded holes in the balsa rudder and elevator and cover it with somthing to make it lighter?

Daniel.
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 01:37 PM
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Well isn't that a nice tool to have laying around!?

Laser cutting the ailerons is an interesting idea. I don't know much about laser cutting, but here is what I can guess might be an issue.. The wood skin , foam, and the extra wood that is in the center, have different temp ranges...maybe an issue? or maybe not? You will know better than me about how the laser would react to that.

HOWEVER I still firmly believe that saving the weight by skipping the ailerons is going to give better performance.

Holes in the rudder and elevator is a grand idea.
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 01:39 PM
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This is a good light covering material, it's even on sale right now

http://www.mountainmodels.com/produc...roducts_id=315
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 01:56 PM
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We cut a lot of high materials with no problems at all, and I dont think there is a problem the different temp ranges.

Tell me, the idea of making the cutting for the ailerons across the balsa block is for mounting the hinges in the exposed block?
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Old Mar 30, 2012, 02:35 PM
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Actually it's all about stiffness and strength in the aileron and hinge area. The idea is to split the wood, half in the wing, half in the aileron.

I think a tape hinge is the way to go, if you use CA hinges(or other), you will still need to seal the gap with tape to minimize drag; so since you will use tape anyway, it might as well do both jobs. Tape is probably lighter too. Find some 3/4 - 1 inch wide scotch tape (the clear all-purpose stuff) and use that..its half the weight of Blendurm or packing tape.
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Old Mar 31, 2012, 05:25 AM
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few years ago I built ZAGI wing with a tape hinges with this stuff

Is that what you mean?

If so, how do I do it proparly?, in the ZAGI I just put it approximately in the center between the ailerons and the wing - is that the way to go?
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Old Mar 31, 2012, 07:03 AM
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That kind of tape is fairly heavy, especially given the length of our ailerons.

This is where it's at...
http://www.scotchbrand.com/wps/porta...gl5D5RWJ8TCBbl

And yes, just like your Zaggy....but then also apply 2 inch pieces to each end on the opposite side too. You fold the hinge/aileron back all the way till it touches the wing.... then apply the short pieces on the hinge groove area. Make sure the short pieces make sticky to sticky contact with the hinge tape. This will prevent the ends from coming loose over time.

I know I've seen a diagram of this somewhere on this forum....I don't have time to dig it up, hopefully someone else can post it
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Old Mar 31, 2012, 09:05 AM
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United States, DE, Hockessin
Joined Apr 2006
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Hi Daniel,

I built a Hybrid DLG and used pull-pull on it. If you do go pull-pull you're going to need a better rudder servo (you should think of using better fuselage servos anyway). The way I set up my p-p was to run the string (50 lb braided Spectra fishing line) through the servo arms and then warped it around the servo arm screw and tightened. This setup lasted for years and never needed any adjustment but you'll need a beefier servo to make it work. I used JR 241s in the fuse of my Hybrid and I forget what was in the wings.

For my flaperons I think I used regular aileron hinge tape. It was a bit stiff and heavy but it never split. I think Scotch tape is too weak for this model. Cut out the flaperons so you can hinge them at the bottom. You'll need that to get enough flap for landing and still have plenty of up aileron. The ailerons will warp but a little heat from a heat gun and some twisting will keep them straight.

The pod on that plane is a bit weak so when you cut the hole in the wing saddle area, to run your flaperon wires, keep it small. I got cracking around the hole I cut in the wing saddle and had to reinforce the area with carbon fiber. Not pretty but strong.

Don't use too much water based acrylic on the wings. You'll be tempted but don't do it. Just a couple of LIGHT MIST coats with light sanding in between. You're just trying to make the wing a little water resistant, not submersible to 100 feet. If the wing looks like a piece of fine furniture you've gone too far. If you start thinking, I'll just do one more coat, STOP.

Do a search on the Hand Launched forum for the AH Hybrid. There is a lot of info on this plane.

Mine came out to be 13 ounces. If you can build one at 10 ounces I'll come to your house and shake your hand!

Have fun,

Eric
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Old Mar 31, 2012, 11:39 AM
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Thank you Nathan and Eric!

I am guessing that when I will get the kit I will understand all the thing you said.

Eric,
when you said that I should use storng servo if I'm going with the P-P system,
did you mean stronger than the HS-55 I got?

Also,
you said to cut out the flaperons so I can hinge them at the bottom -
I did not get what you mean?

About the painting job you talked about, I got an airbeush at my workplace (my workplace is coming pretty handy AH?!), we are using acrylic.
If Ill just make few stripes on the buttom of the wing (like two on each wing), it will be fine?

Nathan,
Did you mean like that:
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Old Mar 31, 2012, 01:11 PM
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Joined Apr 2006
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Hi Daniel,

Those HS55s are pretty wimpy. For p-p setup you'll need something stronger and also a servo that centers more accurately. And, you probably want a servo with a bigger screw for the servo arm since you'll be wrapping your string around it. Of course, you can use the 55s and they will probably be fine, but a bit marginal. Nothing says you need to do a p-p set up, the supplied pushrods will work fine but will probably add 1/3 ounce to the finished weight by the time you get done balancing the tail weight with nose weight. OTHO, a better servo will be heavier too. So pretty much the same.

For hinging the flaperon on the bottom you will want the hinge tape on the bottom of the wing. The bevel, which gives the flaperon room to move in the opposite direct, would go on the top. Doing this will allow you to get more movement downward and increase the amount of flaps you have available. I think the AH directions tell you to hinge the flaperons on the top of the wing (IMHO, you should do the opposite).

Stripes are good but remember that by the time you put enough paint on the wing so it looks great it'll be too heavy. Think light coats. Remember that you are trying to save grams so you can eventually save an ounce. Stripes are optimistic, they tell the world that you fly so high you need help to see the plane!

Eric
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